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mmike
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 412
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 Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: JA's ability on Draft Day 2002 to present |
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After watching the Bear Draft this year and reading the discussions there seams to be a wide variety of opinions. Since JA came on before the 2001 season, the first draft that he ran would be 2002. Granted the last 2 draft classes are up in the air.
There are 27 player from Ja's Draft on the roster. You could say that Brown ,Tillman, Briggs, Harris and Vasher are very good football players. out of these players only Harris is a 1st or 2nd round pick. the rest of the players are 3 round or later. Although the roster is one of the youngest in the nfl, the Bears have been very sucessfull in filling many holes with free agents,Tait Miller, Garza, Brown,St,Clair,MussieM,Clark, BJohnson,TJ, Ogun, Hillenmeyer,Boone,Idonije. The obvious is that JA has been decent at best at drafting players. He has been much better at FA. |
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Midway Monster
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 547
Location: Wisconsin
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mmike
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 412
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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| MM, I'd like to get everyone's take on the Draft alone, because that is the Backbone of every team. Everyone knows that 2 or3 drafts in a row sets a team back many years. I've seen JA cover his draft failures by spend Big $$$ on Free agents. |
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Bear_Down_CA
Joined: 18 Mar 2005
Posts: 1023
Location: Stanton, CA
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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| The Bears have more starters on their roster that they drafted since 2000 (13) than any other team in the NFC North. IIRC, they're in the top 6 or so in the NFL. |
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mmike
Joined: 27 Feb 2006
Posts: 412
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 2:30 pm Post subject: |
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| Bear Down, That is a decent conparison. I wonder how the Seahawks.Panthers, Steelers, Colts, Pats compare. these are the best drafting teams, they draft both Off. and Def. playmakers. |
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O-Gun93
Joined: 26 Feb 2005
Posts: 167
Location: Chicago
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 7:48 pm Post subject: Re: JA's ability on Draft Day 2002 to present |
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| mmike wrote: | After watching the Bear Draft this year and reading the discussions there seams to be a wide variety of opinions. Since JA came on before the 2001 season, the first draft that he ran would be 2002. Granted the last 2 draft classes are up in the air.
There are 27 player from Ja's Draft on the roster. You could say that Brown ,Tillman, Briggs, Harris and Vasher are very good football players. out of these players only Harris is a 1st or 2nd round pick. the rest of the players are 3 round or later. Although the roster is one of the youngest in the nfl, the Bears have been very sucessfull in filling many holes with free agents,Tait Miller, Garza, Brown,St,Clair,MussieM,Clark, BJohnson,TJ, Ogun, Hillenmeyer,Boone,Idonije. The obvious is that JA has been decent at best at drafting players. He has been much better at FA. |
Actually, Tillman was taken in round 2 after Boss Bailey.
Truthfully, JA, as we all know, has done a decent job in the later rounds on D, but has really failed to unearth any offense. So until he finds some offensive weapons beyond Jones, I don't think he has done enough.
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bringbackditka
Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 401
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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I posted this in the following thread on Day 2 of the draft. I'm reposting here because I think it's appropriate to this discussion.
http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=63196&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=30
Let's take a look at all of JA's picks and let time be the judge -
JA's had 35 picks sop far as GM (not counting this yar)
By my ratings, there are:
11 Starters
10 Backups
3 Busts (1st 3 rounds qualify)
14 Picks that are gone (probably out of the league)
Take a look at the picks:
2002
1 29 Marc Colombo T Boston College - BUST
3 72 Roosevelt Williams CB Tuskegee - BUST
3 93 Terrence Metcalf G Mississippi - STARTER
4 104 Alex Brown DE Florida - STARTER
5 140 Bobby Gray SS Louisiana Tech - DEPTH (INJURED)
5 165 Bryan Knight OLB Pittsburgh - GONE
6 199 Adrian Peterson RB Georgia Southern - DEPTH
6 203 Jamin Elliott WR Delaware - GONE
6 210 Bryan Fletcher TE UCLA - GONE
2003
1 14 Michael Haynes DE Penn State - BUST
1 22 Rex Grossman QB Florida - STARTER
2 35 Charles Tillman CB Louisiana-Lafayette - STARTER
3 68 Lance Briggs OLB Arizona - STARTER
4 100 Todd Johnson FS Florida - DEPTH
4 116 Ian Scott NT Florida - STARTER
5 139 Bobby Wade WR Arizona - GONE
5 143 Justin Gage WR Missouri - DEPTH ? (Maybe)
5 171 Tron LaFavor DT Florida - GONE
6 191 Joe Odom OLB Purdue - SHOULD BE GONE
6 206 Brock Forsey RB Boise State - GONE
7 261 Bryan Anderson G Pittsburgh - GONE
2004
1 14 Tommie Harris DT Oklahoma - STARTER
2 47 Tank Johnson DT Washington - DEPTH
3 78 Bernard Berrian WR Fresno State - STARTER/DEPTH
4 110 Nathan Vasher CB Texas - STARTER
4 112 Leon Joe OLB Maryland - DEPTH
5 147 Claude Harriott DE Pittsburgh - GONE
5 148 Craig Krenzel QB Ohio State - GONE
7 215 Alfonso Marshall DB Miami - GONE (almost)
2005
1 4 Cedric Benson RB Texas - STARTER/DEPTH
2 39 Mark Bradley WR Oklahoma - STARTER/DEPTH
4 106 Kyle Orton QB Purdue - DEPTH
5 140 Airese Currie WR Clemson - DEPTH
6 181 Chris Harris FS Louisiana-Monroe - STARTER
7 220 Rod Wilson LB South Carolina - DEPTH (Maybe - Injured)
That's 60% of his picks that stay on the roster. 21 players in 4 years means that he's getting 5 players per year to stick with the team. Sure, last year's players may be hard to judge already, and anyone can dispute what I'm calling these guys, but the team has been built through the draft, and that's the financially smart way to do it. Let's give it time. |
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GRRLacher
Joined: 07 Mar 2005
Posts: 20642
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent post bringbackditka, I missed this one the first time around. For as much as we all like to bash JA when given the opportunity we can't ignore the fact that he does better than most GMs in the league with his drafting.
A couple things I would change on the list are:
1 29 Marc Colombo T Boston College - BUST
His career ended because of injury, not because he sucked (well, not REALLY sucked anyways). I feel that he could have been a solid starter if not for the injury bug.
1 14 Michael Haynes DE Penn State - BUST
A bust so far, absolutely. But let's see what he does at DT before writing him off. Sometimes a second chance and a new position can be the right medicine. I can hope anyways.
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Peanut3
Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 1065
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| Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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has anyone else realized that we passed on clinton portis to take marc columbo  |
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agent50
Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 91
Location: Illinois
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 11:36 am Post subject: |
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 9:21 pm Post subject:
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has anyone else realized that we passed on clinton portis to take marc columbo
in comparision that makes Columbo a def. bust. sorry
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bearsaddict
Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 3544
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 11:52 am Post subject: |
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The interesting thing about Angelo is that he has done quite a good job of getting talent in the latter part of the draft. The strange thing is that he just plain sucks when it comes to the first round. I know a few of you guys have kinda said that already. It is baffling though. He really does do a good job in the later draft rounds. Who else got a 6th round pick in last years draft that started all but 1 game, and played well enough to solidify a starting job with their team? I just don't understand his horrible decision making early on in drafts. I would also say that the first couple of rounds are the most important(obviously) and not doing well in those rounds hurts us a bit more than finding those diamonds in the rough that really help us.
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redwing5
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 552
Location: Downers Grove, IL
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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do you guys realize how many people passed on Marino...? Does tht make every othr player bust??? Honestly guys u can look at what other teams did...
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NKbearsNK
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 1350
Location: Tuscon, AZ
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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| agent50 wrote: | Posted: Mon May 15, 2006 9:21 pm Post subject:
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has anyone else realized that we passed on clinton portis to take marc columbo
in comparision that makes Columbo a def. bust. sorry |
Thats a sorry quote. Columbo suffered a horrific knee injury, rehab for a year(which anyone who has suffered a knee injury knows thats not easy) then comes back and busts his a@# to make the team. It did not work out but there is no logical way to call him or any player who had this happen a bust. Be real.
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bringbackditka
Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 401
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| NKbearsNK wrote: | | It did not work out but there is no logical way to call him or any player who had this happen a bust. Be real. |
| Grrlacher wrote: | 1 29 Marc Colombo T Boston College - BUST
His career ended because of injury, not because he sucked (well, not REALLY sucked anyways). I feel that he could have been a solid starter if not for the injury bug. |
Guys,
I understand the injury prevented us from seeing whether or not Columbo would have been a great player. The simple criteria I used was:
1. Starter
2. Depth
3. Gone (released, out of football, etc., day 2 pick)
4. Bust (same as Gone but with a Day 1 pick)
To me, a day 1 pick should be a starter or at a minimum a depth chart member. A day 2 pick is more a bonus if they stick with the team. |
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NKbearsNK
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 1350
Location: Tuscon, AZ
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| Posted: Tue May 16, 2006 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| bringbackditka wrote: | | NKbearsNK wrote: | | It did not work out but there is no logical way to call him or any player who had this happen a bust. Be real. |
| Grrlacher wrote: | 1 29 Marc Colombo T Boston College - BUST
His career ended because of injury, not because he sucked (well, not REALLY sucked anyways). I feel that he could have been a solid starter if not for the injury bug. |
Guys,
I understand the injury prevented us from seeing whether or not Columbo would have been a great player. The simple criteria I used was:
1. Starter
2. Depth
3. Gone (released, out of football, etc., day 2 pick)
4. Bust (same as Gone but with a Day 1 pick)
To me, a day 1 pick should be a starter or at a minimum a depth chart member. A day 2 pick is more a bonus if they stick with the team. |
I dont have a problem with your criteria. It's the goofballs that compare the pick with the guys we passed on. Colombo was the #2 tackle in the draft. He was suppose to be a guy to build the line around, and for the first months, he looked like he could develop into that. But to call him a bust because of a freak injury, is crap. Who cares that we passed on Portis or whoever. If he would have been a cornerstone tackle, It would not have been discussed.
I would list him on your criteria as Gone. He was released and is out of football. For this case, make the exception.
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