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Broncos extend GM John Elway
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AkronsWitness


Joined: 17 Jul 2015
Posts: 1662
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OleXmad wrote:
AkronsWitness wrote:
OleXmad wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
TheKillerNacho wrote:
I'm not convinced Elway is some kind of great GM, but wise move to lock him up.


Based on what? Genuinely curious because the vast consensus is that he's one of the better GMs in the game.


Look at his drafting history the past 5 seasons and you'll figure out why. He's had some hits but more often than not....Misses.


2011
Von Miller - All Pro.
Orlando Franklin - Solid Guard but gone.
Julius Thomas - Solid TE but Gone.
Virgil Green - Backup TE.
Chris Harris Jr. - Top 10 CB.

2012
Derek Wolfe - Pro Bowler.
Malik Jackson - Pro Bowler but gone.
Danny Trevathan - Pro Bowler but gone.
Brandon Marshall - Still with the team.

2013
CJ Anderson - Injury prone but solid RB I guess.

2014
Bradley Roby - Solid CB.
Matt Paradis
- Solid Starter.
Michael Schofield - Sucks? Too early to tell.

2015
Shane Ray - Solid Pick.
Max Garcia
- We'll see.
Jeff Heuerman - We'll see.
Trevor Siemian - Solid QB.

2016
Paxton Lynch
Justin Simmons
Devonte Booker
Andy Janovich

Riley Dixon

I see a lot of starters, good rotational guys, All-Pros and some pro bowlers in there. I dont know what your talking about that he cant draft. Outside of 2013, he had gotten multiple players who have started or received significant playing time and made plays.


I didn't say he can't draft but he's obviously had some misses. Not counting the 2016 or 2017 classes since it's too early, He's made up for the missed draft picks by picking up studs in FA though.


I mean, is every player in every draft rounds 1-7 supposed to hit? Usually he finds 3-4 starters/contributors in every draft out of 6-8 picks.

The only thing bad I will say about his drafting is he doesnt seem very good at offensive linemen evaluation. Outside of that he works magic and I dont think there is a better GM in the league at drafting rounds 4-7 on the 3rd day.

Julius Thomas
Chris Harris Jr.
Malik Jackson
CJ Anderson
Danny Trevathan
Brandon Marshall
Matt Paradis
Andy Janovich

were all 4-7 round day 3 picks. Find me another GM who has gotten that much talent in the late rounds of the draft in a 5 year time period.
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OleXmad


Joined: 09 Jan 2017
Posts: 601
Location: Baltimore, Maryland.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AkronsWitness wrote:
OleXmad wrote:
AkronsWitness wrote:
OleXmad wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
TheKillerNacho wrote:
I'm not convinced Elway is some kind of great GM, but wise move to lock him up.


Based on what? Genuinely curious because the vast consensus is that he's one of the better GMs in the game.


Look at his drafting history the past 5 seasons and you'll figure out why. He's had some hits but more often than not....Misses.


2011
Von Miller - All Pro.
Orlando Franklin - Solid Guard but gone.
Julius Thomas - Solid TE but Gone.
Virgil Green - Backup TE.
Chris Harris Jr. - Top 10 CB.

2012
Derek Wolfe - Pro Bowler.
Malik Jackson - Pro Bowler but gone.
Danny Trevathan - Pro Bowler but gone.
Brandon Marshall - Still with the team.

2013
CJ Anderson - Injury prone but solid RB I guess.

2014
Bradley Roby - Solid CB.
Matt Paradis
- Solid Starter.
Michael Schofield - Sucks? Too early to tell.

2015
Shane Ray - Solid Pick.
Max Garcia
- We'll see.
Jeff Heuerman - We'll see.
Trevor Siemian - Solid QB.

2016
Paxton Lynch
Justin Simmons
Devonte Booker
Andy Janovich

Riley Dixon

I see a lot of starters, good rotational guys, All-Pros and some pro bowlers in there. I dont know what your talking about that he cant draft. Outside of 2013, he had gotten multiple players who have started or received significant playing time and made plays.


I didn't say he can't draft but he's obviously had some misses. Not counting the 2016 or 2017 classes since it's too early, He's made up for the missed draft picks by picking up studs in FA though.


I mean, is every player in every draft rounds 1-7 supposed to hit? Usually he finds 3-4 starters/contributors in every draft out of 6-8 picks.

The only thing bad I will say about his drafting is he doesnt seem very good at offensive linemen evaluation. Outside of that he works magic and I dont think there is a better GM in the league at drafting rounds 4-7 on the 3rd day.

Julius Thomas
Chris Harris Jr.
Malik Jackson
CJ Anderson
Danny Trevathan
Brandon Marshall
Matt Paradis
Andy Janovich

were all 4-7 round day 3 picks. Find me another GM who has gotten that much talent in the late rounds of the draft in a 5 year time period.


I could but I'm lazy...so good luck finding that GM.
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3182
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calling Matt Paradis only solid who was graded as a top 2 starting center in the NFL last year is laughable.

Also saying Roby is just solid is laughable hed be a top 2 corner for 90 - 95% of the other teams.

I was the first to say Elway was overrated because he signed manning which a monkey could do. But, given what the Broncos have done with a terrible version of Peyton, and even finishing 9 and 7 with a rookie qb and poor oline. I think It's safe to say Elway has done more than just signing Peyton. All I heard for so long was denver is a 5-11 and 6-10 team without Peyton I no longer see that as being the case.
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"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."
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OleXmad


Joined: 09 Jan 2017
Posts: 601
Location: Baltimore, Maryland.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thebestever6 wrote:
Calling Matt Paradis only solid who was graded as a top 2 starting center in the NFL last year is laughable.

Also saying Roby is just solid is laughable hed be a top 2 corner for 90 - 95% of the other teams.

I was the first to say Elway was overrated because he signed manning which a monkey could do. But, given what the Broncos have done with a terrible version of Peyton, and even finishing 9 and 7 with a rookie qb and poor oline. I think It's safe to say Elway has done more than just signing Peyton. All I heard for so long was denver is a 5-11 and 6-10 team without Peyton I no longer see that as being the case.


Matt Paradis had two hip surgeries this offseason and probably won't be fully healthy. He's better than "solid" but he's not an elite/top 5 C to me.

Roby is the no.3 CB on the Broncos and has played well but until he's actually the no.2 CB for another team and doesn't have to face no.3 WRs on most of his snaps I'll say he's solid.
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Current owner of the Portland Horned Owls in the Bizzaro Dynasty League, I'm a Ravens fan and I regret every second of it.
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3182
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OleXmad wrote:
thebestever6 wrote:
Calling Matt Paradis only solid who was graded as a top 2 starting center in the NFL last year is laughable.

Also saying Roby is just solid is laughable hed be a top 2 corner for 90 - 95% of the other teams.

I was the first to say Elway was overrated because he signed manning which a monkey could do. But, given what the Broncos have done with a terrible version of Peyton, and even finishing 9 and 7 with a rookie qb and poor oline. I think It's safe to say Elway has done more than just signing Peyton. All I heard for so long was denver is a 5-11 and 6-10 team without Peyton I no longer see that as being the case.


Matt Paradis had two hip surgeries this offseason and probably won't be fully healthy. He's better than "solid" but he's not an elite/top 5 C to me.

Roby is the no.3 CB on the Broncos and has played well but until he's actually the no.2 CB for another team and doesn't have to face no.3 WRs on most of his snaps I'll say he's solid.


So he graded as a top 2 center on pff. Albeit while being injured. And you knock him after he had two hip surguries and is on his way to recover.
Other than draft position theres no reason he's not a top 5 center. And even if hes not top 5 he's top 10 no doubt. Which is also way better than solid.


And Roby faces the number 2 wr a lot with chris harris in th slot sometimes. I'll agree with you hes solid because I can't prove you wrong. But if you look at his stats and contributions that help Denver have an elite secondary. The return on his draft selection was better than solid.
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Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."
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OleXmad


Joined: 09 Jan 2017
Posts: 601
Location: Baltimore, Maryland.
PostPosted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thebestever6 wrote:
OleXmad wrote:
thebestever6 wrote:
Calling Matt Paradis only solid who was graded as a top 2 starting center in the NFL last year is laughable.

Also saying Roby is just solid is laughable hed be a top 2 corner for 90 - 95% of the other teams.

I was the first to say Elway was overrated because he signed manning which a monkey could do. But, given what the Broncos have done with a terrible version of Peyton, and even finishing 9 and 7 with a rookie qb and poor oline. I think It's safe to say Elway has done more than just signing Peyton. All I heard for so long was denver is a 5-11 and 6-10 team without Peyton I no longer see that as being the case.


Matt Paradis had two hip surgeries this offseason and probably won't be fully healthy. He's better than "solid" but he's not an elite/top 5 C to me.

Roby is the no.3 CB on the Broncos and has played well but until he's actually the no.2 CB for another team and doesn't have to face no.3 WRs on most of his snaps I'll say he's solid.


So he graded as a top 2 center on pff. Albeit while being injured. And you knock him after he had two hip surguries and is on his way to recover.
Other than draft position theres no reason he's not a top 5 center. And even if hes not top 5 he's top 10 no doubt. Which is also way better than solid.


And Roby faces the number 2 wr a lot with chris harris in th slot sometimes. I'll agree with you hes solid because I can't prove you wrong. But if you look at his stats and contributions that help Denver have an elite secondary. The return on his draft selection was better than solid.


PFF isn't exactly entirely reliable but it's a useful metric and again two hip surgeries is a lot to recover from. I'm not knocking him I'm knocking the fact he had two hip surgeries and that usually doesn't go well for players (See Mike Pouncey)

Getting a solid starter in the first round is expected, roby has worked out well and he's been a useful piece in denver no doubt but Harris+Talib are much better CBs.
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Current owner of the Portland Horned Owls in the Bizzaro Dynasty League, I'm a Ravens fan and I regret every second of it.
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Boltstrikes


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Joined: 15 Feb 2006
Posts: 7223
Location: LA MIRADA, CA
PostPosted: Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Huge non story. He's the best GM in the league not named Bill.
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