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Pff - Breeland top passer rtg as slot corner in NFL
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HTTRG3Dynasty


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Yes, it's very unlikely but I'm just saying there is that factor also. I was watching the NFL breakdown by Sam gold last night. I posted one in here of Breeland vs Brown and then the one of Norman vs Beckham in the 1st Giants game is in the NFC East thread and it's a little concerning with Norman's play/free lancing at times.

He lets WRs go uncovered a few times on go rites but once Roethlisberger didn't see it and threw a shorter pass and another time Baker got a sack on Eli. Once he went off his man to go after a shorter crossing route when he hit Sheppard up high and got the personal foul call, but when he did that his man ran wide open up the sidelines but Eli didn't see him. Then, on the pass he broke up and almost intercepted before the half, Beckham beat Norman to the inside but Eli threw it a half second late and allowed Norman to dice for it, knock it down and almost intercept it. That's 4 TDs he could have been responsible for in just 2 games.

If people haven't watched those two links I posted of the games they should. It's concerning.


It's really not. I've watched those videos already. I watch nearly all of Sam Gold's video's when they come out.

The only real concerning play from Norman was when he left that crossing route open to follow Beckham. You can't completely abandon your responsibility like that. The other plays were just him doing what he has always done, ever since he was on the Panthers. He anticipates routes, and he baits QBs. For example, that play against Beckham when he switched to inside leverage when he should have stayed outside, was him anticipating a slant based on the route concepts the Giants usually run, but this time they ran a tendency breaker, and he was caught out of position. The Antonio Brown go-route, where Brown had a step or two on him was not even close to a guaranteed TD. Norman trusts his recovery speed and he trusts his length once the ball is in the air, and for good reason, because both are pretty damn amazing. This leads to him anticipating routes and baiting the QB a lot. Sometimes it doesn't work out for him. Most times it does.


Anticipating routes:







Baiting QBs to throw over his head:









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HTTRG3Dynasty


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One thing I noticed is that Norman feels much more comfortable on the left side of the defense than he does the right. Probably because that is where he's played pretty much all his life. It seems like every play he gets beat happens when he lines up on the right side. Hopefully this is something he is working to improve this offseason, because the coaches have already said they will have him travel this season if necessary.
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Thaiphoon


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
I think it's a make or break year for Breeland as a Redskin, but here is a twist people might not be thinking about. Josh Norman could be cut after this season and we'd save $8 million if we released him.

If Breeland balls out and has a great season, it could make sense to cut Norman and re-sign Breeland - if their production/impact is similar - because Breeland should be cheaper than Norman and he's 4 years and 11 months younger than Norman.


Regardless of what Breeland does, in no world would I cut Norman for him.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clips from two years ago show what Norman did at times, his potential and how well he played on a top championship caliber defense which is all encouraging. He was great there, he's been great for us. I think his freelancing of missed assignments last year on top of all the penalties which were part of the reason we lost vs Cincy in London and New York in week 17 are still a little concerning. I love his edge/intensity, just like I've always loved DHall's edge/intensity but at times each took bad penalties and its cost our team. They just can't do that if the team is going to have a better season than they had last year. The redskins can't afford those types of blown assignments and bad penalties because we don't have that much room for error given our lack of an elite defense which could make up for those mistakes in other areas.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HTTRG3Dynasty wrote:
One thing I noticed is that Norman feels much more comfortable on the left side of the defense than he does the right. Probably because that is where he's played pretty much all his life. It seems like every play he gets beat happens when he lines up on the right side. Hopefully this is something he is working to improve this offseason, because the coaches have already said they will have him travel this season if necessary.
I definitely agree. I hope he's working on traveling to the slot as well - where he's rarely played in his career - because if he's going to travel against WRs like Beckham - who line up everywhere - he's going to have to be able to play in the slot also.
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TheGreeK1973


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

lavar703 wrote:
Unless Norman falls off a cliff, he isn't going anywhere. We just drafted Fuller and Moreau. Breeland is gone after this year no matter what. And we won't get a compensation pick because Bruce will sign some other teams back ups for starter money.


Yea I agree with this. Norman has to have a horrid year. Also lets not forget it seems he is becoming the leader of that Defense something we need. He played very well last year but it was his first year in a system that probably sucked. With the new DB coach from all reports saying he is a players coach I think we will see an all pro season from Norman.

My big hope to be honest is Fuller being totally healthy and proving his worth this season. Remember he had micro fracture surgery before entering the NFL so I honestly don't think he was 100%. Also I believe Dunbar takes another step so this could be very well Breeland's last year with us. why pay the big bucks if you have Dunbar and Fuller and the Moreau we just drafted in the wings.

I don't agree with you Lavar saying Bruce A will sign some high priced FA next year. Unless a "Norman" or a "DJax" kind of player gets cut why should he? He has not shown going after high priced FA lately except these two and both were totally worth it.
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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like others have stated, I find it very unlikely Breeland returns after this season. He is far too inconsistent to pay an expensive long term deal to. We obviously drafted his replacement in the past two drafts.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
Like others have stated, I find it very unlikely Breeland returns after this season. He is far too inconsistent to pay an expensive long term deal to. We MAY HAVE drafted his replacement in the past two drafts.
There, fixed it for you. We won't know until they play the games. Breeland could play even better this year, Moreau could struggle as a rookie and Fuller may not develop enough to where the coaches believe he could be a starter.
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MKnight82


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
Like others have stated, I find it very unlikely Breeland returns after this season. He is far too inconsistent to pay an expensive long term deal to. We MAY HAVE drafted his replacement in the past two drafts.
There, fixed it for you. We won't know until they play the games. Breeland could play even better this year, Moreau could struggle as a rookie and Fuller may not develop enough to where the coaches believe he could be a starter.
It doesn't matter if Breeland plays better this year. We can't afford to retain everyone. We spent two 3rd round picks on CBs for a reason. Those guys are going to need playing time.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MKnight82 wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
MKnight82 wrote:
Like others have stated, I find it very unlikely Breeland returns after this season. He is far too inconsistent to pay an expensive long term deal to. We MAY HAVE drafted his replacement in the past two drafts.
There, fixed it for you. We won't know until they play the games. Breeland could play even better this year, Moreau could struggle as a rookie and Fuller may not develop enough to where the coaches believe he could be a starter.
It doesn't matter if Breeland plays better this year. We can't afford to retain everyone. We spent two 3rd round picks on CBs for a reason. Those guys are going to need playing time.
It depends on what the cost of Breeland will be in free agency and the young corners will have to earn their playing time. My guess is that Fuller will earn it, I do expect him to be better than last year just for the simple fact that he'll have an offseason this year - he didn't last year because of his knee injury - and he'll have experience.

Moreau remains to be seen IMO. I think it's more likely his rookie season goes like Fuller's rather than Breeland's because Moreau will miss a lot - if not all - of the offseason.

I'm also not sure why we wouldn't be able to keep Breeland, stay under the cap and sign a few upgrades - as long as Bree doesn't get #1 $ - and I don't see that happening. Let's not forget we have a qb taking up $24 mil in cap space because we won't give him a long term deal which would lower his cap hit by $4 to 6 mil, Norman's cap # will be cheaper next year by $3 million, cheaper by $5.5 million in 2019 and $4.5 million in 2020.

On top of that, even if Hall makes the team this year he's a free agent after this year so that would be $3 million or whatever off the books for next year when Breeland is a free agent. Plus, Lauvao will be gone - and that's $5 million off the books - and the salary cap will go up by about $10 million as well.

If you add the $ saved by getting Kirk under contract long term, Hall not bring on the team in 2018 and the savings from Norman's cap hit next year vs this year that would probably equal the cap hit on an extension for Breeland which would be under $10 million.

In fact, I'm not sure why we couldn't get Breeland re-signed to a Morgan Moses type deal of around 5 years for $40 million with a $10 million signing bonus and $20 million guaranteed:

2018: $6 million
2019: $7 million
2020: $8 million
2021: $9 million
2022: $10 million
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