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The DB Depth Chart Discussion
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KG1187


Joined: 16 Jan 2013
Posts: 447
PostPosted: Fri May 12, 2017 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

G08 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
RunningVaccs wrote:
This amount of DBs seems to be ripe for intense competition, which should hopefulyl take what seems to be an average at best group and prod them to outperform. Best of a bad situation, although I think one of Pace's biggest failures is how little top end talent he brought in this FA season


I actually don't mind his free agent method, although it was frustrating in the moment.

You either end up with huge bargains (Freeman, Hicks, Sitton) or you end up with players you can easily cut.

It just requires your draft picks to be good.


Bingo. If any of our corners wind up being solid, then we hit and we didn't have to burn a draft pick. If not? Cut them and make it a focus on the next draft. I don't have a problem with it.


You also end up throwing away a lot of money with the bargain bin strategy.

Last year alone the Bears threw away almost 18 million dollars on Massie Royal, Miller and Porter.

Just saying you have to include the bad moves when evaluating Paces free agency's instead of cherry picking the good ones.
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AZBearsFan


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
Posts: 13179
PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KG1187 wrote:
G08 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
RunningVaccs wrote:
This amount of DBs seems to be ripe for intense competition, which should hopefulyl take what seems to be an average at best group and prod them to outperform. Best of a bad situation, although I think one of Pace's biggest failures is how little top end talent he brought in this FA season


I actually don't mind his free agent method, although it was frustrating in the moment.

You either end up with huge bargains (Freeman, Hicks, Sitton) or you end up with players you can easily cut.

It just requires your draft picks to be good.


Bingo. If any of our corners wind up being solid, then we hit and we didn't have to burn a draft pick. If not? Cut them and make it a focus on the next draft. I don't have a problem with it.


You also end up throwing away a lot of money with the bargain bin strategy.

Last year alone the Bears threw away almost 18 million dollars on Massie Royal, Miller and Porter.

Just saying you have to include the bad moves when evaluating Paces free agency's instead of cherry picking the good ones.


How many of these moves were "bad signings" when they happened though, those are the ones I criticize Pace for most. Nobody was mad when any of these moves were made. If guys underperform to expectations or get hurt once they're here I don't really put that on the GM as much as the player or the coaches. I do, however, put it on the GM if he doesn't then move on from the underperforming player. That hasn't really been an issue with Pace.

Porter got a low level starter contract extension after a solid previous year (having been brought in on a Cooper/Amukamara type of deal), didn't keep that pace, and now he's gone. Massie was adequate at RT for most of last year after a rough first few weeks, and was paid low to mid tier starting RT money for a FA on a 1 year guarantee. That's not a bad signing. It's just not a home run. Miller was at a 75-catch pace when he was lost for the season to injuries. At his $2.9M cap hit that was a bargain. The rub there was not having a more established veteran backup IMO, not keeping Miller. Royal when signed was exactly what we needed in the slot but then couldn't get out of the tub. Prior to his signing with us though he had only missed 1 game the previous two years with 15 TD in that span. Again, not a bad move - it just didn't work out.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Massie was not a bad move. You paid for a 6 million dollar tackle and you got a 6 million dollar tackle. Quality RTs make 10 million/year you can't always expect to hit an Akiem Hicks level home run.

Royal- bad signing

Miller-down right steal. The Bears pay him nothing and have gotten 2 solid years out of him.

Porter- good signing when they first signed him, but a bad extension.
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3-13 this season, 9-23 overall, 4-12 at home
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The strategy is fine you sign 10 guys for solid money.

You hope 2 are really good and out okay their deals (Hicks, Freeman)

You hope 4-5 live up to their moderate deals (Trevathan, Sitton)

You hope only 2-3 fail to live up to the moderate investment (Royal, Rolle)


Best case scenario you get a couple of stars on team friendly deals and a bunch of solid upgrades.

Worse case scenario you cut guys after 1 year.
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bkokot


Joined: 23 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2017 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pro Football Focus ✔ @PFF
Last year for the #Bears, undrafted rookie CB Cre'Von LeBlanc finished with the 2nd lowest passer rating when targeted among all rookie CBs.


I would not have guessed that... for those wondering, #1 was Jalen Ramsey.
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topwop1


Joined: 08 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bkokot wrote:
Pro Football Focus ✔ @PFF
Last year for the #Bears, undrafted rookie CB Cre'Von LeBlanc finished with the 2nd lowest passer rating when targeted among all rookie CBs.


I would not have guessed that... for those wondering, #1 was Jalen Ramsey.


I really like this kid man. I think he has big play ability on the back end. That much was shown last season when he took one to the house after picking off Stafford.

Also had one of the best plays in the preseason last year with a one handed INT.

I don't think the Bears are all that bad at CB as most people seem to think.
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Superman(DH23)


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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

^^^^^^^
Everyone in General seems to think the Bears have the 2nd or 3rd worst roster in the NFL. I too don't see it being that bad.
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G08


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Amukamara locks up DB1

I think DB2 is a fight between Cooper and Fuller

Le'Blanc and Callahan fight for the slot (I love me some Callahan but I think this coaching staff really wants to see Le'Blanc succeed).
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topwop1 wrote:
My point is you can find a franchise guy like [Derek] Carr in every draft


"I thought it was a stroke of genius. You give [Pace] an A++++ for the move to get Trubisky. That was magnificient." - Bill Polian
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Bearsfancro


Joined: 27 Oct 2016
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Superman(DH23) wrote:
^^^^^^^
Everyone in General seems to think the Bears have the 2nd or 3rd worst roster in the NFL. I too don't see it being that bad.

And when the Bears defeat the Falcons in Week 1, all NFL world will be surprised... Laughing Laughing How did that happened...
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Superman(DH23)


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 8:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bearsfancro wrote:
Superman(DH23) wrote:
^^^^^^^
Everyone in General seems to think the Bears have the 2nd or 3rd worst roster in the NFL. I too don't see it being that bad.

And when the Bears defeat the Falcons in Week 1, all NFL world will be surprised... Laughing Laughing How did that happened...
Slow down just a bit, I think we are probably a 6-9 win team, I don't think we are beating the best team in the NFC.
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Heinz D.


Joined: 26 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Superman(DH23) wrote:
Slow down just a bit, I think we are probably a 6-9 win team, I don't think we are beating the best team in the NFC.

Ehhh, you never know. Doubt Falcons win them all...Smile
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G08


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heinz D. wrote:
Superman(DH23) wrote:
Slow down just a bit, I think we are probably a 6-9 win team, I don't think we are beating the best team in the NFC.

Ehhh, you never know. Doubt Falcons win them all...Smile


I think that Falcons offense takes a step back this season.
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topwop1 wrote:
My point is you can find a franchise guy like [Derek] Carr in every draft


"I thought it was a stroke of genius. You give [Pace] an A++++ for the move to get Trubisky. That was magnificient." - Bill Polian
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TankWilliams


Joined: 11 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't even bother defending the Bears roster to people. Year after year they are always down on the Bears to be the worst team in the NFL, this has been the case since they lost the super bowl in 07. This is the first season where it may have been accurate. Once they start winning consistently again we will see the attitude on them change, but for some reason around here, the Bears are always one of the teams that everyone likes to [inappropriate/removed] on, don't know why.
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Heinz D.


Joined: 26 Apr 2017
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

G08 wrote:
I think that Falcons offense takes a step back this season.

You might be right about that. For one thing, I'm not sure I trust Sarkisian to be a quality NFL coordinator.
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AZBearsFan


Joined: 04 Feb 2006
Posts: 13179
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2017 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Heinz D. wrote:
G08 wrote:
I think that Falcons offense takes a step back this season.

You might be right about that. For one thing, I'm not sure I trust Sarkisian to be a quality NFL coordinator.

Week 1 they're either going to still be showing the effects of a team that blew a 28-3 third quarter lead in the Super Bowl, or they're going to come out like gang busters. I don't think there's an in between.
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