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2016 vs 2017 by Position Group: Arrow Up or Arrow Down?
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MantyWrestler


Joined: 03 Feb 2009
Posts: 775
Location: Manitowoc, WI
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 7:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralFC wrote:
TransientTexan wrote:

also need to consider that we were pretty lucky with OT health last yr, which may not be the case this yr, and we no longer have the Tretter safety net in the middle. How would the OL have looked last year when Linsley was hurt if we didn't have Tretter?


uh, well, not sure I agree with the premise of Tretter being the bedrock of our OL reliability/depth. Very solid, heady player but his health was a huge issue. It was actually Linsley who bailed us out in 2016, returning from a serious surgery to his hamstring, only to play top-10 caliber ball down the stretch. I was impressed with the way he seamlessly returned to action.

Either way, I get Tretter being a nice depth piece, but I would bet a good amount we can find his replacement in the next year or two.


Tretter's real value was that he was an above average backup at all 5 positions on the OL and good enough to be a starter at all 5 as well IMO. Not a pro bowler at all 5 but very competent.
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wgbeethree


Joined: 15 Dec 2009
Posts: 3945
Location: Denver, CO via Racine, Wisconsin
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pugger wrote:
MantyWrestler wrote:
wgbeethree wrote:
Pugger wrote:
wgbeethree wrote:
PackyAttacky wrote:
AlexGreen#20 wrote:


The RBs drafted are not Eddie Lacy even if you include a healthy chunk of Montgomery development in your analysis.

You have to have very high expectations for guys that haven't played much if you think they're going to replace the production from Peppers and Jones.


Eddie Lacy of 2015 or Eddie Lacy or 2016?

And what production from Jones? I hope to god there is someone of this team that can come up with a whopping one sack. Peppers probably not but last year was his worst year here.


Jones got a ton of hurries despite the low sack number and set the edge better than everyone but Perry.


But Jones drove me crazy. He was usually good for at least one personal foul penalty a game it seemed. I just don't think he is the smartest bulb in the knife drawer.


He actually had zero peronal fouls last year.

He did get called for six penalties last year (the same as Mike Daniels who nobody has an issue with) including one roughing the passer and two unnecessary roughnesses .


Aren't roughing the passer and unnecessary roughness personal fouls?


That's what I thought too... Think


Yeah. So... I was drunk.

Here's the link with the penalty stats.

http://www.footballdb.com/stats/penalties-player.html?tm=12
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TytybearsFan21 wrote:
Justo knows nothing about sportz

justo wrote:
I would be a terrible coach/anything.
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PackyAttacky


Joined: 12 Mar 2017
Posts: 208
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wgbeethree wrote:


He did get called for six penalties last year (the same as Mike Daniels who nobody has an issue with) including one roughing the passer and two unnecessary roughnesses .


If he played like Daniels then I am fine with it.
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spilltray


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 12051
Location: Green Bay, WI
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PackyAttacky wrote:
wgbeethree wrote:


He did get called for six penalties last year (the same as Mike Daniels who nobody has an issue with) including one roughing the passer and two unnecessary roughnesses .


If he played like Daniels then I am fine with it.


not to mention I assume there is a WILD disparity in snap count.
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Memory is like the Packers when they are behind by two touchdowns in the 4th quarter... It comes back.
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Shanedorf


Joined: 18 Mar 2014
Posts: 1583
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

2016:
daniels 664 def snaps
jones 548 def snaps @ DL + OLB

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/snapcounts

2015:
daniels 706
jones 364 @ DL
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CentralFC


Joined: 03 Feb 2011
Posts: 11933
PostPosted: Fri May 12, 2017 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

2015 was an issue IIRC, 2016 wasn't. People just like narratives. Much easier to cling to one faulty one than evolve over time.



Still, not entirely upset he's gone. But I would have liked to see another year from him on a one year deal. Think we could have gotten solid production. He was close last year (led in pressures/QB hits obviously) but didn't finish.

He'll excel in Minnesota in that scheme and with those guys around him. Think Zimmer will be a solid coach for him.
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packerjmf wrote:
GWH87 wrote:
Somebody take the off season shovel out of Ted's hands & bury him in his own hole.

How can he dig a hole if he's too busy sitting on his hands?
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PackFan4Life


Joined: 05 Dec 2006
Posts: 4714
Location: De Pere, WI
PostPosted: Fri May 12, 2017 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To me, it depends when you want to compare this roster from to now.....

QB <-> Nothing has changed. Hope they stay healthy and then they can showcase Hundley more this preseason.

RB DOWN: If you compare this group from where it was last year at this time, you just do not lose Lacy and expect to be better coming into this year with a transitioned WR and 4 mid to late round and UDFA rookies as your RB stable. If you compare to where this group was before the draft, it is moving up.

TE ^ Better blocking group then last year and the Kendricks addition gives this group better depth.

WR ^ Nelson a full year recovered from the surgery is going to get him off to a faster start. If this group stays healthy it is a very good group. Interesting rooks added to the competition and Allison/Davis will either show more progress or be replaced.

OL DOWN You simply do not lose two all pro Gs and expect this group to be better or the same as it was last year at this time. The depth is not as good either with Tretter gone. Jahri is going to be ok but he is not Lang quality anymore. Need evidence of progress from the second year group to say this is <->.

DL ^ Deeper group with better competition headed into this year. Should be one of the more noticeable improvements in the team going into this year.

OLB ^ Like the younger blood in there, promising group headed into this year if healthy. Jones was lost and I think that loss will be felt more then originally thought early in the year. BUT, if the young ones take a step and this group stays healthy I think they will be better this year.

ILB ^ Ryan emerged last year as a solid player. Martinez should be better with a year under his belt. Thomas showed he can be a good situational player and the addition of Jones adds speed to the group. Very solid group with more room to grow IMO.

CB <-> Really depends. If you compare to this time last year: A very young group aside from House who essentially replaces Shields as the vet. That would be DOWN. But if you compare to the end of last year ^: This group will take it lumps but has so much more ceiling to push if healthy. More then I can say for throwing limited athletes out there taking their lumps without much more upside and making your S try to play of lot nickel because your other options are not very appealing or hurt. This group could be much better then where it was last year at this time, but until it shows on the field, you simply do not recover from the loss of Shields with House as his replacement.

S ^ HHCD, Burnett are very good starters. Brice was a nice surprise last year and should be better with a year of experience in the system. Evans and Jones will really round out the depth and options in the backend this year.

ST DOWN: Might have a new unproven LS, the best punt returner is gone, and Schum is ok but still just Schum. Crosby is very good but a year older. Gotta hope the influx of younger talent helps this group on coverage headed into this year.
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CWood21


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Joined: 27 Jun 2008
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Location: mike23md on the dope sig
PostPosted: Fri May 12, 2017 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

QB - Push
RB - Down
WR - Up
TE - Up
OL - Down
DL - Up
ILB - Up
OLB - Down
CB - Push
S - Up
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PackFan4Life wrote:
I have been pooping like a unicorn for two days and it is freaky.

bkobow05 wrote:
So this is what DCR feels like on Saturdays...
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skibrett15


Joined: 10 Jan 2006
Posts: 2537
Location: nibelheim
PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CWood, I'm guessing the ILB UP sentiment is coming from some combination of
Adding Biegel (though I think they are gonna spend his whole season on developing him at EDGE to see if it works)

Adding Jones - hopefully can play some snaps at 3rd safety/ILB position.

Blake Martinez? - guy had a lot of hype and has a chance to make a leap I suppose. Nothing in his play was impressive to me.

ILB is the most interesting position on this team in that it's basically a reflection of the rest of the roster. Impacted by Clay, Jones, other Edge, other S... basically anything to keep from playing martinez and ryan for a ton of snaps every game.
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CWood21


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PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skibrett15 wrote:
CWood, I'm guessing the ILB UP sentiment is coming from some combination of


Pretty much. Last year, we started the year with a rookie ILB (Blake Martinez) and a 2nd year player who was transitioned to an ILB two years prior. At the very least, a healthy Martinez and another year of development for Ryan should provide average play from that position with some upside. Honestly, prior to the Martinez injury I thought the Ryan/Martinez duo worked well.
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PackFan4Life wrote:
I have been pooping like a unicorn for two days and it is freaky.

bkobow05 wrote:
So this is what DCR feels like on Saturdays...
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ugLymayNe


Joined: 31 Oct 2006
Posts: 14691
Location: Wisconsin
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why does everyone mention Jones taking snaps at at ILB over Burnett?
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Donzo


Joined: 05 Aug 2015
Posts: 168
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He's bigger, faster and younger than Burnett... And, the #1 news story the past ten days has been Jones playing the nickle ILB.
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PackyAttacky


Joined: 12 Mar 2017
Posts: 208
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CWood21 wrote:
QB - Push
RB - Down
WR - Up
TE - Up
OL - Down
DL - Up
ILB - Up
OLB - Down
CB - Push
S - Up


How is this not up?
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Frank-O


Joined: 20 Jun 2012
Posts: 2289
Location: Wisconsin - Cheeseland
PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PackyAttacky wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
QB - Push
RB - Down
WR - Up
TE - Up
OL - Down
DL - Up
ILB - Up
OLB - Down
CB - Push
S - Up


How is this not up?

Because we had Sam Shields going into the year.
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CWood21


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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PackyAttacky wrote:
How is this not up?


You're telling me that you're more comfortable going into the season this year with our corners than going into last year?
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PackFan4Life wrote:
I have been pooping like a unicorn for two days and it is freaky.

bkobow05 wrote:
So this is what DCR feels like on Saturdays...
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