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Rookie Expectations for this year
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AnAngryAmerican


Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 19481
Location: Loveland, CO
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

-Garrett Bolles will get eaten alive in camp by Shane Ray and Shaq Barrett. They won't let him go against Von because, well, Von is Von. If Elway and his yes-man coaching staff decide to start him, he will struggle. Ultimately, he will bust.

-DeMarcus Walker will get destroyed in the run game in preseason games and prove to be what he is - a situational pass rusher.

-Carlos may make a few big plays here and there but even in McCoy's McDaniels-esque dink-and-dunk shotgun screen offense, will prove to be little more than a gadget player with next to no every-down value.

-Brendan Langley will be a ST player who takes his time to learn from the best secondary in the NFL. He will go largely unnoticed but may flash here and there as a gunner. He won't make an impact on defense, which is fine because our secondary is legit.

-Jake Butt will be the best rookie, or at least most-impactful rookie, on the team even though he won't see the field until October. Patriots castoff AJ Derby (no doubt signed because Matt "buy me a drink" Russel is friends with Josh McDaniels) will start the season and fall on his face. Butt will be solid but unspectacular, proving to be a chain-moving safety-valve for whichever QB is playing after Bolles misses a block and gets the starter injured.

-Isiah McKenzie will get hurt in camp or preseason or, if he survives both and somehow makes the team, on his first touch in a real NFL game.

-DeAngelo will fight for a spot on the roster, flash some here and there, but will be determined by offensive mastermind Mike McCoy and the great leader of men Vance Joseph to be PS material. He won't clear waivers and will get signed by another AFC team where he will haunt us for the next 8-10 years. Jamaal Charles, retained instead of DeAngelos, will blow out his knee by week 4. Meanwhile, Kapri does work for Kyle's 'Niners in SF.

-Chad Kelly will cause problems in the QB room and prove to be a general problem in lockerroom. Yet he will show Jay Cutler-like physical traits against roster-fluff in the preseason which will get the inept portion of the fanbase whipped up into a tizzy, that will be exacerbated by entities like The Fan, and cause further problems for the team. He and Aquib Talib will get into a fight. Talib will win.
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AAA is right, as he usually is.
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3166
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
-Garrett Bolles will get eaten alive in camp by Shane Ray and Shaq Barrett. They won't let him go against Von because, well, Von is Von. If Elway and his yes-man coaching staff decide to start him, he will struggle. Ultimately, he will bust.

-DeMarcus Walker will get destroyed in the run game in preseason games and prove to be what he is - a situational pass rusher.

-Carlos may make a few big plays here and there but even in McCoy's McDaniels-esque dink-and-dunk shotgun screen offense, will prove to be little more than a gadget player with next to no every-down value.

-Brendan Langley will be a ST player who takes his time to learn from the best secondary in the NFL. He will go largely unnoticed but may flash here and there as a gunner. He won't make an impact on defense, which is fine because our secondary is legit.

-Jake Butt will be the best rookie, or at least most-impactful rookie, on the team even though he won't see the field until October. Patriots castoff AJ Derby (no doubt signed because Matt "buy me a drink" Russel is friends with Josh McDaniels) will start the season and fall on his face. Butt will be solid but unspectacular, proving to be a chain-moving safety-valve for whichever QB is playing after Bolles misses a block and gets the starter injured.

-Isiah McKenzie will get hurt in camp or preseason or, if he survives both and somehow makes the team, on his first touch in a real NFL game.

-DeAngelo will fight for a spot on the roster, flash some here and there, but will be determined by offensive mastermind Mike McCoy and the great leader of men Vance Joseph to be PS material. He won't clear waivers and will get signed by another AFC team where he will haunt us for the next 8-10 years. Jamaal Charles, retained instead of DeAngelos, will blow out his knee by week 4. Meanwhile, Kapri does work for Kyle's 'Niners in SF.

-Chad Kelly will cause problems in the QB room and prove to be a general problem in lockerroom. Yet he will show Jay Cutler-like physical traits against roster-fluff in the preseason which will get the inept portion of the fanbase whipped up into a tizzy, that will be exacerbated by entities like The Fan, and cause further problems for the team. He and Aquib Talib will get into a fight. Talib will win.



Is this the ceiling for this draft or the floor? Or middle ground in your eye's?
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Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3166
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

extra post
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Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."


Last edited by thebestever6 on Fri May 05, 2017 3:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3166
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

extra post
_________________
Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."


Last edited by thebestever6 on Fri May 05, 2017 3:27 am; edited 1 time in total
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3166
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

extra post
_________________
Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."


Last edited by thebestever6 on Fri May 05, 2017 3:28 am; edited 1 time in total
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AKRNA


Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 6942
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, I'm not sure which is more depressing.
Searching the obituaries for people younger than I or reading recent AAA posts.
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jolly red giant


Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 408
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
-Garrett Bolles will get eaten alive in camp by Shane Ray and Shaq Barrett. They won't let him go against Von because, well, Von is Von. If Elway and his yes-man coaching staff decide to start him, he will struggle. Ultimately, he will bust.

-DeMarcus Walker will get destroyed in the run game in preseason games and prove to be what he is - a situational pass rusher.

-Carlos may make a few big plays here and there but even in McCoy's McDaniels-esque dink-and-dunk shotgun screen offense, will prove to be little more than a gadget player with next to no every-down value.

-Brendan Langley will be a ST player who takes his time to learn from the best secondary in the NFL. He will go largely unnoticed but may flash here and there as a gunner. He won't make an impact on defense, which is fine because our secondary is legit.

-Jake Butt will be the best rookie, or at least most-impactful rookie, on the team even though he won't see the field until October. Patriots castoff AJ Derby (no doubt signed because Matt "buy me a drink" Russel is friends with Josh McDaniels) will start the season and fall on his face. Butt will be solid but unspectacular, proving to be a chain-moving safety-valve for whichever QB is playing after Bolles misses a block and gets the starter injured.

-Isiah McKenzie will get hurt in camp or preseason or, if he survives both and somehow makes the team, on his first touch in a real NFL game.

-DeAngelo will fight for a spot on the roster, flash some here and there, but will be determined by offensive mastermind Mike McCoy and the great leader of men Vance Joseph to be PS material. He won't clear waivers and will get signed by another AFC team where he will haunt us for the next 8-10 years. Jamaal Charles, retained instead of DeAngelos, will blow out his knee by week 4. Meanwhile, Kapri does work for Kyle's 'Niners in SF.

-Chad Kelly will cause problems in the QB room and prove to be a general problem in lockerroom. Yet he will show Jay Cutler-like physical traits against roster-fluff in the preseason which will get the inept portion of the fanbase whipped up into a tizzy, that will be exacerbated by entities like The Fan, and cause further problems for the team. He and Aquib Talib will get into a fight. Talib will win.


And Broncofan called my prediction 'bold' Wink
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Broncofan


Joined: 02 Dec 2013
Posts: 3587
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AKRNA wrote:
Wow, I'm not sure which is more depressing.
Searching the obituaries for people younger than I or reading recent AAA posts.


Laughing

On a serious note - AAA, it's a good point to ask - is the worst-case scenario? Do you see a best-case scenario? I think it's absolutely essential to have a devil's advocate, and I'm obviously not going to claim Elway's draft record is perfect, far from it.

I think the most likely answer is we hit on 3-4 guys to varying degrees. Given Elway goes for the home run, we whiff completely on 2-3 guys. And 1-2 guys are in between hit/miss. It's how much we hit & miss (i.e. the impact of the hits/misses) that will tell the tale. Obviously you know where I stand, but it's all guesswork at this stage.
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steelpanther wrote:
This is like playing checkers with a pigeon. No matter how well you play, sooner or later the pigeon is going to crap on the board, then puff his chest out and strut around like he won something.
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AnAngryAmerican


Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 19481
Location: Loveland, CO
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You guys know I like to stir the pot. It's my MO.

And it's obviously a worst-case scenario. No one is hoping I am wrong about this draft, free agent class and new coaching staff more than myself.
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big_palooka:

bhslinebacker wrote:
AAA is right, as he usually is.
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iLikeDefense


Joined: 03 Jan 2010
Posts: 3717
Location: San Diego--Mile High West
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I may be in the minority on this but I like AAA's posts, he provides something different and a good chuckle especially when it comes to McD/NE bashing. Some of it can be a bit much but there is definitely some truth to what he posts. I've definitely become more skeptical over the course of this off-season so I share majority of his concerns.
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AKRNA


Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 6942
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iLikeDefense wrote:
I may be in the minority on this but I like AAA's posts, he provides something different and a good chuckle especially when it comes to McD/NE bashing. Some of it can be a bit much but there is definitely some truth to what he posts. I've definitely become more skeptical over the course of this off-season so I share majority of his concerns.


I don't think anybody minds AAA's posts. They're kind of a rite of passage on this forum.

He's used the "chicken little" approach since I've been here. Personally I like the "Little Suzie Sunshine" approach, looking at every thing with rose colored glasses. IE;

Bolles struggles early like all rookie LT's and get schooled in the opener by Bosa. It's a wake up call for him and in the rematch a month and a half later he more than holds his own and puts Bosa on his back several times. That really gives Bolles a boost and by seasons end he's a top 15 LT developing fast.

Gotsis, after a poor rookie season, takes advantage of a year of NFL training and good health and shows why he was drafted in the second round. He's become a force both against the run and pass and combined with Wolfe gives us a fantastic DE pair for years to come.

Okay, that's the "Suzie Sunshine" approach.

Bottom line, at the end of the year AAA and I will each be right about 50% of the time. Difference being, I won't be depressed all off season thinking about our team. Wink
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Broncofan


Joined: 02 Dec 2013
Posts: 3587
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AKRNA wrote:
iLikeDefense wrote:
I may be in the minority on this but I like AAA's posts, he provides something different and a good chuckle especially when it comes to McD/NE bashing. Some of it can be a bit much but there is definitely some truth to what he posts. I've definitely become more skeptical over the course of this off-season so I share majority of his concerns.


I don't think anybody minds AAA's posts. They're kind of a rite of passage on this forum.

He's used the "chicken little" approach since I've been here. Personally I like the "Little Suzie Sunshine" approach, looking at every thing with rose colored glasses. IE;

Bolles struggles early like all rookie LT's and get schooled in the opener by Bosa. It's a wake up call for him and in the rematch a month and a half later he more than holds his own and puts Bosa on his back several times. That really gives Bolles a boost and by seasons end he's a top 15 LT developing fast.

Gotsis, after a poor rookie season, takes advantage of a year of NFL training and good health and shows why he was drafted in the second round. He's become a force both against the run and pass and combined with Wolfe gives us a fantastic DE pair for years to come.

Okay, that's the "Suzie Sunshine" approach.

Bottom line, at the end of the year AAA and I will each be right about 50% of the time. Difference being, I won't be depressed all off season thinking about our team. Wink


Well said. It does show the value of having balanced discussion. Rarely is the best or worst case scenario, but covering both angles fair. Unless we are talking the Jeff Fisher-era Rams. Laughing
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steelpanther wrote:
This is like playing checkers with a pigeon. No matter how well you play, sooner or later the pigeon is going to crap on the board, then puff his chest out and strut around like he won something.
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thebestever6


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 3166
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
You guys know I like to stir the pot. It's my MO.

And it's obviously a worst-case scenario. No one is hoping I am wrong about this draft, free agent class and new coaching staff more than myself.


I respect that you like to be polarizing I try to be as objective as possible. I think Elway had his best 2 drafts the last 2 years. Lynch is great in the sense that we didn't have to give up a lot to get our guy. I think having Trevor with his mental acuity will do lynch wonders competing in this area. Add in 2 young talented safety prospects for that draft, Janovich, a quality punter and you strike gold.

Im big on both Henderson's and Bolles with where he was selected, and I think Walker does way more for our D than people give credit for. And we have arguably the best developmental cb in the draft. I can't complain.

If lynch and Siemian fall I will be mad because elway had a chance at Carr amd given the emphasis at qb it wasn't a bad choice then or now.i
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Props to Deadpulse for the Sig:

Big Palooka wrote:
"They don't have to worry about him making consistent passes. They will win another 2-3 max with him at QB."
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jolly red giant


Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 408
PostPosted: Fri May 05, 2017 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I had to pick one thing from this off-season where I think Elway made a mistake it was in hiring Vance Joseph.

People have been talking about Elway locking-in on draft picks - but he clearly locked-in on Joseph. My preference would have been Toub and I would have taken Shanahan (and a couple of others) over Joseph. His mistake was compounded when all the stuff about Joseph's antics came out.

The other thing I think Elway should have done is gone out and hired John Lynch before the 49ers got near him. I think Lynch would have been the ideal addition to the front office and shaken things up a bit.
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broncos67


Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 24148
Location: Conshohocken
PostPosted: Sun May 14, 2017 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jolly red giant wrote:
If I had to pick one thing from this off-season where I think Elway made a mistake it was in hiring Vance Joseph.

People have been talking about Elway locking-in on draft picks - but he clearly locked-in on Joseph. My preference would have been Toub and I would have taken Shanahan (and a couple of others) over Joseph. His mistake was compounded when all the stuff about Joseph's antics came out.

The other thing I think Elway should have done is gone out and hired John Lynch before the 49ers got near him. I think Lynch would have been the ideal addition to the front office and shaken things up a bit.


I don't really understand this. I think Elway did "lock in" on Vance a bit, but I don't think he ignored other coaches. We have zero way of knowing what happened or was said in interviews. I think it's clear Elway wanted someone who wasn't doubling as coach and OC/DC. He wanted a motivator and someone who can relate to the players, and in his mind that was Vance Joseph.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not the biggest Vance Joseph fan, but players already seem to like/respect the guy. That stuff about his antics, which were certainly unsavory, also led to no charges, no arrests, no anything. I don't think the guy is a saint, but that stuff happened a decade ago.

The Lynch part really baffles me. That move surprised nearly everyone. Why would Lynch want to come to Denver to be, at best, the #3 guy while he was given the ability to run the show in SF? On top of that, we have zero idea how Lynch will be as a personnel man, so saying we should have hired him is jumping the gun. It's easy to have a revered draft when your team is god awful and you have a bunch of high picks. But those guys need to turn into something at the end of the day.
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