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2018 - The Year of the Quarterback
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How Many 1st Round QB's in 2018 ???
One
5%
 5%  [ 4 ]
Two
2%
 2%  [ 2 ]
Three
20%
 20%  [ 16 ]
Four
40%
 40%  [ 32 ]
Five
15%
 15%  [ 12 ]
Six
6%
 6%  [ 5 ]
Seven
1%
 1%  [ 1 ]
Eight
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
More than Eight
2%
 2%  [ 2 ]
Blank - I just want to see the results
6%
 6%  [ 5 ]
Total Votes : 79

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freak_of_nature


Joined: 15 Oct 2012
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PostPosted: Sat May 06, 2017 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe Francois declares with a great season?

I think the Dolphins can try a QB if they could find a definite upgrade to Tannehill. Not to mention the money they'd save over the ext few years.
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Kiwibrown


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess with QB's if you grade them as a 2nd or 3rd rounder they are most likely going to be 1sts or high 1st round picks based on the rule of supply and demand.

It is outstanding that this year 3 went round one and none has day 1 starter potential.

If there are genuinely 6 prospects that have starter potential day one or season 1 then I could see 4-5 going in the fist round. How many team are not in the market for a 1st round QB?
most of the top QB's in the league are over 30 and will need replacing in the next few years.
there is probably 6 teams with genuine starters that are young and another 3 that have drafted projects and have mortgaged there future.

So that leaves roughly 12-15 teams that could draft a QB round 1, if they grade as day 1 starters or potential starters with the current market for QB's as high as ever realistically 6 could go, easily.
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SteelKing728


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Max Browne Laughing

He'll be lucky to sniff the NFL
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bucsfan333


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope Lamar Jackson becomes what Vick was supposed to be.
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Forge


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelKing728 wrote:
Max Browne Laughing

He'll be lucky to sniff the NFL


He'll definitely get a shot and get drafted with a reasonably decent season. I think Jeff Driskel proved that to us.
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Stupid NFL coaches and their need to reach for quarterbacks....
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SteelKing728


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 1:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forge wrote:
SteelKing728 wrote:
Max Browne Laughing

He'll be lucky to sniff the NFL


He'll definitely get a shot and get drafted with a reasonably decent season. I think Jeff Driskel proved that to us.


Who is Jeff Driskel? I heard the name but know nothing about him?

Browne will get the Mitch Leidner level hype now, and then prove to everyone he's just not am NFL player.

I'm a big Pitt fan too. The faster he's gone the better. Rooting for the kid from Pine Richland (10 mins from where I grew up)
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Forge


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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelKing728 wrote:
Forge wrote:
SteelKing728 wrote:
Max Browne Laughing

He'll be lucky to sniff the NFL


He'll definitely get a shot and get drafted with a reasonably decent season. I think Jeff Driskel proved that to us.


Who is Jeff Driskel? I heard the name but know nothing about him?

Browne will get the Mitch Leidner level hype now, and then prove to everyone he's just not am NFL player.

I'm a big Pitt fan too. The faster he's gone the better. Rooting for the kid from Pine Richland (10 mins from where I grew up)


Jeff Driskel was a 5 star recruit in 2011. #1 quarterback recruit in the nation I believe per Rivals and ESPN. Committed to Florida, and he totally, absolutely, completely bombed there. It was terrible. After 2014, the situation was so bad (Florida was a mess too, which didn't help) that he transferred out to La Tech. Played one year there...was pretty okay, but that LA Tech offense is also a bit gimmicky as well. But he's 6'4, 235 who can run sub 4.6 in the 40, so he got drafted. Of course, then he was cut at the end of pre season, but I think he caught on with the Bengals. Not sure if he's still there.

But yeah, I would expect something similar from Browne, who was also a 5 star recruit, I believe, and has the physical traits that NFL teams drool over and that you just can't teach. Someone will likely take a flier on him if he's just competent in Pitt's offense this year.
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jrry32


Joined: 04 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Sun May 07, 2017 2:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forge wrote:
SteelKing728 wrote:
Forge wrote:
SteelKing728 wrote:
Max Browne Laughing

He'll be lucky to sniff the NFL


He'll definitely get a shot and get drafted with a reasonably decent season. I think Jeff Driskel proved that to us.


Who is Jeff Driskel? I heard the name but know nothing about him?

Browne will get the Mitch Leidner level hype now, and then prove to everyone he's just not am NFL player.

I'm a big Pitt fan too. The faster he's gone the better. Rooting for the kid from Pine Richland (10 mins from where I grew up)


Jeff Driskel was a 5 star recruit in 2011. #1 quarterback recruit in the nation I believe per Rivals and ESPN. Committed to Florida, and he totally, absolutely, completely bombed there. It was terrible. After 2014, the situation was so bad (Florida was a mess too, which didn't help) that he transferred out to La Tech. Played one year there...was pretty okay, but that LA Tech offense is also a bit gimmicky as well. But he's 6'4, 235 who can run sub 4.6 in the 40, so he got drafted. Of course, then he was cut at the end of pre season, but I think he caught on with the Bengals. Not sure if he's still there.

But yeah, I would expect something similar from Browne, who was also a 5 star recruit, I believe, and has the physical traits that NFL teams drool over and that you just can't teach. Someone will likely take a flier on him if he's just competent in Pitt's offense this year.


It also worked for Nate Peterman. He was an unmitigated disaster at Tennessee. He started for a couple years at Pitt, but he was not a good starter in 2015.
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Mind Character


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 4:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mind Character wrote:
Mind Character wrote:
The 2018 QB Class

Wanted to start a thread for info and discussion on next year's guys. Let the discussion begin!!!

I'm multiple games in on various prospects and the 2018 QB class is filled with what I think are 5 Franchise QB types, 2 of them (Sam Darnold and Luke Falk) with immediate Day 1 Franchise QB impact and being on a different level in terms of overall skill for elite QB play than the other 3 (Josh Rosen, Josh Allen, Riley Ferguson) that possess major franchise QB upside but have more glaring deficiencies or limitations in their game that may ultimately prevent them from ascending to blue chip franchise QB status. After watching 8 games, I feel that people don't even know about Luke Falk's special play ability and how it is on the level of Darnold, albeit with less superior arm talent. I think Luke Falk is the guy that Hue has been looking for, and he is the guy that I want next year. If the players remain healthy, Sam Darnold and Josh Allen will go 1 and 2 b/c they have superior arm tools and look the part more than Falk. So, tons of teams will be fighting to get one of those guys. I'd love to get one of them, but I say let the other teams go after them at the top of the board, and maybe Falk falls to us assuming we pick somewhere from 5-7 after winning 4 or 5 games this upcoming season.


Tier 1--Blue-chip QB1, Day 1 Franchise QB:


1a.Sam Darnold, USC (8 games watched):
The Good: Uncanny poise, foot quickness, and power arm in the face of exterior and interior pressure. Pocket movement skills advanced. Elite deep ball velocity and pinpoint accuracy. Uncanny anticipation thrower instincts for such a young QB. See's it and processes early and has the confidence to let it rip before the WR is open.
The Bad: Tries to guide throws in at times instead of ripping it leading to poor mechanics and spotty inaccuracy. Jump shuffles a la Aaron rodgers but unlike Rodgers Darnold doesn't maintain a wide base so often finds himself out of rhythm on timing throws when outside pressure is beating down on him.

1b. Luke Falk, Wash. St.(10 games watched):
The Good: Elite poise, elite pocket movement under pressure. Routinely back shoulders when the CB is over the top. Great vision. Protypical pass set and shuffle rhythm where feet are always ready for a mechanically sound throw. Really spins it. Mike Leach's system has evolved and puts a ton of offensive line adjustments and receiver changing of routes at the line in the QBs hand---Faulk signals quickly and seems to diagnose the defense quickly. Self made walk on player that can take hard coaching.
The Bad: Fades in the pocket and throws off back foot too often. Sometimes short arms throws over the middle. Multiple games where defensive pressure had no chance to get to him due to great offensive scheming. Not sure about his knowledge in blitz pick up. A lot of five wide sets...would love to see him under center.

Tier 2- Franchise QB Upside:

3. Josh Allen, Wyoming (7 games watched):
The Good: More deep ball power velocity than Mahomes. A-plus athlete. Rare Unicorn type throws outside the pocket. What he does in terms of throwing the ball outside the pocket on the run is a notch above Mahomes and Manziel and more in line with Rodgers in terms of fitting the ball in the smallest of windows on the sideline.
The Bad: Some of the worst late throw interceptions of all time. Inconsistent decision maker. Believes no throw is impossible. Over strides and poor mechanics lead to the ball sailing. Flees the pocket too soon. Poise is great on one play than really bad next. When he runs cold, it can be hard to watch as there becomes a snowballing of poor decisions.

4. Josh Rosen, UCLA:(10 games watched)
The Good: Sidenote--will be the most misunderstood prospect when people finally start to watch him and realize his game doesn't always "jump off the tape." Those that have heard all the hype that he's the next Luck-type will be shocked at his lack of major arm strength and will in a reactionary fashion call him "overhyped, the next Matt Leinart, and not good." They'll miss that although he's not Luck what he is, is the best technicien in terms of pocket movement work and throws with uncanny anticipation on the level of phillip rivers coming out of college. The best pinpoint ball placement on drive routes with timing. More pinpoint accurate and better anticipatory thrower version of Andy Dalton. Constantly puts the ball in places to maximize run after catch and to protect the WR.
The Bad: Arm strength is uneven and often marginal. Slow-footed athlete. Decision-making seizes up under pressure. Holds the ball too long waiting for the primary receiver to come open instead of moving on to the net read. Tends to stare things down too much. Needs a sturdier front foot when inside pressure comes as a result he tends to fade when perceiving pressure with the result being inaccurate passes.

5. Riley Ferguson, Memphis: (8 games watched)[/u]
The Good: Ultra competitor. Can be a force on the field with his competitive spirit to the point where his teammates come alive on the sideline and raise their level of play in critical moments based on his energy. Gunslinger in the truest of senses. Deep ball bucket thrower extraordinaire.
The Bad: Pocket movement and footwork is underdeveloped and inconsistent. Not a great anticipation thrower. Needs to be in the West-Coast two read Deep to Boundary offense as he struggles with opposite side of the field 1,2 progression reading. Escapes to run from the blitz instead of trying to win in the pocket. Would be perfect in Saints offense as Drew Brees successor.


Tier 4: Developmental Starter with Good Tools and Traits


6. Lamar Jackson, Louisville
The Good: Beyond elite running ability there is some overlooked Big time arm talent. All his throws are all whipped arm from the upper body as he has the worst lower body mechanics and narrow base in the history of football (overstated but it's awful). Does a good job stepping up in the pocket to throw.
The Bad: The most narrow base thrower in the history of the game. Basically up on his toes with no leverage or weight transfer from back to front leg.. Who the hell is not coaching him on this?? Narrow base with his feet together in his passing set lead to all inaccuracies, all misses.

7. Brett Rypien, Boise St.
The Good: Great anticipation thrower. Understands the proper footwork for pro-WR routes that allow perfect timing on velocity throws. Nice deep ball drop in the bucket thrower. Has a full grasp of the audible game and getting the offense out of bad situations.
The Bad: Arm strength may be a serious issue in the pro game. Needs to get the ball out faster in the redzone. Tends to hold onto the ball to avoid mistakes too often in the redzone foregoing plays that are there and need to be made. Needs to play more free and let it rip.


Tier 5--Developmental QBs with Tools:


8. Mason Rudolph, Ok St.

The Good: Great sideline timing thrower. Good accuracy thrower on the deep post.
The Bad: Parachute on his deep ball. Doesn't respond to inside pressure with the ability to sidestep or move up to find a new platform to throw.

9. Quinton Flowers, USF
The Good: A gamer. Will be the biggest riser. David Garrard type with more explosive athleticism and big time arm. Clutch performer with the ability to win and slide in the pocket to throw on timing.
The Bad: Escapes pressure to run when remaining patient might provide a big time passing opportunity. Needs to work on throwing with anticipation

11. Baker Mayfield, Oklahoma
The Good: When he's hot, he's a franchise changing QB with his blitz avoidance movement, ability to win inside and out the pocket, and deep ball accuracy.
The Bad: Hot and cold on decision making in the same quarter. Too inconsistent with footwork. Throws too many 50/50 balls.


The Next 3:
---Need to watch more but saw some limitations that I didn't like.

12. Trace McSorley, PSU
13. Jake Browning, Washington
14. Jarrett Stidham, Auburn



All-Overrated But will get a lot of love

Drew Lock, Missouri: Feet in mud, statue, can't handle the rush.
Nick Fitzgerald, Miss St: Feet in mud, feet stuck under pressure, can only throw in a clean pocket.[/b]




Watched some more games and my understanding of the QBs has changed some and I'm excited to see who makes the next jump in the upcoming year. I also have an idea regarding who the QBs compare to.

My revised rankings and their pro comparisons (when those pros were at the top of their skill and game)


1. Sam Darnold (Rich Gannon with Aaron Rodgers plus arm and movement skill)
2. Luke Falk (Kurt Warner on the nose in terms of movement, athletic ability, arm delivery, natural passing instincts, great timing, etc)
3. Josh Allen (no one, A magical unicorn; bigger more athletic Jay Cutler)
4. Josh Rosen (Alex Smith at his best)
5. Riley Ferguson (less polished but more power arm Andy Dalton)
6. Baker Mayfield (Jeff Garcia/Kevin Kolb when he balled some)
7. Lamar Jackson (Narrow base, poorer leg/foot mechanics, not a natural passing base/set version of Michael Vick)
8. Quinton Flowers (David Garrard, Doug Flutie mix)
9. Brett Rypien (Aaron Murray/Cody Kessler mix)
10. Jake Browning (Less Arm talented slightly better mechanical delivery Blake Bortles)
11. Mason Rudolph (Matt Schuab)
12. Trace McSorley (stronger armed Charlie Frye)
13. Jarrett Stidham (Less arm talented Trent Edwards)


Just saw 3 games that have changed my overall perception of Baker Mayfield's upside. He really put it together in a string of 4 games in terms of eye manipulation of the secondary and big boy throws. Still don't know about him off the field, but he moves up my list 4 spots after also digging more into Mason Rudolph's game and finding it lacking. Mayfield still is not a quick processor of coverages and locks on to targets for too long.

Also, watched 2 more games of Mason Rudolph that makes me see him the same. I'm not getting what people are seeing with him as some are saying he's a top 3 QB. He's a statue and stares down routes tremendously.

There's just so much to like about the competitive spirit of Quinton Flowers. When he's not running for his life, his pocket stature is very much so like David Garrard. He makes some serious throws and surprisingly throws with good anticipation.

Drew Lock and Fitzgerald are not nfl QBs but big guys that can see it and throw it. They process the game so slow. Their height/wt/speed will push them up people's board's late, but they truly are mudd feet statues with no real pocket poise and zero pocket movement. They're not going to be on my list unless something seriously changes in their development. Fitzgerald is a tough football player however that's fun to cheer for.

The Stidham as a top 4 QB1 is crazy. He has a lot of Jake Locker and Blaine Gabbert in him. Calm pocket demeanor. Less than plus arm more on the level of Locker. Not a lot of tape to go on. Could be just a guy.

Jake Browning showed me some things in terms of high level of football intelligence despite his marginal arm that makes me think that he may have functional value in a west coast quick hit offense so he moves up a few spots as well.

Still don't know what to make of mcsorley as he seems like a back yard football player that throws it up for WR to make plays in big moments. Need to see more of him to put his play within the context of the rest of these guys.

Still have Falk as number 2 despite not being the athletic specimen nor the big time arm QB of Allen and Rosen. His pocket poise and pocket rhythm is just so advanced that he will be a successful starter in the league. A lot of Kurt Warner in his game. Moves like Kurt Warner as they are not plus athletes and has a natural feel for pressure and quick pressure avoidance maneuvers like an early career Kurt Warner to give him enough time to get the ball out on a safer throwing platform.

Ultimately, Kurt Warner like tape won't excite when two of the most gifted athlete and arm QBs will likely be coming out next year in Allen and Darnold. Rosen has special anticipatory feel in his passing game. They'll all go ahead of Luke Falk, but given a great offensive line, I expect Falk to do work just like Warner by winning with timing, pocket awareness, football intelligence, and pinpoint ball placement.
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(5/22/17) '18 QB1s: 1. Sam Darnold, 2. Luke Falk, 3. Josh Allen, 4. Josh Rosen, 5. Riley Ferguson, 6. Baker Mayfield / FS1s: 1. Armani Watts, 2. Godwin Igwebuike, 3. Jordan Whitehead / SS1: 1. Derwin James / CB1s: 1.T. McFadden, 2. M. Fitzpatrick
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poorbytehshore


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheSCOUT wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
TheSCOUT wrote:
Am I the only person who sees Max Browne as a top prospect???

I am projecting a lot, I know... But a 5 star recruit who beat out Sam Darnold...and will be playing in a pro-style offense this year at Pitt.

He will be this years, Mitch Trubisky.


Then went on to be an awful QB who should have never been ahead of Darnold... most likely, Darnold's status as a RS FR compared to Browne being a 5* in the program and waiting his turn is what led to Browne winning out initially, because it was clear that Darnold was light years ahead of Max Browne. And their OC is Shawn Watson, who was dreadful at Texas.


I see it differently. Browne only lost the starting job because he couldn't beat Alabama and Stanford...two of the best defenses in the nation.

Once USC realized they had no shot at the playoffs they went with Darnold to give him some game experience knowing that he's their future.


They were afraid Browne would transfer and they would have no backup, so they started him.

Darnold was better from the start, and they knew it but still went that way.
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Superman(DH23)


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bucsfan333 wrote:
I hope Lamar Jackson becomes what Vick was supposed to be.
This is so revisionist history. Mike Vick was what Mike Vick was supposed to be, pre-suspension/jail. As much as I detest his actions, I can't deny that many times, playoff games included, I watched Mike Vick single handedly win games for the Falcons. You know the name Alge Crumpler, why? Bc of Mike Vick.
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Superman(DH23)


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forge wrote:
topwop1 wrote:
Just waiting to hear next off season on how the 2018 QB class is weak and how the 2019 QB class is going to be way better.

This seems to be the same recurring theme almost every year. It's always better next year right?

Surely these kids will be scrutinized to no end and will fall out of favor some how some way.


The only way I think that people view next year's class as weak is if, 1) Darnold, Rosen and Allen all go back to school (not to mention Jackson). Obviously, that kills the top end of the draft, and 2) they just like to hate on quarterbacks. There are definitely people like that, and there are going to be people who hate on the top quarterbacks just because, but anyone who tries to look at it objectively would at least have to say that the top of next years draft is superior to this years, even with the additional scrutiny.
People are victims of the moment. Surely At least 1 of the 3 goes back to school, 1 will have a down year, 1 will be over scrutinized, and somebody we aren't thinking of right now will really rise. Then we'll be talking about how bad 2018s QB class is and how awesome 2019 will be and that all of the QBs are development guys. I've seen this movie before ...many times.
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jrry32


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Superman(DH23) wrote:
Forge wrote:
topwop1 wrote:
Just waiting to hear next off season on how the 2018 QB class is weak and how the 2019 QB class is going to be way better.

This seems to be the same recurring theme almost every year. It's always better next year right?

Surely these kids will be scrutinized to no end and will fall out of favor some how some way.


The only way I think that people view next year's class as weak is if, 1) Darnold, Rosen and Allen all go back to school (not to mention Jackson). Obviously, that kills the top end of the draft, and 2) they just like to hate on quarterbacks. There are definitely people like that, and there are going to be people who hate on the top quarterbacks just because, but anyone who tries to look at it objectively would at least have to say that the top of next years draft is superior to this years, even with the additional scrutiny.
People are victims of the moment. Surely At least 1 of the 3 goes back to school, 1 will have a down year, 1 will be over scrutinized, and somebody we aren't thinking of right now will really rise. Then we'll be talking about how bad 2018s QB class is and how awesome 2019 will be and that all of the QBs are development guys. I've seen this movie before ...many times.


And I've seen this same comment before many times. It's the same faulty generalizations over and over again. 2018 is a much stronger class than 2017 barring completely unexpected decisions to return to school. It was obvious last year that 2017 wasn't going to be a strong class.
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Superman(DH23)


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrry32 wrote:
Superman(DH23) wrote:
Forge wrote:
topwop1 wrote:
Just waiting to hear next off season on how the 2018 QB class is weak and how the 2019 QB class is going to be way better.

This seems to be the same recurring theme almost every year. It's always better next year right?

Surely these kids will be scrutinized to no end and will fall out of favor some how some way.


The only way I think that people view next year's class as weak is if, 1) Darnold, Rosen and Allen all go back to school (not to mention Jackson). Obviously, that kills the top end of the draft, and 2) they just like to hate on quarterbacks. There are definitely people like that, and there are going to be people who hate on the top quarterbacks just because, but anyone who tries to look at it objectively would at least have to say that the top of next years draft is superior to this years, even with the additional scrutiny.
People are victims of the moment. Surely At least 1 of the 3 goes back to school, 1 will have a down year, 1 will be over scrutinized, and somebody we aren't thinking of right now will really rise. Then we'll be talking about how bad 2018s QB class is and how awesome 2019 will be and that all of the QBs are development guys. I've seen this movie before ...many times.


And I've seen this same comment before many times. It's the same faulty generalizations over and over again. 2018 is a much stronger class than 2017 barring completely unexpected decisions to return to school. It was obvious last year that 2017 wasn't going to be a strong class.
Jrry you know I respect you, but I've been around the block a few times more than you. Its not a faulty generalization, it happens almost every year. Its the prisoner of the moment mentality and the belief that what's around the corner is always better than what's available now. I said this back in 2008 when Matt Ryan was drafted #3 and there was so much talk about how terrible that class was, the top QB is almost always going to be taken in the top 5, the #2 somewhere in the top 10-15, and usually you have 1 more sneak into the first at the end. I'm not saying that this class is going to be great (although I confess I think all 4 of the top QBs have a chance to be really good for different reasons) but that the criticism of the class as a whole is the same thing I hear every year.
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CHOCOLATITO


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PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Explain to me why you guys aren't as high on Mason Rudolph? It's weird he's already being overlooked at as QB1.
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