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DraftHobbyist


Joined: 17 Aug 2014
Posts: 244
PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:03 pm    Post subject: DraftHobbyist's Offense-Offense mock Reply with quote

Everybody is focusing on Defense in their mocks. It does make sense because TT does believe in drafting Defense early, but I'd like to show how a Draft where we go Offense in the 1st and 2nd Round could look. I'm using Walter Football's latest mock draft (http://walterfootball.com/draft2017_1.php) for my player pool.

1) WR Corey Davis WESTERN MICHIGAN -- This would be a fall for Davis, but it could happen. He wasn't able to work out at the Combine or his Pro Day due to an ankle injury. He also played lower FBS competition in the MAC. According to Rotoworld, he also fell out of the 1st Round in Peter Schrage's mock draft as well (http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/cfb/134415/corey-davis).

There is a lot to like about Davis. Sure, he played lower competition, but he dominated it being highly productive over many years. He's my #2 WR behind John Ross, and he fits what the Packers do perfectly. He can play any WR position including the slot. The Packers have had success with a past WR out of Western Michigan selected pretty highly in the NFL Draft by the name of Greg Jennings. Davis would be our long-term #1 WR, and he could make an instant impact on the field in his first year. Some other notes I had on him are he is a natural hands catcher, physical, shifty, good hips, and he has a stiff arm move in the open field.

2) RB Joe Mixon OKLAHOMA -- He obviously has the off-the-field stuff, but he also has some good off-the-field as well. He's generally well-liked, and he lacks a pattern of behavior. Reports are that Cook's background is actually more worrisome than Mixon's, and Mixon is many years removed from the incident. The way the board falls, I think Mixon is the choice that makes sense, and I think a player falling due to concerns that maybe the Packers are willing to take a risk on is actually one way that we could go Offense-Offense if it actually happened.

After signing two TE's, I really didn't want to go TE here, but there are some solid options. If you really don't like Mixon you could insert a guy like D'Onta Foreman TEXAS or Kareem Hunt TOLEDO. If I had gone a different route from WR in the 1st, a solid WR is there in Chad Hansen CALIFORNIA, who tested better than most thought he would and was highly productive.

3) CB Howard Wilson HOUSTON -- Panicking because the Packers went Offense-Offense? Panic no longer! Welcome 6'1" CB Howard Wilson, who runs a 3-cone of a 6.68! He was a highly productive, lockdown CB in college, and he would be a very good addition to the Packers. He could play slot CB and potentially move to the outside with development. There were some DL's I liked here as well as EDGE Carl Lawson AUBURN, but I went with the CB.

4) OT Roderick Johnson FLORIDA ST -- I do agree with people that this OL needs another guy, the 4th Round is where TT has had the most success for OL's, and the Packers like to convert LT's. Johnson is a big-time talent that I see as a 1st-high 2nd Round pick. He is 6'7" and weighed in at 298 lbs with 36" arms and 10 3/4" hands. He was sick at the Combine which is why he came in so light, but his playing weight is closer to 315-325 lbs. Johnson is raw, but he has the potential to be a stud.

I think we could run with Bakhtiari, Johnson, Linsley, Spriggs, and Bulaga as our starting 5 if Johnson shows promise early (line them up however), but I would look to move on from the oft-injured Bulaga long-term.

5) RB Samaje Perine OKLAHOMA -- This is getting into BPA/ST's territory, so while you may want an injection of Defensive talent, there weren't any guys I just loved at this point. Perine is a unique player that I really wanted, so I gave him to us.

The plan here with this double dip is to have Perine play the short yardage and goal line role. Perine is just the guy for that, and it would fill a big need with Mixon being the lead guy and Montgomery being the change-of-pace back for an Earth, Wind, and Fire like the Giants had a few years ago. I also have another role for Perine, though, and that's the backup FB position, as he is a 233 lb RB that I think could fill the role if Ripkowski goes down.

I wanted to mention Perine's athleticism. It doesn't get enough credit. He's a 233 lb guy that ran a 4.60 40 at his Pro Day. He benched 30 reps, VJ is 33", BJ is 9'8", and his SPARQ has him 12th among RB's. If you look at his Draft Profiles they harp on burst, but I don't think it's as bad as people think, he was dealing with a leg injury during the season, and overall, and sometimes it can look like a RB lacks burst because they are reading the Defense. Interestingly enough, though, Walter also gave us Perine at this spot (which is who I was thinking before I even saw that).

5) EDGE Hunter Dimick UTAH -- The popular guy is Tanoh Kpassagnon VILLANOVA who has outstanding athleticism but is very raw, but I want to get another name out there. Dimick is very intriguing because he played real competition, he's 6'3" 268 lbs, he ran a 4.69 40, and he put up 38 bench reps (outstanding). I think he'd be a fantastic backup for Nick Perry while Jayrone Elliott can be the speed rushing backup for Clay Matthews, and you have Fackrell as the more well-rounded backup. Dimick put up big time production (http://www.cfbstats.com/2016/player/732/1050117/index.html) and was one of the biggest Combine snubs.

6) S Johnathan Ford Auburn -- 5'11" 200 lbs and a 4.38 40. That's good enough for my Special Teams unit, and we'll see what he can develop into form there. Oh, and did I mention 20 reps on the bench press? As a Junior, Ford had 118 tackles, but his production trailed off as a Senior.

7) QB Jerod Evans VIRGINIA TECH -- Choosing which QB to go with was a bit difficult, but there's a lot to like about Evans. He has the body type you look for in a QB, he has some athleticism, and he was pretty productive. He has well over a 60% completion rate. I also think this is where a weakness of Evans being a 1-year starting Junior is a strength, because if looking for a guy that can project to be more than he already is, starting only 1 year as an underclassman could be an indicator. Patrick Mahomes TEXAS TECH was here btw, but I'd rather have Evans.

Overall, this is a heavy Offensive Draft. Offense is our identity, and it fills both current and future needs on both the Offense and Defense. I hope this gets people to stop panicking and feeling like we absolutely have to go Defense early, because you can miss on some really good prospects by cutting out one side of the ball. I really like how this Draft turned out, and like I said, I used Walter Football's mock to determine who was there and I had absolutely no idea who would be there, so there was no hindsight picking. Let me know what you think!
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Stevein2012


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Corey Davis would be awesome
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stu29er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like Wilson! In the third, I think thats right. I would like to see that.
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JBURGE25


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love Davis and like Mixon, don't get me wrong, and I like Howard Wilson in the 3rd. I also appreciate you going against the general mold of these drafts.

But man, if we draft offensive skill players in the 1st 2 rounds, I will be scratching my head for so long that I will give myself a bald spot
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DraftHobbyist


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback, guys. JBURGE25, if we went offensive skill positions in the first 2 rounds I think a lot of people would be freaking out while it was going on, but I think if the Drafted ended up like this mock, people would actually see it as a pretty good Draft for us.

One thing about the WR position is the Packers have had success in the 2nd Round, but those WR's have had limitations. They aren't nearly as athletic as a lot of guys, and that's why we have had troubles with our guys not being able to get open. Cobb looked like a stud at one point, but it's pretty clear now that he's not. Nelson was basically a 1st Round pick because he was picked so highly in the 2nd Round with what was our first pick, and he was our best WR. Greg Jennings was good, but we masked his limitations, which became clear after he left. James Jones didn't do much after leaving the Packers. Some would point to this as evidence at how we can get a lot out of average WR's in the 2nd Round, but I point to it as evidence of limitations we are dealing with at the position. Imagine what this Offense could be with a WR that could actually get open on a regular basis, who was actually very athletic, and was a legitimate #1 WR that could play any WR position. We'd be set for the future, but imagine if Nelson keeps getting hurt/falling off how average to bad we get at the position very quickly.
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pgwingman


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll be honest, I just don't like the Corey Davis pick. The way I see it, you could line up Nelson, Adams, Cobb, Marty, and Allison for a starting 5. If you draft Davis, aren't you really just drafting a No. 4 receiver to replace Allison? That seems like a bit of a luxury to use a 1st round pick on.
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CentralFC


Joined: 03 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pgwingman wrote:
I'll be honest, I just don't like the Corey Davis pick. The way I see it, you could line up Nelson, Adams, Cobb, Marty, and Allison for a starting 5. If you draft Davis, aren't you really just drafting a No. 4 receiver to replace Allison? That seems like a bit of a luxury to use a 1st round pick on.


I think he answered these questions in one of his above posts.

- Nelson is kind of old, might be at a greater risk of injury, and is already "falling off" (?)
- Cobb is more or less an imposter
- Adams isn't as athletic as most first round receivers
- Masked all of Greg Jennings' limitations
- James Jones did diddly without Rodgers



Now, imagine what we could do with a "receiver who could get open on a regular basis" and not the scrubs above.

[for what it's worth, I disagree heavily with all the above and see it as incredibly near-sighted]
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DraftHobbyist


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CentralFC wrote:
pgwingman wrote:
I'll be honest, I just don't like the Corey Davis pick. The way I see it, you could line up Nelson, Adams, Cobb, Marty, and Allison for a starting 5. If you draft Davis, aren't you really just drafting a No. 4 receiver to replace Allison? That seems like a bit of a luxury to use a 1st round pick on.


I think he answered these questions in one of his above posts.

- Nelson is kind of old, might be at a greater risk of injury, and is already "falling off" (?)
- Cobb is more or less an imposter
- Adams isn't as athletic as most first round receivers
- Masked all of Greg Jennings' limitations
- James Jones did diddly without Rodgers



Now, imagine what we could do with a "receiver who could get open on a regular basis" and not the scrubs above.

[for what it's worth, I disagree heavily with all the above and see it as incredibly near-sighted]


I was talking quite a bit about the future, so how is that near-sighted? About Nelson, falling off athletically. Nelson is not the speed now that he was when he came into the NFL. No player over 30 is. It's not just Greg Jennings with limitations, all of these guys have limitations the Packers mask. Name me one WR that has left the Packers and done anything anywhere else. I also don't know what you mean by characterizing my position on Cobb as an imposter. Cobb is a slot guy that needs to be in the slot. I also didn't call these guys scrubs, they are just not #1 WR's, and without Nelson (if he gets injured again or for when he falls down the depth chart due to age), all these WR's will struggle to produce because they will all get moved up the depth chart.

PGWingMan: Allison is turning into a fan favorite and he has exceeded expectations as an UDFA, but he's not a guy we avoid drafting a WR highly because we will push Allison down the Depth chart. He has had 12 receptions for 202 receiving yards and 2 TD's in the regular season, so I think his achievements need to be kept in context. The other thing about him is that he does not play Special Teams very well, and that could hurt him at the bottom of our Depth chart at WR. Maybe he'll improve that this year.
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Cadmus


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DraftHobbyist wrote:
CentralFC wrote:
pgwingman wrote:
I'll be honest, I just don't like the Corey Davis pick. The way I see it, you could line up Nelson, Adams, Cobb, Marty, and Allison for a starting 5. If you draft Davis, aren't you really just drafting a No. 4 receiver to replace Allison? That seems like a bit of a luxury to use a 1st round pick on.


I think he answered these questions in one of his above posts.

- Nelson is kind of old, might be at a greater risk of injury, and is already "falling off" (?)
- Cobb is more or less an imposter
- Adams isn't as athletic as most first round receivers
- Masked all of Greg Jennings' limitations
- James Jones did diddly without Rodgers



Now, imagine what we could do with a "receiver who could get open on a regular basis" and not the scrubs above.

[for what it's worth, I disagree heavily with all the above and see it as incredibly near-sighted]


Name me one WR that has left the Packers and done anything anywhere else.


Uhhh... that should be a testament to Ted Thompson's GM chops.

The fact that Jennings and Jones departed to receive 3rd contracts elsewhere and were cut before they could see the end of them means Thompson self-scouts well.

Did Thompson offer Jennings money? In all likelihood yes, but he didn't overpay for a 3rd contract player that he viewed as beyond the prime of his career. Lang presented a similar situation.

I agree with you on Allison.
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vegas492


Joined: 30 Oct 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Give me an edge player instead of Mixon and this mock has me.

I just can't get on board with Mixon and have a tough time thinking that he is the type of person that the club would want and that the city would embrace. That and I think the club views Monty as their starting RB...no need for someone to supplant him, rather they need a compliment to him.

Lots of edge players, one should have been taken there. DraftHobbyist....would you run your scenario and re-draft for Mixon with an edge you think should be there?

I really like that corner...
The other RB would be a fine compliment to Monty, too.
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pgwingman


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DraftHobbyist wrote:
CentralFC wrote:
pgwingman wrote:
I'll be honest, I just don't like the Corey Davis pick. The way I see it, you could line up Nelson, Adams, Cobb, Marty, and Allison for a starting 5. If you draft Davis, aren't you really just drafting a No. 4 receiver to replace Allison? That seems like a bit of a luxury to use a 1st round pick on.


I think he answered these questions in one of his above posts.

- Nelson is kind of old, might be at a greater risk of injury, and is already "falling off" (?)
- Cobb is more or less an imposter
- Adams isn't as athletic as most first round receivers
- Masked all of Greg Jennings' limitations
- James Jones did diddly without Rodgers



Now, imagine what we could do with a "receiver who could get open on a regular basis" and not the scrubs above.

[for what it's worth, I disagree heavily with all the above and see it as incredibly near-sighted]


I was talking quite a bit about the future, so how is that near-sighted? About Nelson, falling off athletically. Nelson is not the speed now that he was when he came into the NFL. No player over 30 is. It's not just Greg Jennings with limitations, all of these guys have limitations the Packers mask. Name me one WR that has left the Packers and done anything anywhere else. I also don't know what you mean by characterizing my position on Cobb as an imposter. Cobb is a slot guy that needs to be in the slot. I also didn't call these guys scrubs, they are just not #1 WR's, and without Nelson (if he gets injured again or for when he falls down the depth chart due to age), all these WR's will struggle to produce because they will all get moved up the depth chart.

PGWingMan: Allison is turning into a fan favorite and he has exceeded expectations as an UDFA, but he's not a guy we avoid drafting a WR highly because we will push Allison down the Depth chart. He has had 12 receptions for 202 receiving yards and 2 TD's in the regular season, so I think his achievements need to be kept in context. The other thing about him is that he does not play Special Teams very well, and that could hurt him at the bottom of our Depth chart at WR. Maybe he'll improve that this year.


I guess I just disagree. For starters, I think Nelson still has plenty left in the tank. Secondly, I would say that Adams is now capable of replacing Nelson, should he go down (I think Adams showed that he is still a player on the rise last year). Thirdly, I would also make the case that Marty now adds another dimension to the passing offense, which takes emphasis off of Nelson.

I'm sticking to my earlier assessment, Davis just seems like too much of a luxury pick on this team. It just feels like there will be many other better options available at 29. For example, this team lost two EDGE players in FA, but we've only drafted one to replace them.

All that being said, I'm not completely opposed to the pick. However, if you use your first rounder on a luxury pick like Davis, i think you'd have to spend the next couple rounds on needs like EDGE.
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Jaegybomb


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conley vs Davis would actually be a pretty interesting choice but I'd be fine with this draft. WRs don't really hit their stride until year 3 right?
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vegas492


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jaegybomb wrote:
Conley vs Davis would actually be a pretty interesting choice but I'd be fine with this draft. WRs don't really hit their stride until year 3 right?

In GB's system, that is more or less right. Jennings and Jones produced earlier, though.
But, we haven't had a first pick WR in the system, so who knows how they would produce. Pretty safe to say that year one would be a limited contribution, just due to who is in front of the player.
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Jaegybomb


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Walter took Bowser in the 2nd as the best available edge rusher. I don't mind Mixon over him though. I could see either one.
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DraftHobbyist


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 03, 2017 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vegas492 wrote:
Give me an edge player instead of Mixon and this mock has me.

I just can't get on board with Mixon and have a tough time thinking that he is the type of person that the club would want and that the city would embrace. That and I think the club views Monty as their starting RB...no need for someone to supplant him, rather they need a compliment to him.

Lots of edge players, one should have been taken there. DraftHobbyist....would you run your scenario and re-draft for Mixon with an edge you think should be there?

I really like that corner...
The other RB would be a fine compliment to Monty, too.


I went Offense-Offense because I wanted to show people how that could play out, but if I go Offense-EDGE, this is how it looks:

1) WR Corey Davis WESTERN MICHIGAN

2) EDGE Derek Rivers YOUNGSTOWN ST -- It was between Carl Lawson and Derek Rivers, I actually had Lawson up higher, but I think I'm going to flip them. I really like Rivers, although his 20S could've been better, and Carl Lawson had a bad 3C. Rivers is a little light, but it scares me more that Lawson didn't even try to redo his 3C.

3) CB Howard Wilson HOUSTON

4) OT Roderick Johnson FLORIDA ST

5) RB Samaje Perine OKLAHOMA

5) DL Ryan Glasgow MICHIGAN -- Instead of Hunter Dimick, I replace him with Glasgow, who I'd try to play as a DE in a 3-man front of DT in a 4-man front. He didn't test the best, but I think he plays better than his numbers.

6) S Johnathan Ford AUBURN

7) QB Jerod Evans VIRGINIA TECH
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