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WR Laquon Treadwell: Year2
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:


Ty Hilton- 40 time 95th percentile

LeSean McCoy- 3 cone 86th and 87th 10 yard split

Torry Holt- 40 time 77th and 72nd vertical jump

Wes Welker- 91st on 20 yard shuttle

Devante Freeman- 52nd broad and 55th 40 time

Willie Snead- isn't even worth mentioning.

Find me a player than has had success at "WR" with equal or worse measurable as Treadwell.


Snead isn't worth mentioning? Well that's awful convenient.

I already conceded that some of these players tested higher than the 30th percentile in some drills, so what point are you making?

Seriously, please take a look at Freeman's scores again and tell me you would think he would have done as well as he's done. Same can be said of Welker, and McCoy and Hilton to a lesser extent.

Then of course we can go back to Snead, who's scores are worse than Treadwell's. Shall we peruse his stats from last year?

72 rec, 895 yards, 4 TDs in only his second year, but we don't talk about him right?
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:
Honestly, go look at the top guys with Laquon size;

Julio Jones
Dez Bryant
AJ Green
Mike Evans
DeAndre Hopkins
Alshon Jeffery
Allen Robinson
Brandon Marshall
Terrelle Pryor
Odell Beckham
Jordy Nelson
Amari Cooper
Michael Thomas
Demaryius Thomas
Larry Fitzgerald
Davante Adams

All are superior athletes to Laquon Treadwell.


That is a very wide range of size.
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:


Ty Hilton- 40 time 95th percentile

LeSean McCoy- 3 cone 86th and 87th 10 yard split

Torry Holt- 40 time 77th and 72nd vertical jump

Wes Welker- 91st on 20 yard shuttle

Devante Freeman- 52nd broad and 55th 40 time

Willie Snead- isn't even worth mentioning.

Find me a player than has had success at "WR" with equal or worse measurable as Treadwell.


Snead isn't worth mentioning? Well that's awful convenient.

I already conceded that some of these players tested higher than the 30th percentile in some drills, so what point are you making?

Seriously, please take a look at Freeman's scores again and tell me you would think he would have done as well as he's done. Same can be said of Welker, and McCoy and Hilton to a lesser extent.

Then of course we can go back to Snead, who's scores are worse than Treadwell's. Shall we peruse his stats from last year?

72 rec, 895 yards, 4 TDs in only his second year, but we don't talk about him right?


1. Freeman is a running back.

2. Snead's stats aren't very impressive. 2 other WRs on their roster had over 1,100 yards (one being a rookie)

3. McCoy is one of the most agile backs in the league. He's measurements show that.

4. Welker played with Tom Brady...He was easily replaced...
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You ignored Hopkins, who is a very good comparison for Treadwell, and who's best score was in the vertical, where he tested in the 57th percentile. Everything else below 30, save for 33 percentile 10 yard split.

But those two things pass the arbitrary 30 percentile, so he's not applicable?
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolmonite26 wrote:
You ignored Hopkins, who is a very good comparison for Treadwell, and who's best score was in the vertical, where he tested in the 57th percentile. Everything else below 30, save for 33 percentile 10 yard split.

But those two things pass the arbitrary 30 percentile, so he's not applicable?


A 4.57 compared to a 4.68-4.71 is a hugeee difference in 40 times. Hopkins lit it up at Clemson. Over 1,400 yards.
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:


1. Freeman is a running back.

2. Snead's stats aren't very impressive. 2 other WRs on their roster had over 1,100 yards (one being a rookie)

3. McCoy is one of the most agile backs in the league. He's measurements show that.

4. Welker played with Tom Brady...He was easily replaced...


The running backs are thrown in as examples of below average athletes outperforming their combine performance.

Who can call Snead's stats whatever you want, but they're still meaningful production in only his second year. Something that it doesn't seem like you think Treadwell can even do.

You said find a receiver who has played well without cracking the 30 percentile, I give you....Willie Snead.

And again it's very convenient that you can just dismiss Welker as an example.
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:
Dolmonite26 wrote:
You ignored Hopkins, who is a very good comparison for Treadwell, and who's best score was in the vertical, where he tested in the 57th percentile. Everything else below 30, save for 33 percentile 10 yard split.

But those two things pass the arbitrary 30 percentile, so he's not applicable?


A 4.57 compared to a 4.68-4.71 is a hugeee difference in 40 times. Hopkins lit it up at Clemson. Over 1,400 yards.


29th percentile dude.

You continue to be arbitrary

Treadwell's 40 was 4.63....
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:


1. Freeman is a running back.

2. Snead's stats aren't very impressive. 2 other WRs on their roster had over 1,100 yards (one being a rookie)

3. McCoy is one of the most agile backs in the league. He's measurements show that.

4. Welker played with Tom Brady...He was easily replaced...


The running backs are thrown in as examples of below average athletes outperforming their combine performance.

Who can call Snead's stats whatever you want, but they're still meaningful production in only his second year. Something that it doesn't seem like you think Treadwell can even do.

You said find a receiver who has played well without cracking the 30 percentile, I give you....Willie Snead.

And again it's very convenient that you can just dismiss Welker as an example.


What's convenient is you using players that play a completely different position, guys that were the 3rd leading WR on a passing offense, and a player that played with the greatest quarterback of all time and has shown to make WRs look better than what they are. I listed over 15 examples and you merely produced 3 irrelevant players. Plus, Welker was a slot WR. I listed nothing but boundary guys.
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:
Dolmonite26 wrote:
You ignored Hopkins, who is a very good comparison for Treadwell, and who's best score was in the vertical, where he tested in the 57th percentile. Everything else below 30, save for 33 percentile 10 yard split.

But those two things pass the arbitrary 30 percentile, so he's not applicable?


A 4.57 compared to a 4.68-4.71 is a hugeee difference in 40 times. Hopkins lit it up at Clemson. Over 1,400 yards.


29th percentile dude.

You continue to be arbitrary

Treadwell's 40 was 4.63....


You do realize that 40 times at pro days are about .05-.1 off, right? Nothing is arbitrary. It's all based off assessing the numbers. You've yet to produce any testing value to suggest Laquon Treadwell can be success.
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:
Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:


1. Freeman is a running back.

2. Snead's stats aren't very impressive. 2 other WRs on their roster had over 1,100 yards (one being a rookie)

3. McCoy is one of the most agile backs in the league. He's measurements show that.

4. Welker played with Tom Brady...He was easily replaced...


The running backs are thrown in as examples of below average athletes outperforming their combine performance.

Who can call Snead's stats whatever you want, but they're still meaningful production in only his second year. Something that it doesn't seem like you think Treadwell can even do.

You said find a receiver who has played well without cracking the 30 percentile, I give you....Willie Snead.

And again it's very convenient that you can just dismiss Welker as an example.


What's convenient is you using players that play a completely different position, guys that were the 3rd leading WR on a passing offense, and a player that played with the greatest quarterback of all time and has shown to make WRs look better than what they are. I listed over 15 examples and you merely produced 3 irrelevant players. Plus, Welker was a slot WR. I listed nothing but boundary guys.


I have given you examples, with statistical backing, to weaken the integrity of your argument that Treadwell is set up for failure based on his combine scores

You provided a list of players you deem to be good and stated, without evidence, that they're better athletes.

I have already discredited that one of those players, Hopkins, is really that much better of an athlete.
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:
Dolmonite26 wrote:
KeithVikings28 wrote:


1. Freeman is a running back.

2. Snead's stats aren't very impressive. 2 other WRs on their roster had over 1,100 yards (one being a rookie)

3. McCoy is one of the most agile backs in the league. He's measurements show that.

4. Welker played with Tom Brady...He was easily replaced...


The running backs are thrown in as examples of below average athletes outperforming their combine performance.

Who can call Snead's stats whatever you want, but they're still meaningful production in only his second year. Something that it doesn't seem like you think Treadwell can even do.

You said find a receiver who has played well without cracking the 30 percentile, I give you....Willie Snead.

And again it's very convenient that you can just dismiss Welker as an example.


What's convenient is you using players that play a completely different position, guys that were the 3rd leading WR on a passing offense, and a player that played with the greatest quarterback of all time and has shown to make WRs look better than what they are. I listed over 15 examples and you merely produced 3 irrelevant players. Plus, Welker was a slot WR. I listed nothing but boundary guys.


I have given you examples, with statistical backing, to weaken the integrity of your argument that Treadwell is set up for failure based on his combine scores

You provided a list of players you deem to be good and stated, without evidence, that they're better athletes.

I have already discredited that one of those players, Hopkins, is really that much better of an athlete.


Go look at all of those players combine and pro day scores. All are better than Treadwell's. You know who else's scores are better than Treadwell's? Deandre Hopkins. You've done nothing but strengthen my argument that you have to randomly select players from different positions and different styles of WR.
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KeithVikings28


Joined: 21 Sep 2012
Posts: 2767
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you desperately try to find someone and list Willie Snead to try to take down my argument...that's just sad. If you can't see the correlations, that's just bad. They're all there clear as day.
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Duff Man


Joined: 05 May 2013
Posts: 959
Location: Sveltville
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:
Heimdallr wrote:
Does Treadwell look prohibitively slow on tape? Did he struggle to get open or make plays in college?

The combine numbers may not be entirely accurate representations of his athleticism. He could have been still recovering from injury, sick, etc.



He looks very slow on tape and struggled big time in college with gaining separation.


Wrong.

http://www.thebackyardbanter.com/reception-perception-2016-nfl-draft-prospects-results.html
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Duff Man


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Location: Sveltville
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You don't need to be super atletic to be a possession receiver. Can't believe this is even an argument tbh...
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Dolmonite26


Joined: 05 Jan 2014
Posts: 1628
PostPosted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KeithVikings28 wrote:
When you desperately try to find someone and list Willie Snead to try to take down my argument...that's just sad. If you can't see the correlations, that's just bad. They're all there clear as day.


I can see them. I won't dispute that his numbers are bad, but you have completely ignored similar players, Hopkins in particular, who profile very closely to Treadwell but have succeeded.

In regards to Snead, you asked for an example, I gave you one. You're pushing it aside or undercutting to fit your narrative, that's your choice.

What's funny is you keep coming up with contingencies and excuses for why so and so succeeded or isn't actually that good or whatever. But completely brush aside the idea the Treadwell's testing numbers could have been hurt by his recovery from injury.
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