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NightTrainLane


Joined: 22 Oct 2015
Posts: 3069
Location: On the wall defending Reggie from all blasphemous heretics!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

riceraider8080 wrote:
NightTrainLane wrote:
holyghost wrote:
NightTrainLane wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
OakRaiders3828 wrote:
RaidersAreOne wrote:
I read that she hit him first. It could be considered self defense if true. Whatever man. I am so sick of hearing all these double standards with regards to women and physical violence. If she instigated it and went at him first, I don't care what he did. You never want to see these things happen, but if you look for trouble you will find it. Man or not.


Nope, no excuse. A man in his position needs to have some self control and walk away. A hit to a man his size by her and he barely feels it, a hit to her by a man his size could kill her. Not to mention he's a week away from achieving his dream. No excuse, be the bigger person, walk away, and become a millionaire in a week.


Yep, you don't hit a woman. The end.


If a woman is mad enough to assault a man 3 times her size, do you think she is mad enough to pick up a blunt object and smash him over the head with it or stab him with a weapon, especially when his back is turned walking away?

I bring this up because this exact thing has happened to my best friend in a bar. My friend is a big guy (6'1 280) who broke up with a girl (5'7ish 130ish) and she confronts him in a bar. After word are exchanged, she pushes and slaps him in the face, he blocks and turns to leave at the urging of me and his sister. Ex grabs a bottle and smashes him over the head from behind.

If he or any one else had actually put this out of control person down then he wouldn't have had a split skull and 38 stitches. The problem with the "never hit a woman" stance is you don't know how this person is prepared to escalate the encounter or how you'll react to being hit. People with any kind of training know that you want to eliminate the threat once it is assessed as one. Even without training if someone attacks you may believe you'll react calmly but you don't know til it happens. Sometimes a person natural reaction is to strike back, maybe not even with a punch but with outstretched arms and that is enough to be made out to be a hit in some eyes depending on damage and size difference.

Judging these kinds of encounters without being there and seeing it is spotty at best. And who is to say the witnesses aren't taking sides as 2 people in the bar did in the case of my friend. Female bartender and the exes friend both claimed my friend pushed her first. Security tape along with 6 other wintnesses clearly proved otherwise in court.

I'm am a 100% believer that violence is a last resort but once someone becomes a bodily threat to you, no matter the size, they have established intent. I have learned the hard way that my intent at that point should be to prevent harm to me and mine.

I have thought many times what I should have or could have done differently. The only thing I know for sure was that my friend said almost right afterwards that his first reaction after the shock of the slaps was to push her as hard as possible away but he stopped because of being taught to not hit women and us pulling him away. If he had followed his natural instinct he may have been saved a lot of harm and pain. She may have also been hurt badly but shouldn't someone expect a response if they are willing to inflict harm.

Sorry for the long read...


Long post man, just go read the police report on twitter next time before you formulate a long defense. That way you can then assess what the best response would be AFTER you're fully informed. Brantley's life wasn't in "danger". He's an imbecile.


http://www.wtsp.com/mb/sports/future-nfl-draft-pick-gators-star-brantley-involved-in-fight-with-female/430994826


Positive ID and statements from multiple witnesses. He's going undrafted for sure...


Haha!

Sig bet he gets drafted?
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MrOaktown_56


Joined: 15 Dec 2013
Posts: 7990
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dark horse for 3rd round IMO is ardarius stewart. Could eventually compete with crabtree down the line IMO. Has all the skills. Taywan Taylor is another guy.

Reggie really doesn't reach and if those guys drop he might pull the trigger. Would be the first time he's taken a receiver on day 2 though.
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attack_in_s/b


Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 1072
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

riceraider8080 wrote:
NightTrainLane wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
OakRaiders3828 wrote:
RaidersAreOne wrote:
I read that she hit him first. It could be considered self defense if true. Whatever man. I am so sick of hearing all these double standards with regards to women and physical violence. If she instigated it and went at him first, I don't care what he did. You never want to see these things happen, but if you look for trouble you will find it. Man or not.


Nope, no excuse. A man in his position needs to have some self control and walk away. A hit to a man his size by her and he barely feels it, a hit to her by a man his size could kill her. Not to mention he's a week away from achieving his dream. No excuse, be the bigger person, walk away, and become a millionaire in a week.


Yep, you don't hit a woman. The end.


If a woman is mad enough to assault a man 3 times her size, do you think she is mad enough to pick up a blunt object and smash him over the head with it or stab him with a weapon, especially when his back is turned walking away?

I bring this up because this exact thing has happened to my best friend in a bar. My friend is a big guy (6'1 280) who broke up with a girl (5'7ish 130ish) and she confronts him in a bar. After word are exchanged, she pushes and slaps him in the face, he blocks and turns to leave at the urging of me and his sister. Ex grabs a bottle and smashes him over the head from behind.

If he or any one else had actually put this out of control person down then he wouldn't have had a split skull and 38 stitches. The problem with the "never hit a woman" stance is you don't know how this person is prepared to escalate the encounter or how you'll react to being hit. People with any kind of training know that you want to eliminate the threat once it is assessed as one. Even without training if someone attacks you may believe you'll react calmly but you don't know til it happens. Sometimes a person natural reaction is to strike back, maybe not even with a punch but with outstretched arms and that is enough to be made out to be a hit in some eyes depending on damage and size difference.

Judging these kinds of encounters without being there and seeing it is spotty at best. And who is to say the witnesses aren't taking sides as 2 people in the bar did in the case of my friend. Female bartender and the exes friend both claimed my friend pushed her first. Security tape along with 6 other wintnesses clearly proved otherwise in court.

I'm am a 100% believer that violence is a last resort but once someone becomes a bodily threat to you, no matter the size, they have established intent. I have learned the hard way that my intent at that point should be to prevent harm to me and mine.

I have thought many times what I should have or could have done differently. The only thing I know for sure was that my friend said almost right afterwards that his first reaction after the shock of the slaps was to push her as hard as possible away but he stopped because of being taught to not hit women and us pulling him away. If he had followed his natural instinct he may have been saved a lot of harm and pain. She may have also been hurt badly but shouldn't someone expect a response if they are willing to inflict harm.

Sorry for the long read...


As a 5'9" 150 lb man with an insane and violent 5'6" 130 lb ex gf, i cant tell you how many times i was physically attacked by her and how easy it was to simply grab her wrists, wrap them around her own stomach, softly bear hug her from behind, and carry her out the door.

There's always an easier way than punching a chick in the face...


I think nighttrains story is more about the issue with assuming that women are physically incapable of harming men - as his story and many others can attest, women are 100% capable. Sure, unless she's Ronda Rousey (pre-getting knocked out) a guy has an unfair advantage in terms of strength in a fist fight. But for the sake of arguement, what if Ronda is coming after you - is it safe to defend yourself (I mean unless you're also a UFC fighter you're probably getting KO'd regardless).

Outside of that, as per the story, a weapon >>>> strength. And I agree that You can't assume that because she's a woman she wouldn't use a weapon.

What I can't justify is how he handled it - I agree with your take on the punch. He's a 300+ pound d-tackle.... most MEN would be pretty messed up taking a sucker-punch in the face from that. Idk about you guys but even as a male, I'm not quite cocky enough to think I could take a straight-right from an NFL d-tackle and walk away unharmed. even a push at 50% strength would probably send her flying. A closed punch is difficult to justify, even agreeing with everything train said. I also have a hard time believing he handled the initial confrontation well... I imagine he probably did say/do some things to instigate/escalate it. The VAST majority of fights are avoidable if you just don't engage.... being 4 days away from being a millionaire you'd think one would be smart enough to avoid ever being in that position.

He's a late round pick at BEST now. Guy has no idea what he just did to his career. Outside of the money now, he's going to have a much harder time even getting onto the field if he gets signed at all.
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NightTrainLane


Joined: 22 Oct 2015
Posts: 3069
Location: On the wall defending Reggie from all blasphemous heretics!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrOaktown_56 wrote:
Dark horse for 3rd round IMO is ardarius stewart. Could eventually compete with crabtree down the line IMO. Has all the skills. Taywan Taylor is another guy.

Reggie really doesn't reach and if those guys drop he might pull the trigger. Would be the first time he's taken a receiver on day 2 though.


Spot on Oak. Those are my two favorite wrs for us in the draft as well. Both have good hands, operate well in the slot but can play outside, have NFL ready bodies and are great athletes. Whenever I do a mock on First Pick I try to trade down in the 2nd to grab one of them in the 3rd.
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Mr.Bob Dobalina


Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 2002
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaidersAreOne wrote:
I read that she hit him first. It could be considered self defense if true. Whatever man. I am so sick of hearing all these double standards with regards to women and physical violence. If she instigated it and went at him first, I don't care what he did. You never want to see these things happen, but if you look for trouble you will find it. Man or not.


Bingo.Nailed it
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NightTrainLane


Joined: 22 Oct 2015
Posts: 3069
Location: On the wall defending Reggie from all blasphemous heretics!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

attack_in_s/b wrote:
riceraider8080 wrote:
NightTrainLane wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
OakRaiders3828 wrote:
RaidersAreOne wrote:
I read that she hit him first. It could be considered self defense if true. Whatever man. I am so sick of hearing all these double standards with regards to women and physical violence. If she instigated it and went at him first, I don't care what he did. You never want to see these things happen, but if you look for trouble you will find it. Man or not.


Nope, no excuse. A man in his position needs to have some self control and walk away. A hit to a man his size by her and he barely feels it, a hit to her by a man his size could kill her. Not to mention he's a week away from achieving his dream. No excuse, be the bigger person, walk away, and become a millionaire in a week.


Yep, you don't hit a woman. The end.


If a woman is mad enough to assault a man 3 times her size, do you think she is mad enough to pick up a blunt object and smash him over the head with it or stab him with a weapon, especially when his back is turned walking away?

I bring this up because this exact thing has happened to my best friend in a bar. My friend is a big guy (6'1 280) who broke up with a girl (5'7ish 130ish) and she confronts him in a bar. After word are exchanged, she pushes and slaps him in the face, he blocks and turns to leave at the urging of me and his sister. Ex grabs a bottle and smashes him over the head from behind.

If he or any one else had actually put this out of control person down then he wouldn't have had a split skull and 38 stitches. The problem with the "never hit a woman" stance is you don't know how this person is prepared to escalate the encounter or how you'll react to being hit. People with any kind of training know that you want to eliminate the threat once it is assessed as one. Even without training if someone attacks you may believe you'll react calmly but you don't know til it happens. Sometimes a person natural reaction is to strike back, maybe not even with a punch but with outstretched arms and that is enough to be made out to be a hit in some eyes depending on damage and size difference.

Judging these kinds of encounters without being there and seeing it is spotty at best. And who is to say the witnesses aren't taking sides as 2 people in the bar did in the case of my friend. Female bartender and the exes friend both claimed my friend pushed her first. Security tape along with 6 other wintnesses clearly proved otherwise in court.

I'm am a 100% believer that violence is a last resort but once someone becomes a bodily threat to you, no matter the size, they have established intent. I have learned the hard way that my intent at that point should be to prevent harm to me and mine.

I have thought many times what I should have or could have done differently. The only thing I know for sure was that my friend said almost right afterwards that his first reaction after the shock of the slaps was to push her as hard as possible away but he stopped because of being taught to not hit women and us pulling him away. If he had followed his natural instinct he may have been saved a lot of harm and pain. She may have also been hurt badly but shouldn't someone expect a response if they are willing to inflict harm.

Sorry for the long read...


As a 5'9" 150 lb man with an insane and violent 5'6" 130 lb ex gf, i cant tell you how many times i was physically attacked by her and how easy it was to simply grab her wrists, wrap them around her own stomach, softly bear hug her from behind, and carry her out the door.

There's always an easier way than punching a chick in the face...


I think nighttrains story is more about the issue with assuming that women are physically incapable of harming men - as his story and many others can attest, women are 100% capable. Sure, unless she's Ronda Rousey (pre-getting knocked out) a guy has an unfair advantage in terms of strength in a fist fight. But for the sake of arguement, what if Ronda is coming after you - is it safe to defend yourself (I mean unless you're also a UFC fighter you're probably getting KO'd regardless).

Outside of that, as per the story, a weapon >>>> strength. And I agree that You can't assume that because she's a woman she wouldn't use a weapon.

What I can't justify is how he handled it - I agree with your take on the punch. He's a 300+ pound d-tackle.... most MEN would be pretty messed up taking a sucker-punch in the face from that. Idk about you guys but even as a male, I'm not quite cocky enough to think I could take a straight-right from an NFL d-tackle and walk away unharmed. even a push at 50% strength would probably send her flying. A closed punch is difficult to justify, even agreeing with everything train said. I also have a hard time believing he handled the initial confrontation well... I imagine he probably did say/do some things to instigate/escalate it. The VAST majority of fights are avoidable if you just don't engage.... being 4 days away from being a millionaire you'd think one would be smart enough to avoid ever being in that position.

He's a late round pick at BEST now. Guy has no idea what he just did to his career. Outside of the money now, he's going to have a much harder time even getting onto the field if he gets signed at all.


If he is taken late he won't have any harder time getting on the field than he would have before IMO. The team taking him will just have gotten a great value football talent wise. I still believe he'll go between the 2nd and 4th rds.
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Mr.Bob Dobalina


Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 2002
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd like to see.

#24-Reuben Foster
#56-Obi Melifonwu
#88- Fabian Moreau
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Rich7sena


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Posts: 6850
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr.Bob Dobalina wrote:
I'd like to see.

#24-Reuben Foster
#56-Obi Melifonwu
#88- Fabian Moreau

No way Obi makes it that far down.

Right now, my dream scenario is similar to yours, but rounds 1/2 flipped:

24-Obi Melifonwu
56-Raekwon McMillan
88-Fabian Moreau
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OakRaiders3828


Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 12482
Location: Lehigh Valley
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd prefer John Johnson in the third over Obi in the first
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OakRaiders3828


Joined: 18 Aug 2007
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Location: Lehigh Valley
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RD 1: Jarrad Davis, LB
RD 2: Jaleel Johnson, DL
RD 3: John Johnson, S
RD 4: Corn Elder, CB
RD 5: Wayne Gallman, RB
RD 6: Jerry Ogukwe, OT

That's a real rough mock off the top of my head, there's a ton of players I like in each round, so I'm sure I'll be happy no matter what happens
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Last edited by OakRaiders3828 on Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Mr.Bob Dobalina


Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 2002
Location: Texas
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rich7sena wrote:
Mr.Bob Dobalina wrote:
I'd like to see.

#24-Reuben Foster
#56-Obi Melifonwu
#88- Fabian Moreau

No way Obi makes it that far down.

Right now, my dream scenario is similar to yours, but rounds 1/2 flipped:

24-Obi Melifonwu
56-Raekwon McMillan
88-Fabian Moreau


I can dig that too. Just think Mcmillian in the 2nd is too early for him, I'd take him in the 3rd.If Foster is there at 24 I think it's a no brainer.Obi may not make it that far down.I could see him going anywhere from 33-60.
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 13263
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1. McDowell
2. McMillian
3. Evans or best CB/S

For me McMillian is close enough to Davis and Foster that I would be willing to pass on both to add McMillian and a get a guy like McDowell. I think its good value for both guys, well all three really considering where we pick.

For some reason though I keep having a re-occuring hope in the back of my mind that Allen falls to us somehow. Probably just because those other ALA DL dropping last year.
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raidr4life


Joined: 10 Jan 2010
Posts: 8682
Location: Fresno, California
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raiders are taking Tanoh Kpassagnon in the 3rd bank on that.
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BigD1123


Joined: 14 Dec 2012
Posts: 750
Location: South carolina
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not taking sides here just stating facts.
Fact 1. I am a 6ft 4inch 326lb former bouncer.
Fact 2 in 5 yrs of bouncing the worst issue I ever had was a 5ft 3inch 130lb woman
Fact 3 a punch in the nose eye or throat hurts like hell no matter your size.

That being said I never hit her. I've actually only hit a female once in my life. That was in a fight at school. I was fighting her boyfriend and his brother. She grabbed my arm I thought it was the brother and turned swinging. I cried like a baby.back to the story. I tried to hold her wrist. We are talking 20 min here. I let her go she hits me in the back of the head. I Cross her arms and hold them in front of her she headbutts me in the nose. I put her arms behind her back she tries to rear headbutt me. I finally had to pin her on the hood of a car in a fetal position until authorities arrived. Moral of the story is. It does not matter a man or woman's size or strength as much as it does intent. That being said I have not and never would intentionally strike a female. But that's because of how I was raised. I know a lot of guys raised by women who were taught if you are attacked you end it, be it man or woman. I'm not saying it should be ok or acceptable. I'm just saying there are a lot of people taught that it is ok.
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Silver&Black88


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 11:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many times have I said to discuss football and not domestic violence? Locking this thread for a bit.
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