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skibrett15


Joined: 10 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would be ok with doing something similar to what the Carolina Panthers did with Josh Norman. Tag him, see if you can't work out a reasonable deal, then let him hit the market and walk if he wants 15 mil/year and take your comp pick.
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4to87jim


Joined: 28 Jan 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skibrett15 wrote:
I would be ok with doing something similar to what the Carolina Panthers did with Josh Norman. Tag him, see if you can't work out a reasonable deal, then let him hit the market and walk if he wants 15 mil/year and take your comp pick.


Problem is, if we can't get the deal done and let him walk, then what? Peppers gone, Matthews sliding over the cliff... somebody has to rush the QB. We're not drafting high enough to get one there. If we're not willing to pay Perry, God knows Ted isn't gonna pay an outsider. I think getting a deal with Perry done is imperative, despite how leery I am of getting burned.
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CWood21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skibrett15 wrote:
I would be ok with doing something similar to what the Carolina Panthers did with Josh Norman. Tag him, see if you can't work out a reasonable deal, then let him hit the market and walk if he wants 15 mil/year and take your comp pick.


Honestly, what's the downside of tagging him and letting him play out his contract this year? Worst case scenario, you're paying him a pretty penny to see if he can replicate his numbers. No different than Kirk Cousins last year. The last thing Ted wants to do is overpay for a one hit wonder. If he can replicate those numbers, he might get a tad more expensive but it isn't like he's going to double his salary overnight.
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4to87jim


Joined: 28 Jan 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CWood21 wrote:
skibrett15 wrote:
I would be ok with doing something similar to what the Carolina Panthers did with Josh Norman. Tag him, see if you can't work out a reasonable deal, then let him hit the market and walk if he wants 15 mil/year and take your comp pick.


Honestly, what's the downside of tagging him and letting him play out his contract this year? Worst case scenario, you're paying him a pretty penny to see if he can replicate his numbers. No different than Kirk Cousins last year. The last thing Ted wants to do is overpay for a one hit wonder. If he can replicate those numbers, he might get a tad more expensive but it isn't like he's going to double his salary overnight.


Makes sense. Any idea what the tag $ would be?
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CWood21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

4to87jim wrote:
Makes sense. Any idea what the tag $ would be?


Haven't seen any real reliable numbers, but CBS projected back in December that the franchise tag for linebackers is going to be $14.75Mish. I'm not familiar with what they've done in the past for those LB/DE types that play as a stand up rush LB.
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PackFan4Life wrote:
I have been pooping like a unicorn for two days and it is freaky.

bkobow05 wrote:
So this is what DCR feels like on Saturdays...
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4to87jim


Joined: 28 Jan 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ouch. Hope it doesn't come to that. If we do that, chances of signing another FA goes down considerably.
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skibrett15


Joined: 10 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CWood21 wrote:
4to87jim wrote:
Makes sense. Any idea what the tag $ would be?


Haven't seen any real reliable numbers, but CBS projected back in December that the franchise tag for linebackers is going to be $14.75Mish. I'm not familiar with what they've done in the past for those LB/DE types that play as a stand up rush LB.


Yeah, the downside is that makes Perry your entire FA plan and it's 15 million GTD and on the books immediately.

It would severely hamstring your chances at signing an alternative pass rusher like JPP or even a FA CB if that's the direction they want to take.

If the plan is not to do any of that, I agree, go ahead and tag him and pay him.
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4to87jim


Joined: 28 Jan 2017
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skibrett15 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
4to87jim wrote:
Makes sense. Any idea what the tag $ would be?


Haven't seen any real reliable numbers, but CBS projected back in December that the franchise tag for linebackers is going to be $14.75Mish. I'm not familiar with what they've done in the past for those LB/DE types that play as a stand up rush LB.


Yeah, the downside is that makes Perry your entire FA plan and it's 15 million GTD and on the books immediately.

It would severely hamstring your chances at signing an alternative pass rusher like JPP or even a FA CB if that's the direction they want to take.

If the plan is not to do any of that, I agree, go ahead and tag him and pay him.


The last sentence scares me. I'm afraid it's probably business as usual and we sign nobody.

Rely on a rookie or two and development of Randall and Rollins to rescue the D. That's their usual thinking.
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NCPackFan


Joined: 12 Jan 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 02, 2017 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The OP here pretty much hit the nail on the head with each of the five guys they listed. If it weren't for Bustin Harrell, I would say that Jones was the biggest bust TT ever drafted without question. You could argue Sherrod but I have a hard time labeling him a bust when he suffered a freak injury that just about nobody could probably recover from. We drafted Jones to be a 3-4 DE because of his length. He then got a nagging injury. We then expected him to bulk up a bit and play as a 3-4 DE in the mold of Justin Smith. When that failed we moved him to OLB a la Mike Neal. That too has failed. He's a bust and should be playing as a rotational DE for someone like Carolina. He is the poster child for our failure in trying to convert guys to fit our system. Given our last two drafts, I'm hopeful we have learned our lesson here.

Sam Shields has played his last snap for the Packers. He's got his money, he's got a ring, no sense making $10 million to troll for another concussion. Even if he DID come back, we'd still be looking at CB rather high in the draft anyway.

I'd like to see Peppers come back as a good lockerroom presence if anything else, but he'll have to restructure or renegotiate his contract down big time.

Starks should have been done last season and will probably be done after this season if not before then. He's had some personal issues off-the-field that have to be weighing him down mentally. I too would at least bring him to camp, but cut him quickly if he doesn't perform. Same with Christine Michael. I'd bring back Lacy on a prove-it deal and see if he and Monty could be a one-two punch similar to what New England has with Blount and Lewis. I'd still draft a back somewhere in this draft though given the depth at the position this year. I don't think Crockett or Jackson are worth bringing back. Let them have a shot elsewhere.

I think Lang is gone. Too many injuries stacking up, play is starting to decline, someone will throw a little more money at him over a longer contract than what we will offer him if we offer and after seeing what happened to Sitton, I think that will weigh on his decision. I think you have to keep Tretter at this point and plug him in at RG if only for the short term. I could see Bulaga possibly getting cut after 2018 as his cap number is around 4 mil. but the hit would only be 1.6.

I really wish some people would give our back half of the secondary some more credit. Kentrell Brice fought his way in for playing time as a rookie and generally played quite well as did Marwin Evans to a lesser extent. Perhaps we can afford to let Burnett walk if one of those younger guys can fill his shoes. Perhaps one of them has already made Hyde expendable as well.
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AlexGreen#20


Joined: 13 Jun 2012
Posts: 13490
PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCPackFan wrote:
The OP here pretty much hit the nail on the head with each of the five guys they listed. If it weren't for Bustin Harrell, I would say that Jones was the biggest bust TT ever drafted without question. You could argue Sherrod but I have a hard time labeling him a bust when he suffered a freak injury that just about nobody could probably recover from. We drafted Jones to be a 3-4 DE because of his length. He then got a nagging injury. We then expected him to bulk up a bit and play as a 3-4 DE in the mold of Justin Smith. When that failed we moved him to OLB a la Mike Neal. That too has failed. He's a bust and should be playing as a rotational DE for someone like Carolina. He is the poster child for our failure in trying to convert guys to fit our system. Given our last two drafts, I'm hopeful we have learned our lesson here.

Sam Shields has played his last snap for the Packers. He's got his money, he's got a ring, no sense making $10 million to troll for another concussion. Even if he DID come back, we'd still be looking at CB rather high in the draft anyway.

I'd like to see Peppers come back as a good lockerroom presence if anything else, but he'll have to restructure or renegotiate his contract down big time.

Starks should have been done last season and will probably be done after this season if not before then. He's had some personal issues off-the-field that have to be weighing him down mentally. I too would at least bring him to camp, but cut him quickly if he doesn't perform. Same with Christine Michael. I'd bring back Lacy on a prove-it deal and see if he and Monty could be a one-two punch similar to what New England has with Blount and Lewis. I'd still draft a back somewhere in this draft though given the depth at the position this year. I don't think Crockett or Jackson are worth bringing back. Let them have a shot elsewhere.

I think Lang is gone. Too many injuries stacking up, play is starting to decline, someone will throw a little more money at him over a longer contract than what we will offer him if we offer and after seeing what happened to Sitton, I think that will weigh on his decision. I think you have to keep Tretter at this point and plug him in at RG if only for the short term. I could see Bulaga possibly getting cut after 2018 as his cap number is around 4 mil. but the hit would only be 1.6.

I really wish some people would give our back half of the secondary some more credit. Kentrell Brice fought his way in for playing time as a rookie and generally played quite well as did Marwin Evans to a lesser extent. Perhaps we can afford to let Burnett walk if one of those younger guys can fill his shoes. Perhaps one of them has already made Hyde expendable as well.


1. Jones' system at UCLA was the closest college comparision to our defense in the front 7. I have no idea what you're talking about transitioning schemes.

2. Peppers is a FA. You can't restructure a FA.

3. Lang was phenomenal this year. If you're cutting him it's because of the cap and the value paid at the position.

4. Bulaga's cap number in 2018 is 8.35 million. What are you smoking.

5. Marwin Evans played 25 snaps of defense all season and was near the ball on two plays, a completed pass for a first down and a blown INT that would've helped against Atlanta.

6. Burnett being expendable for Kentrell Brice/Marwin Evans is idiotic.
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From the day he was born and subsequently starting to grow into his short neck, round face, scruffy beard and pale face, Bulaga was destined to be a Packers O-Linemen for life.
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Pugger


Joined: 01 May 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexGreen#20 wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
The OP here pretty much hit the nail on the head with each of the five guys they listed. If it weren't for Bustin Harrell, I would say that Jones was the biggest bust TT ever drafted without question. You could argue Sherrod but I have a hard time labeling him a bust when he suffered a freak injury that just about nobody could probably recover from. We drafted Jones to be a 3-4 DE because of his length. He then got a nagging injury. We then expected him to bulk up a bit and play as a 3-4 DE in the mold of Justin Smith. When that failed we moved him to OLB a la Mike Neal. That too has failed. He's a bust and should be playing as a rotational DE for someone like Carolina. He is the poster child for our failure in trying to convert guys to fit our system. Given our last two drafts, I'm hopeful we have learned our lesson here.

Sam Shields has played his last snap for the Packers. He's got his money, he's got a ring, no sense making $10 million to troll for another concussion. Even if he DID come back, we'd still be looking at CB rather high in the draft anyway.

I'd like to see Peppers come back as a good lockerroom presence if anything else, but he'll have to restructure or renegotiate his contract down big time.

Starks should have been done last season and will probably be done after this season if not before then. He's had some personal issues off-the-field that have to be weighing him down mentally. I too would at least bring him to camp, but cut him quickly if he doesn't perform. Same with Christine Michael. I'd bring back Lacy on a prove-it deal and see if he and Monty could be a one-two punch similar to what New England has with Blount and Lewis. I'd still draft a back somewhere in this draft though given the depth at the position this year. I don't think Crockett or Jackson are worth bringing back. Let them have a shot elsewhere.

I think Lang is gone. Too many injuries stacking up, play is starting to decline, someone will throw a little more money at him over a longer contract than what we will offer him if we offer and after seeing what happened to Sitton, I think that will weigh on his decision. I think you have to keep Tretter at this point and plug him in at RG if only for the short term. I could see Bulaga possibly getting cut after 2018 as his cap number is around 4 mil. but the hit would only be 1.6.

I really wish some people would give our back half of the secondary some more credit. Kentrell Brice fought his way in for playing time as a rookie and generally played quite well as did Marwin Evans to a lesser extent. Perhaps we can afford to let Burnett walk if one of those younger guys can fill his shoes. Perhaps one of them has already made Hyde expendable as well.


1. Jones' system at UCLA was the closest college comparision to our defense in the front 7. I have no idea what you're talking about transitioning schemes.

2. Peppers is a FA. You can't restructure a FA.

3. Lang was phenomenal this year. If you're cutting him it's because of the cap and the value paid at the position.

4. Bulaga's cap number in 2018 is 8.35 million. What are you smoking.

5. Marwin Evans played 25 snaps of defense all season and was near the ball on two plays, a completed pass for a first down and a blown INT that would've helped against Atlanta.

6. Burnett being expendable for Kentrell Brice/Marwin Evans is idiotic.


Applause

Perhaps we can resign Peppers for one more year at a lower price?

If Peppers declines how about resigning Lang for a veteran leader in the locker room? He seems to want to stay so maybe he will stick around and not want a king's ransom?

My biggest applause is for your response to #6. When Burnett is out of there our secondary is even worse.
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DavidatMIZZOU


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexGreen#20 wrote:


2. Peppers is a FA. You can't restructure a FA.

3. Lang was phenomenal this year. If you're cutting him it's because of the cap and the value paid at the position.



Lang is a FA as well. I think Lang wants to come back. I think the Packers probably want him back. I doubt that the dollars work out though.
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AlexGreen#20


Joined: 13 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 9:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DavidatMIZZOU wrote:
AlexGreen#20 wrote:


2. Peppers is a FA. You can't restructure a FA.

3. Lang was phenomenal this year. If you're cutting him it's because of the cap and the value paid at the position.



Lang is a FA as well. I think Lang wants to come back. I think the Packers probably want him back. I doubt that the dollars work out though.


You're right on Lang's FA status of course. I think I caught the stupid bug from his post. Confused

I have no read on Lang. I think he's undisputably the leader of the offense from a locker room perspective and that's a damn good football player.
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BroncoinGermany wrote:
From the day he was born and subsequently starting to grow into his short neck, round face, scruffy beard and pale face, Bulaga was destined to be a Packers O-Linemen for life.
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skibrett15


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Moving away from Sitton tells you all you need to know about Lang. Sitton was a damn fine LG but the org just went younger due to injury risk and salary. They went about it in about the worst way possible, but I think it speaks to the philosophy.
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CentralFC


Joined: 03 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 03, 2017 11:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

skibrett15 wrote:
Moving away from Sitton tells you all you need to know about Lang. Sitton was a damn fine LG but the org just went younger due to injury risk and salary. They went about it in about the worst way possible, but I think it speaks to the philosophy.


You sure it was injury risk and salary?
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Somebody take the off season shovel out of Ted's hands & bury him in his own hole.

How can he dig a hole if he's too busy sitting on his hands?
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