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2017 QB Thread - Version II
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Jlash


Joined: 17 Oct 2016
Posts: 2133
Location: NJ
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pat Mahomes on NFL Network today, had a throwing contest against David Carr . Missed Heath Evans from 10 yards away on 2 of his 5 throws.
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justo


Joined: 05 Aug 2012
Posts: 14349
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DraftHobbyist wrote:
justo wrote:
Listen, I won't make excuses for the USC game. He has that one throw on like a third and short near the 25 where he throws over a guy with two other defenders closing in like his dropped touchdown against Texas, but the game is horrible other than that. USC for sure was the worst non-weather game I saw from him. West Virginia for Mahomes isn't close, though. Laughing

That Stanford cut is an accuracy/timing/confidence issue, tho. Middle of the field open=throw the post. He found the open man, just late. Be a robot. You can teach the rest. Accuracy/timing/confidence will get better with reps and Kizer has never had an offseason when he's been the named starter. Think about that for a second Laughing He's there mentally, and I'd say 80% of the game is mental and tools based. A+ mentally up until the end of it at Notre Dame. Plus arm (not Rodgers/Carr/Vick) and probably the best run threat of the top four QBs, even though his 40 time doesn't reflect it.

Side note: Am I crazy for thinking that Trubisky is more of a run threat than Watson?


No, but you are crazy for thinking Kizer is the best scrambler of the Top 4 QB's.
Run threat=designed
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Epyon


Joined: 02 Jan 2013
Posts: 449
PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jlash wrote:
Pat Mahomes on NFL Network today, had a throwing contest against David Carr . Missed Heath Evans from 10 yards away on 2 of his 5 throws.


To be fair, he was also trying to throw his fastest ball at a target 10 yards away, but yeah he missed like hell when hit that 62mph ball.
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Calvin-Stafford


Joined: 29 Dec 2013
Posts: 1795
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Epyon wrote:
Jlash wrote:
Pat Mahomes on NFL Network today, had a throwing contest against David Carr . Missed Heath Evans from 10 yards away on 2 of his 5 throws.


To be fair, he was also trying to throw his fastest ball at a target 10 yards away, but yeah he missed like hell when hit that 62mph ball.

If it were possible for me to care a negative amount, as in less than 0, I would do so with this.
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Fullback


Joined: 26 Jan 2017
Posts: 33
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This "contest" showed us 4 things we didn't know:

1) Heath Evans has a poor reaction time.
2) Heath Evans has short arms.
3) Heath Evans can't jump at all.
4) David Carr can still sling it.

Laughing


To not be completely off topic, I think every QB in this class has certain strengths and flaws that are pretty obvious. Watson's leadership, Kizer's size, Trubisky's short-area accuracy, Mahomes' arm talent. I feel Mahomes most likely has most of these important attributes going for him. He is an enthusiastic leader with amazing work ethic, stocky body type with good functional athleticism, and good accuracy for a "gunslinger". Watson and Trubisky will never have half the arm of Mahomes, while Kizer's accuracy is very questionable

Contrary to the common vibe, Mahomes has the safest floor in my book. His personality will bring enthusiasm to a locker room. I care less about mechanics, he can sling it anywhere on the field with accuracy. That's why I like to compare him to Rivers, who is on the money with crazy mechanics. Footwork is Mahomes' biggest hurdle, but just watch the strides he's made since starting preparing for the draft. Mahomes can at the very least be Jay Cutler 2.0 on arm talent alone. That's a great floor for any QB prospect, especially outside the top 3 or so picks. But Mahomes can be so much more than Cutler 2.0 if he lands with the right franchise.
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justo


Joined: 05 Aug 2012
Posts: 14349
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do we think of PJ Walker?
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Jlash


Joined: 17 Oct 2016
Posts: 2133
Location: NJ
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
What do we think of PJ Walker?



We think he likes being called Phillip now.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok finalized my top 5. Though I've had different views throughout so when I say final I mean...who knows.

1. Brad Kaaya - I know this is different. But he seems the most naturally gifted of the class. He did progress like many hoped but I think Miami had a lot to do with that. Definitely has work to do and a little shell shock to get rid of but I think he has the best chance to be successful.

2. Pat Mahomes - Need to work on the footwork but has been by far the most successful passer

3. Mitch Trubisky - In theory I like his skills. But I hate the lack of experience. I think it is a far bigger deal than some are making it to be where it becomes just a passing comment on this is his "issue"

4. Deshone Kizer - has the tools but decision making last season was horrendous. Can't blame it all on Kelly and the the rest of the offense. But great two years ago gives me some hope.

5. Deshaun Watson - Honestly I just have way too many questions about his ability as a passer at the NFL level and in an NFL offense. Love his athleticism, but think he is too small to get the best out of it though maybe he can be Russell Wilson in that respect. Also love him showing up in big games. But also looked a bit bleh at times against lesser opponents. Also think Mike Williams bailed him out quite a few times. Like a lite version of what Mike Evans did for Manziel.
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Crickett


Joined: 27 Nov 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think all of the QB's drafted in the first round are going to be busts.

This reminds me of 2011 where the QB's have obvious flaws but everyone is ignoring them because teams need QB's. And like 2011, I'm sure I'll be wrong about one of them; I just don't know which one.
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G08


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 6916
Location: World Championsville
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

justo wrote:
jrry32 wrote:
Goff has started 7 games and did so in a totally dysfunctional situation. Goff will work out more than fine. Book it.
jrry no you're better than this


He really isn't, though. Just watch how pompus he gets when he's challenged -- it's hilarious -- and then he doubles down on Jared freaking Goff Laughing
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topwop1 wrote:
My point is you can find a franchise guy like [Derek] Carr in every draft


"I thought it was a stroke of genius. You give [Pace] an A++++ for the move to get Trubisky. That was magnificient." - Bill Polian
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Iamcanadian


Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 295
Location: Wallaceburg, Ontario, Canada
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe Mitch Trubisky has the most skill and consistency for the position, but that lack of experience takes him out as a top 10 prospect. Nevertheless, the need for a franchise QB is so great that some team may stretch and take him top 10. If a GM believes in Mitch Trubisky, they are going to take him high rather than risk losing him to another team Really, no college QB has experience in what he will be asked to do as a pro, but experience certainly helps in making the necessary adjustments in order to succeed at the next level, but in the end, the skillset is also needed for success and Mitch Trubisky ranks the highest in that area and is the reason, there is still talk of him going top 10.

The NFL Golden Rule is simple, "If you do not have a franchise QB, you just keep drafting them till you strike it rich."
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Forge


Joined: 19 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crickett wrote:
I think all of the QB's drafted in the first round are going to be busts.

This reminds me of 2011 where the QB's have obvious flaws but everyone is ignoring them because teams need QB's. And like 2011, I'm sure I'll be wrong about one of them; I just don't know which one.


Yep, I have almost no hope for most of the quarterbacks in this class...especially since I think teams do a very poor job of actually taking time to develop guys. It's why I'm such a stark opponent of drafting one early.
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Stupid NFL coaches and their need to reach for quarterbacks....
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Calvin-Stafford


Joined: 29 Dec 2013
Posts: 1795
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
3. Mitch Trubisky - In theory I like his skills. But I hate the lack of experience. I think it is a far bigger deal than some are making it to be where it becomes just a passing comment on this is his "issue"

Agrreed. I remember everyone wanting to crown Hackenberg as the next big thing after his first year of starting. It's worthwhile to see how defensive gameplans change to attack a QB's weaknesses and how the QB reacts to that.
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gah112


Joined: 30 Jan 2015
Posts: 817
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I could see one of Kaaya or Peterman being the best QB from this class.

Watson seems like a guy people are pushing up the board because of college success. When you look at his ability to throw the ball, I don't think he compares to other spread QBs who have had success in the NFL. I also worry about his decision-making because he seems to get locked into whatever the pre-snap read tells him. I don't see a guy who can process information quickly on the fly.
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CaliforniaKid7


Joined: 23 Jan 2010
Posts: 9367
Location: California
PostPosted: Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fullback wrote:
This "contest" showed us 4 things we didn't know:

1) Heath Evans has a poor reaction time.
2) Heath Evans has short arms.
3) Heath Evans can't jump at all.
4) David Carr can still sling it.

Laughing


To not be completely off topic, I think every QB in this class has certain strengths and flaws that are pretty obvious. Watson's leadership, Kizer's size, Trubisky's short-area accuracy, Mahomes' arm talent. I feel Mahomes most likely has most of these important attributes going for him. He is an enthusiastic leader with amazing work ethic, stocky body type with good functional athleticism, and good accuracy for a "gunslinger". Watson and Trubisky will never have half the arm of Mahomes, while Kizer's accuracy is very questionable

Contrary to the common vibe, Mahomes has the safest floor in my book. His personality will bring enthusiasm to a locker room. I care less about mechanics, he can sling it anywhere on the field with accuracy. That's why I like to compare him to Rivers, who is on the money with crazy mechanics. Footwork is Mahomes' biggest hurdle, but just watch the strides he's made since starting preparing for the draft. Mahomes can at the very least be Jay Cutler 2.0 on arm talent alone. That's a great floor for any QB prospect, especially outside the top 3 or so picks. But Mahomes can be so much more than Cutler 2.0 if he lands with the right franchise.


Okay now, I'm not a Cutler fan by any stretch of the imagination but the guy has been an average to above average QB for the better part of a decade. You're saying absolute worst case scenario Mahomes starts for almost 10 years? Please. Cutler has had a rough last few years and left a bad memory of himself but this is a little out there.

and by saying "Cutler 2.0" im assuming you think he'll be even better than Cutler worst case scenario?
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