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2017 KC Chiefs Roster Analysis - The Linebackers
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Jakuvious


Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Posts: 15164
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
Quote:
yes mayan switch to a 4-3 defense where our current LU would be

Houston Jones Bailey Ford
March Maugha Wilson
That's your LU, not mine.

I like
Chris Jones, Poe/draftee, Jaye Howard, Allen Bailey
Houston, Wilson/draftee, Ford

It's much easier to field this defense and draft to improve.


That group would get demolished in the pass game. And exhausted up front.
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Chiefs_5627


Joined: 26 Dec 2007
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Location: Lost inside my sick head
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
Quote:
yes mayan switch to a 4-3 defense where our current LU would be

Houston Jones Bailey Ford
March Maugha Wilson
That's your LU, not mine.

I like
Chris Jones, Poe/draftee, Jaye Howard, Allen Bailey
Houston, Wilson/draftee, Ford

It's much easier to field this defense and draft to improve.


You're not really sure how a 4-3 works, do ya? Read up man.
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mayanfootball


Joined: 13 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Mayan wants to play Goal Line every down
Where's the humor? Lots of teams play a 4-3 defense.
Seattle comes to mind. I'd love to have a Bobby Wagner as our MLB.
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mayanfootball


Joined: 13 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On Alexander:
Quote:
He was a 5th round pick. You don't draft a guy in the 5th expecting a starting caliber player. You draft a guy either because he can contribute in spots (special teams, rotations, etc.) or because they're high potential but high probability of failure.
I draft hoping they all can see the field, on a rotation if not starting. Or maybe as a backup. I don't draft for ST - that's a wasted pick.
High potential? Not Alexander - he's proved that on the field. I'd fear to put him in as OLB. The talent isn't there. So he fits your "high probability of failure" pool. Rotate the roster. Cull the dead weight.
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mayanfootball


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
You're not really sure how a 4-3 works, do ya? Read up man.
I know enough that 17 NFL teams use that scheme. That includes Tennessee and Tampa Bay who beat us, and New England and Atlanta who will probably be the SB teams.
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Rearviewmirror


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
Quote:
Mayan wants to play Goal Line every down
Where's the humor? Lots of teams play a 4-3 defense.
Seattle comes to mind. I'd love to have a Bobby Wagner as our MLB.



do you REALLY not understand the difference between KJ Wright, Bobby Wagner vs Dee Ford and Justin Houston is terms of how those players play? Are you really that dense?
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Chiefs_5627


Joined: 26 Dec 2007
Posts: 3756
Location: Lost inside my sick head
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
Quote:
You're not really sure how a 4-3 works, do ya? Read up man.
I know enough that 17 NFL teams use that scheme. That includes Tennessee and Tampa Bay who beat us, and New England and Atlanta who will probably be the SB teams.



The lineup you put out is severely misguided man. SEVERELY. I get that other teams run it but you don't understand the upheaval in personel is would have to pull off to make it happen. Its not just as simple as you think it is there for showing you do not fully understand the 4-3. I want to give you examples of certain thing but not when you're not going to do a bit of open-minded research on assignments etc of the nuiance of 4-3. Read up on it man.
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Jakuvious


Joined: 06 Sep 2010
Posts: 15164
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
On Alexander:
Quote:
He was a 5th round pick. You don't draft a guy in the 5th expecting a starting caliber player. You draft a guy either because he can contribute in spots (special teams, rotations, etc.) or because they're high potential but high probability of failure.
I draft hoping they all can see the field, on a rotation if not starting. Or maybe as a backup. I don't draft for ST - that's a wasted pick.
High potential? Not Alexander - he's proved that on the field. I'd fear to put him in as OLB. The talent isn't there. So he fits your "high probability of failure" pool. Rotate the roster. Cull the dead weight.


He's not dead weight. Like I said, he plays more snaps at a higher level than many of our traditional backups. I don't understand how a Chiefs fan, of all people, can devalue special teams to such an absurd level.
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mayanfootball


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
do you REALLY not understand the difference between KJ Wright, Bobby Wagner vs Dee Ford and Justin Houston is terms of how those players play? Are you really that dense?
As a moderator, you should be ashamed of yourself for baiting and name-calling members who post. Also threatening to delete a member's post because you disagree with their thinking is more in tune with the Soviet Union, not the USA. Disagree with me, but you don't have to violate decency and the site's rules to do it.

To your post: Yes, I like Wagner as an MLB. We should be so lucky. If you want Houston and Ford on the field, fine. I do to. Just do it. Having a 4 man Dline shouldn't reallly make everyone go beserk. The status quo is unacceptable.
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KC_Guy


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mods, please shut down this thread.
Mayan, more than ready to discuss via PM.
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ArrowheadRage58


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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Location: Hate for the Donkeys is at a mile high
PostPosted: Wed Jan 18, 2017 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jakuvious wrote:
mayanfootball wrote:
Quote:
yes mayan switch to a 4-3 defense where our current LU would be

Houston Jones Bailey Ford
March Maugha Wilson
That's your LU, not mine.

I like
Chris Jones, Poe/draftee, Jaye Howard, Allen Bailey
Houston, Wilson/draftee, Ford

It's much easier to field this defense and draft to improve.


That group would get demolished in the pass game. And exhausted up front.


Yeah, as good as Jones is, him and Bailey aren't made to rush the passer in a 4-3. Houston and Ford would only rush the passer on rare blitz occasions. Is that what you want?

I'm gonna go ahead and continue the Sutton issue cuz we don't have a playoff game to talk about...we don't give up points, but I really think that's because we have really good players combined with Sutton's style.

Imagine if we didn't have stars at every level making plays in the RZ or intercepting passes, at the rate we are giving up all these yards and first downs, teams would likely score all over a Sutton D if his players were merely average.

I would even be more than willing to give up a few turnovers if it meant forcing a few more 3 and outs or getting off the field on 3rd downs more often. We are not catering our scheme to the type of players we have...we have the talent to be more suffocating.

And the pass rush, even when Houston, Ford, and Jones were all out there was not good enough. Even Tamba still ranked high in the league in pressures this year. 28th in sacks and low end of the league in pressures...I mean, who's fault is that? Last year we were first in pressures with one of the highest totals i've ever seen and that was also w/out Houston for a good chunk, without Jones, and an inferior Dee Ford.

Obviously that was a Sutton coached defense as well...and he's capable of doing a great job...he just can't be counted on from year to year or game to game. 2013 was pretty awful to end the year. 2014 he did a marvelous job considering our secondary pieces and no DJ. 2015 was great, but a letdown in key situations in the playoffs. 2016 was a step back in all phases...and showed in even the ultimate stat (points given up) and while 7th isn't bad, it's below expectations.

This team has the capabilities to be a bit more dominant, while still getting a fair amount of turnovers (Peters and Berry are still big playmakers and with more aggressive pass rushing, there is a chance for more strip sacks) and obviously keeping teams from scoring.

Even more so to my main point, the bend but don't break D is better suited to stop teams who are more likely to shoot themselves in the foot...the teams KC is trying to get over the hump against in the playoffs...NE and to a lesser extent Pit are far less likely to screw it up themselves and Sutton is basically gifting these teams a FG attempt before they start to bear down. That won't bring us a SB, imo. The way to beat Brady was shown last year and KC has very similar pieces, yet chooses to do the exact opposite.

No, he's not terrible...but he's not what this particular team needs to go where they wanna go.
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mayanfootball


Joined: 13 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I posted this earlier in the thread:
Quote:
Chiefs desperately need to draft 3 strong LB tacklers. This yr. showed just how poorly they've drafted here and were prepared for injury.
2 ILB's and an OLB. For those demanding we stay in a 3-4 defense, this is the only answer I see to improving our linebacking and stopping the run.
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KC_Guy


Joined: 07 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mayanfootball wrote:
I posted this earlier in the thread:
Quote:
Chiefs desperately need to draft 3 strong LB tacklers. This yr. showed just how poorly they've drafted here and were prepared for injury.
2 ILB's and an OLB. For those demanding we stay in a 3-4 defense, this is the only answer I see to improving our linebacking and stopping the run.


Ok, assuming the Chiefs go that way ... which rounds are you looking at? Three starting caliber guys right off the bat? Three backups/prospects? A mix of those? Who would you like to replace?

May be if you add a bit more to your thought process instead of just cranking out a number it would help to understand your approach.

I offered my take in the OP - a high ILB and a mid OLB. What's yours?
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mayanfootball


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2017 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Ok, assuming the Chiefs go that way ... which rounds are you looking at?
As underclassmen declare, good tackling LB's become available to us. 1st rd. ILB. 3rd. rd. LB as long as his name isn't Nico Johnson (another blown dp). Not particular about where the third LB taken (and depending on if ILB or OLB taken in the 3rd.rd). The draft board should dictate where/when.
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