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Who will be offensive + defensive coordinators?
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Broncofan


Joined: 02 Dec 2013
Posts: 3609
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
jsthomp2007 wrote:
AnAngryAmerican wrote:
BroncoinGermany wrote:
2) Troy Renck said that if the Broncos had wanted to keep Wade here at all costs, they could have simply signed him to a contract extension in the spring of 2016, during last season, or during the last couple of weeks. Why didn't they do it? Well, in his press conference right after Kubiak's retirement speech, Elway not only hinted at what he is looking for in the new HC, how they are going to attack the FA and the Draft, no, he also slipped in a comment how he was very disappointed (not is exact words) with the run defense. Perhaps Elway thinks he could do just as well or better long-term (again, Wade's age) with a Joseph/Woods combination?

I think the reason Elway didn't resign Wade last offseason was because he had at least an inkling that Kubiak might retire this season and you want to allow your HC to fill out his staff. Now, I agree with the premise that "why would any HC not want Wade as his DC" but it's the principle of it. I forgot who it was that said it but Elway has a reputation around the league as a heavy-handed GM and conducting a coaching search with the caveat of 'you have to keep Wade, Woods and Kollar' could be limiting.



Doesn't Reid run WCO? Which would mean Toub could lean that way in hiring an OC.

Yeah he does. The thinking is if Toub is hired that he would bring Matt Nagy, the current co-OC/QBs coach in KC with him here to be our OC, which is enormously preferable to Mike McDaniels, err, I mean, McCoy.


Scheme-wise, you have to like Toub/Nagy OC or Shanahan/Lafleur OC as the best way to upgrade our WCO, and hopefully address play-calling creativity and OL performance, without having to do a complete overhaul by scrapping the WCO.

Even ATL had an adjustment year with Shanahan in implementing his O in 2015. It would be hard to envision a different result if we were to scrap the WCO and adapt a new scheme. At the same time, we don't want the WCO in its present form, we want it evolve to include better OL-play by matching the right OL targets via draft & FA, and coaching them to peak performance (why I think OL coach is another key replacement, not just OC), and play-calling creativity. That's where both Toub/Nagy & Shanahan/Lafleur offer a better fit to keep the core scheme intact, but upgrade where we need it most.

To be fair to Joseph, the above isn't a guarantee he wouldn't have an OC who could do the same - just that if it's McCoy, I'm skeptical on his prowess at elevating the current WCO. But even if he's not a disaster as some (including myself) worry about as an OC on his own without a brilliant O mind paired with him (his HC/OC foil, or Peyton at QB), the other 2 just are a more natural fit to help address O without committing to a "hiccup" implementation year, or less-innovative OC.

Either way, the OC/DC dominoes fall once we know the HC, so hopefully we'll have more clarity very soon.
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bobdevine


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Latest news -- on Thursday the Broncos will interview Mike McCoy and Bill Musgrave for OC.

Last edited by bobdevine on Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
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elliot878


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We're interviewing Musgrave and McCoy for OC job. Musgrave will win the job based on his record and experience developing young QB's.
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elliot878


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Still expect Wade back. Only other option is LA. Doubt anyone wants to go to that dumpster fire, and he just doesn't seem like an LA guy.
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BroncoBruin


Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Musgrave/McCoy and Joe Woods.

Wonderful.
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BroncoBruin


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

elliot878 wrote:
Still expect Wade back. Only other option is LA. Doubt anyone wants to go to that dumpster fire, and he just doesn't seem like an LA guy.
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.

If you're just holding out hope so you can feel better about the Joseph hire, I get it.
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BroncosFan2010


Joined: 04 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.


If this is true, the most important question to ask is 'why?'.

He is the best DC in the NFL. He is 69, close to retirement but not there yet, but his age limits his ambition. He wants to stay a DC. That means that we could get 2-3 more years from him. Five years from a DC would be near unheard of consistency. He is literally the perfect DC. He, at least to an outsider, had no interest in getting promoted, in getting poached to another team. He seemed TOTALLY CONTENT. Totally.

And we may have just pushed him out the door. I have no words to describe how foolish Elway might, or likely will, look when that happens. Its frightening in its foolishness.

Moving to a younger guy makes little sense. If he is as good as Wade, he will simply leave for a HC job, likely before Wade would have retired.

Its just puzzling. Its infuriating. Its insane. [/quote]
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BroncoBruin


Joined: 06 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BroncosFan2010 wrote:
Quote:
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.


If this is true, the most important question to ask is 'why?'.

He is the best DC in the NFL. He is 69, close to retirement but not there yet, but his age limits his ambition. He wants to stay a DC. That means that we could get 2-3 more years from him. Five years from a DC would be near unheard of consistency. He is literally the perfect DC. He, at least to an outsider, had no interest in getting promoted, in getting poached to another team. He seemed TOTALLY CONTENT. Totally.

And we may have just pushed him out the door. I have no words to describe how foolish Elway might, or likely will, look when that happens. Its frightening in its foolishness.

Moving to a younger guy makes little sense. If he is as good as Wade, he will simply leave for a HC job, likely before Wade would have retired.

Its just puzzling. Its infuriating. Its insane.
[/quote]
It's a great question indeed. Would be higher on my agenda today if not for the fact that we're content to hand the keys to a POS offense to Mike McCoy or Bill Musgrave.
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champ11


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yo, what are our OC options though?

At least there is only one way to go in that department, lol
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broncofan48


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

champ11 wrote:
Yo, what are our OC options though?

At least there is only one way to go in that department, lol


Thats just it, who is out there everyone wants?

It isn't gonna be Shanahan, so what are the better realistic options?
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germ-x


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BroncosFan2010 wrote:
Quote:
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.


If this is true, the most important question to ask is 'why?'.

He is the best DC in the NFL. He is 69, close to retirement but not there yet, but his age limits his ambition. He wants to stay a DC. That means that we could get 2-3 more years from him. Five years from a DC would be near unheard of consistency. He is literally the perfect DC. He, at least to an outsider, had no interest in getting promoted, in getting poached to another team. He seemed TOTALLY CONTENT. Totally.

And we may have just pushed him out the door. I have no words to describe how foolish Elway might, or likely will, look when that happens. Its frightening in its foolishness.

Moving to a younger guy makes little sense. If he is as good as Wade, he will simply leave for a HC job, likely before Wade would have retired.

Its just puzzling. Its infuriating. Its insane.
[/quote]

No it's not. I said this last week as well. As long as Denver doesn't get some ultra conservative DC the defense will be fine. All Phillips really did was turn the defense lose, which is something Del Rio refused to do.

Phillips inability to adapt was incredibly frustrating. He didn't find an answer for short crossing routes for like 12 weeks straight and couldnt figure out how to stop the run.

I'm starting to get the feeling that Kubiak and his coaching staff were pushed out the door and the Kubiak health issue was just a convenient way to make it look as if he wasn't forced out the door.

I think Elway grew disgusted in this staff walking out every week and losing the exact same way.
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elliot878


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BroncoBruin wrote:
elliot878 wrote:
Still expect Wade back. Only other option is LA. Doubt anyone wants to go to that dumpster fire, and he just doesn't seem like an LA guy.
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.

If you're just holding out hope so you can feel better about the Joseph hire, I get it.


I'm not that guy. I'm fine with the hire. Just happy it wasn't Shanny.
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broncosfan_101


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike McCoy would be 10x the hire Bill Musgrave would be. For coordinators, where we don't have a really great idea of how much to attribute success/failure to, I start with their previous tenures. Bill Musgrave has about 8 lateral moves on his resume in less than 20 years. Nobody wants him around. Mike McCoy was with the Panthers for 9 years, got promoted to Denver, then promoted to SD. That's it. This is his first step back, the first time someone decided they didn't want him on their staff anymore. In 17 years of coaching. That might be simplistic, but based on the very limited evidence we have, it makes the most sense to me.
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broncosfan_101


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

elliot878 wrote:
BroncoBruin wrote:
elliot878 wrote:
Still expect Wade back. Only other option is LA. Doubt anyone wants to go to that dumpster fire, and he just doesn't seem like an LA guy.
Basically every report suggests Wade is gone and would be pushed out the door even if he wanted to come back. If he has no options, he'll probably just retire.

If you're just holding out hope so you can feel better about the Joseph hire, I get it.


I'm not that guy. I'm fine with the hire. Just happy it wasn't Shanny.


Wouldn't be surprised at all if Wade got the 'Assistant Head Coach' title, while Woods gets promoted to DC.
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Lomax taking home the MVP. Good choice. Solid poster and BP hater Wink
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BroncoinGermany


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reasons for Wade to stay:

- personell: top-3 D in football

Reasons for Wade to leave:

- material: more money elsewhere
- sentimental: family in LA and in Redskins organization


Reasons for Elway wanting Wade to stay:

- PR: Bronco Country loves him
- personell: Wade a top defensive mind
- sentimental: SB 50

Reasons for Elway wanting Wade to go:

- material: budget
- personell: Woods a top secondary, thereby potentially D, coach
- future: Woods highly regarded; Wade's age
- scheme/lesson of the past: Wade's D production drop off after initial success
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