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Who will be offensive + defensive coordinators?
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bobdevine


Joined: 24 Jan 2008
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Location: Wisconsin
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:27 pm    Post subject: Who will be offensive + defensive coordinators? Reply with quote

With a new head coach, who will be the coordinators?

With the 3 candidates for head coach, the odds are very low that Rick Dennison will return as OC. A new HC probably wants his own OC.

I also suspect that the odds are dropping that Wade Phillips will be back. There's an opening for DC with the Redskins (Wade's son works there) that might be offered to Phillips. If so, the Broncos will need to find someone to run the defense.


Last edited by bobdevine on Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Broncofan


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great Q, but on OC, that's completely linked to whoever we hire as HC. A guy like Shanahan & Toub have guys lined up, so long as the rules for hiring from other teams don't interfere (Toub & likely Matt Nagy; Shanahan & Matt Lafleur - I believe it was BB who called that one).

DC-wise, we'd be nuts to have anyone but Wade be DC. Even if Vance Joseph is hired. I think that's part of why Elway is lining the interviews as quickly as possible - make a HC decision with the HC hire signing off on Wade staying, then Elway can call Wade up and tell him the job is his, if he wants (I don't see $ figures being an issue between the 2).

A better Q is if we replace ST. I think it's a no-brainer yes. 5th highest penalties, and DVOA we were 22nd (and 14th the year before) - and the best parts of that were PK/punting, which the coaching affects far less than they do in punt/KO returns and coverage.
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paul-mac


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Broncofan wrote:
Great Q, but on OC, that's completely linked to whoever we hire as HC. A guy like Shanahan & Toub have guys lined up, so long as the rules for hiring from other teams don't interfere (Toub & likely Matt Nagy; Shanahan & Matt Lafleur - I believe it was BB who called that one).

DC-wise, we'd be nuts to have anyone but Wade be DC. Even if Vance Joseph is hired. I think that's part of why Elway is lining the interviews as quickly as possible - make a HC decision with the HC hire signing off on Wade staying, then Elway can call Wade up and tell him the job is his, if he wants (I don't see $ figures being an issue between the 2).

A better Q is if we replace ST. I think it's a no-brainer yes. 5th highest penalties, and DVOA we were 22nd (and 14th the year before) - and the best parts of that were PK/punting, which the coaching affects far less than they do in punt/KO returns and coverage.


If Dave Toub gets the job then we can just hire a young guy to learn the ropes as a special teams coordinator because Toub is a guru in that area

I personally see us hiring Vance Joseph and him firing Wade Phillips and Dennison. Mike McCoy as the OC and some donut fetching lackey as the DC
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BroncosFan2010


Joined: 04 Feb 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

I personally see us hiring Vance Joseph and him firing Wade Phillips and Dennison. Mike McCoy as the OC and some donut fetching lackey as the DC


I have no issue with a Vance signing, although I prefer Toub.

But, any new coach who fires Wade is going to be asking for a quick career here. You get rid of that man after the past two seasons he has had, and your going to get lynched if the defense regresses even from top 5 to top 10 next season. Even if that regression is natural. It will all be blamed on the coach who let the magic DC get away.

Its an awful idea in theory and practice. You let Wade stay until he retires or loses the defense. The former seems sooner than the latter, those guys would kill for him.
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AnAngryAmerican


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

paul-mac wrote:
I personally see us hiring Vance Joseph and him firing Wade Phillips and Dennison. Mike McCoy as the OC and some donut fetching lackey as the DC

Sounds like the McDisaster all over again.
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thebestever6


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Part of me wants to get rid of wade not because of production just based on age the guy who filled in for him did a good job and has been learning under him.


If we can promote that guy and there's minimal regression we risk losing him to a defensive coordinator position. Wade has two years left max I want a bigger window personally.
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thebestever6


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Toub bringing in Matt Nagy and retaining Philips makes too much sense. If you remember this past off season Chiefs wanted Paxton Lynch too groom behind Alex Smith so obviously he's a nice Schenectady fit.
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The Helicopter


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doesn't matter what happens on Offense, it will improve. Defense will regress if Wade isn't retained. How those two equations balance out is key.
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BroncoinGermany


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the reports are true that Joseph would insert Joe Woods as his DC, it might have to do more with Wade just wanting to leave than Joseph making a power or mere lackey move.

    1) I cannot believe it has ever come to this point, but I somewhat have to agree with D-MAC's reasoning on The Fan last night: Wade's son is on the Redskins coaching staff, Wade almost selected the Skins' DC position two years ago, Wade is a coaching vagabond, and just because he is up in age does not mean he just ignores the money part of it. If Kubiak is a loyal friend and family guy, who not only wanted to work for his buddy Elway, but also with his tight-knit staff of coaching friends as well as with two of his sons nearby as scouts for the organization, why wouldn't Wade be similar to him? Kubiak did not get knocked for it because he could balance the pro side with the private side of football. If it turned out to be not so much of a firing of Wade but him leaving, who could fault him?

    2) Troy Renck said that if the Broncos had wanted to keep Wade here at all costs, they could have simply signed him to a contract extension in the spring of 2016, during last season, or during the last couple of weeks. Why didn't they do it? Well, in his press conference right after Kubiak's retirement speech, Elway not only hinted at what he is looking for in the new HC, how they are going to attack the FA and the Draft, no, he also slipped in a comment how he was very disappointed (not is exact words) with the run defense. Perhaps Elway thinks he could do just as well or better long-term (again, Wade's age) with a Joseph/Woods combination?

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ElJefe7


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im trying to figure out where the "Vance Joseph will simply hire a donut fetcher" is coming from. Because based on every report about the guy is almost unanimously admired and respected as a leader of men. Now, I would definitely keep Wade in any scenario, but to equate a guy bringing in his own staff, which is par for the course of a head coach, and him just having a yes man is a baseless claim. I would be happy with either Joseph or Toub. I think they are head and shoulders over Shanahan in my opinion. That doesn't mean they will get the job just my personal opinion.

However, the unjustfied or unfounded criticism of Joseph is crazy. There is a lot to like. He has shown the flexibility as DC to change his system according to personnel. He has called Wade the biggest influence on his career so one would imagine a similar scheme. He got notable terrible locker room guys like Williams and Suh to buy into his system and has shown to be a motivator of men. Again, all candidates are qualified and I have no issue with someone preferring another guy. However, this notion that he is going to be McDaniels and just look for a lackey is not based in any of the reports or opinions of those who cover him.
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broncos67


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Joe Woods is an up and coming talent that it seems Denver wants to keep. I just don't really get why people like Vance Joseph. It's not like Kyle Shanahan where at least he's running a prolific offense. Joseph's defense stinks, he only has a limited amount of experience running a defense, and while he may be a good leader of men, it seems kind of hard to understand how you glean that from his work as a secondary coach.
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ElJefe7


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

broncos67 wrote:
Joe Woods is an up and coming talent that it seems Denver wants to keep. I just don't really get why people like Vance Joseph. It's not like Kyle Shanahan where at least he's running a prolific offense. Joseph's defense stinks, he only has a limited amount of experience running a defense, and while he may be a good leader of men, it seems kind of hard to understand how you glean that from his work as a secondary coach.


For me it is more from reports about him. However, I think it is a legit queztion. It is one Im sure Elway will work out in the interview.
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AnAngryAmerican


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BroncoinGermany wrote:
2) Troy Renck said that if the Broncos had wanted to keep Wade here at all costs, they could have simply signed him to a contract extension in the spring of 2016, during last season, or during the last couple of weeks. Why didn't they do it? Well, in his press conference right after Kubiak's retirement speech, Elway not only hinted at what he is looking for in the new HC, how they are going to attack the FA and the Draft, no, he also slipped in a comment how he was very disappointed (not is exact words) with the run defense. Perhaps Elway thinks he could do just as well or better long-term (again, Wade's age) with a Joseph/Woods combination?

I think the reason Elway didn't resign Wade last offseason was because he had at least an inkling that Kubiak might retire this season and you want to allow your HC to fill out his staff. Now, I agree with the premise that "why would any HC not want Wade as his DC" but it's the principle of it. I forgot who it was that said it but Elway has a reputation around the league as a heavy-handed GM and conducting a coaching search with the caveat of 'you have to keep Wade, Woods and Kollar' could be limiting.
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jsthomp2007


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
BroncoinGermany wrote:
2) Troy Renck said that if the Broncos had wanted to keep Wade here at all costs, they could have simply signed him to a contract extension in the spring of 2016, during last season, or during the last couple of weeks. Why didn't they do it? Well, in his press conference right after Kubiak's retirement speech, Elway not only hinted at what he is looking for in the new HC, how they are going to attack the FA and the Draft, no, he also slipped in a comment how he was very disappointed (not is exact words) with the run defense. Perhaps Elway thinks he could do just as well or better long-term (again, Wade's age) with a Joseph/Woods combination?

I think the reason Elway didn't resign Wade last offseason was because he had at least an inkling that Kubiak might retire this season and you want to allow your HC to fill out his staff. Now, I agree with the premise that "why would any HC not want Wade as his DC" but it's the principle of it. I forgot who it was that said it but Elway has a reputation around the league as a heavy-handed GM and conducting a coaching search with the caveat of 'you have to keep Wade, Woods and Kollar' could be limiting.



Doesn't Reid run WCO? Which would mean Toub could lean that way in hiring an OC.
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AnAngryAmerican


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jsthomp2007 wrote:
AnAngryAmerican wrote:
BroncoinGermany wrote:
2) Troy Renck said that if the Broncos had wanted to keep Wade here at all costs, they could have simply signed him to a contract extension in the spring of 2016, during last season, or during the last couple of weeks. Why didn't they do it? Well, in his press conference right after Kubiak's retirement speech, Elway not only hinted at what he is looking for in the new HC, how they are going to attack the FA and the Draft, no, he also slipped in a comment how he was very disappointed (not is exact words) with the run defense. Perhaps Elway thinks he could do just as well or better long-term (again, Wade's age) with a Joseph/Woods combination?

I think the reason Elway didn't resign Wade last offseason was because he had at least an inkling that Kubiak might retire this season and you want to allow your HC to fill out his staff. Now, I agree with the premise that "why would any HC not want Wade as his DC" but it's the principle of it. I forgot who it was that said it but Elway has a reputation around the league as a heavy-handed GM and conducting a coaching search with the caveat of 'you have to keep Wade, Woods and Kollar' could be limiting.



Doesn't Reid run WCO? Which would mean Toub could lean that way in hiring an OC.

Yeah he does. The thinking is if Toub is hired that he would bring Matt Nagy, the current co-OC/QBs coach in KC with him here to be our OC, which is enormously preferable to Mike McDaniels, err, I mean, McCoy.
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