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m haynes


Joined: 29 Jan 2011
Posts: 1611
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LD696 wrote:
OK, I'll get this off my chest:

How do you think Christian McCaffrey would do with the Pats? Could they fit him on the roster?

He's not the guy they should be looking for, who can give Blount some competition, and the spectrum of opinions about him is quite wide. I see a patient runner, who can wait for his blocks to develop and is tougher than given credit for. He's versatile, who lined up all over the field and offers kick return ability. Problem is, they'll probably would have to invest a higher draft pick than they'd like to spend on a RB.


You like this article

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000693045/article/sources-tell-us-what-were-hearing-about-christian-mccaffrey

Quote:
His versatility as a rusher-receiver-returner is a huge asset.
3 in one not bad! Very Happy
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MoJo63


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000715303/article/2017-nfl-draft-order-and-needs-playoff-teams

By no means am I saying this is the tell all, because we all know there will be 1000 opinions of what each team needs between now and the draft but this is an example of the " Pundits" expressing the Pats need for a TE.
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1ForTheThumb


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"He's a frat bro" is the biggest forced statement when it comes to Gronk. He parties like your normal 27 year old single guy would with money. I guess you can say because he drinks and enjoys lifting, he's a frat bro. But the guy is an extremely hard worker and has never gotten into any trouble. I think his constant rehab and coming back from injuries shows a lot more about his work ethic and his "off the field" question marks.

Let's not act like he's Johnny Manziel. He's actually a smart dude. He's very involved in the community/giving back, has been opening up a few gyms, runs football camps and hasn't spent a dime of his contract money, only bonuses and endorsements.

The issue comes down to if you value the risk of injury, or frequent injury vs. his current contract status. He's still underpaid and is the best weapon in football. The Pats own all the leverage.

I think it'd be dumb to trade him.
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1ForTheThumb


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Should clarify, I mean the Pats have the leverage in terms of his contract. Not trade value.
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MoJo63


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1ForTheThumb wrote:
Should clarify, I mean the Pats have the leverage in terms of his contract. Not trade value.


Yeah I can't see the Pats trading him and I suspect Bennett may be the odd man out and if so I would embrace Howard. If we retain Bennett I suspect TE is off the table as Lengel shows some promise.
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
dhunt2402 wrote:
Starless wrote:
Using a 1st rounder on a TE would be absolutely idiotic.


If a tight end is the best player available, I'd have no issue whatsoever.


Assuming one of Bennett/Gronk is gone? I think it would be insane to take a TE in the first if both of those guys are there unless they've written off Gronk and are assuming he's a non-factor.

If you give Bennett a big contract, and have Gronk for a big cap hit, it seems like questionable at best asset management to sink a 1st rounder in the position.


I mean they'd have to be absolutely sold on a guy to do it, but if the clear best player on Belichick's draft board is a tight end I would be OK with pulling the trigger. No one knows what Gronk has left in him, and Bennett will be 30 next season. It would probably something close to a generational talent, sure. Not saying they'll see OJ Howard that way, but I think it's a possibility. He's really good, Saban will rave about him to Belichick I'm sure. Picks in the 25-35 range fail to pan out often enough, you're not exactly punting on a sure thing at a position of need (Easley, Brown, Dowling, etc). If they see a guy at pretty much any position on offense or defense that they like much better than anyone else, IBWT.
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mcmurtry86


Joined: 02 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1ForTheThumb wrote:
"He's a frat bro" is the biggest forced statement when it comes to Gronk. He parties like your normal 27 year old single guy would with money. I guess you can say because he drinks and enjoys lifting, he's a frat bro. But the guy is an extremely hard worker and has never gotten into any trouble. I think his constant rehab and coming back from injuries shows a lot more about his work ethic and his "off the field" question marks.

Let's not act like he's Johnny Manziel. He's actually a smart dude. He's very involved in the community/giving back, has been opening up a few gyms, runs football camps and hasn't spent a dime of his contract money, only bonuses and endorsements.

The issue comes down to if you value the risk of injury, or frequent injury vs. his current contract status. He's still underpaid and is the best weapon in football. The Pats own all the leverage.

I think it'd be dumb to trade him.


Laughing forced statement to call him a frat bro? Let's break this down

1. Parties like every other normal 27 year old with money? Obviously hyperbole and I don't see too many other NFL players getting as much media attention for party antics. What percentage of 27 year olds end up in TMZ or in the gossip rags?

2. Someone said he's a valuable off field commodity. It's not forced at all to point out that the dumb jock party boy routine has limited appeal and tends to get old. Obviously Gronk has more to him off field than being a party animal but that other stuff isn't marketable and has limited actual value to a team. Yeah great he's charitable and does stuff with youth. A ton of players do (remember the complaints here from a few members about cutting Mesko due to his significant contributions to local communities?). Nobody is saying he's not a good guy, a charitable guy or a hard worker. But when you acquire Gronk, the off field image is not a guy who runs youth camps for a week in July. It's the guy who takes drunken shirtless pictures with porn models and hosts huge blowout parties. It might surprise some younger fans, but that type of behavior isn't something everyone finds marketable or desirable in their players. I don't have an issue with it and the Pats tolerate it but it's certainly a consideration in any trade value conversation.

3. I could see his high visibility partying as a distraction to some teams or some coaches. Seems to be a pretty inoffensive and obvious statement and hardly "forced"
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bluemushrooms


Joined: 10 Dec 2013
Posts: 2860
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
1ForTheThumb wrote:
"He's a frat bro" is the biggest forced statement when it comes to Gronk. He parties like your normal 27 year old single guy would with money. I guess you can say because he drinks and enjoys lifting, he's a frat bro. But the guy is an extremely hard worker and has never gotten into any trouble. I think his constant rehab and coming back from injuries shows a lot more about his work ethic and his "off the field" question marks.

Let's not act like he's Johnny Manziel. He's actually a smart dude. He's very involved in the community/giving back, has been opening up a few gyms, runs football camps and hasn't spent a dime of his contract money, only bonuses and endorsements.

The issue comes down to if you value the risk of injury, or frequent injury vs. his current contract status. He's still underpaid and is the best weapon in football. The Pats own all the leverage.

I think it'd be dumb to trade him.


Laughing forced statement to call him a frat bro? Let's break this down

1. Parties like every other normal 27 year old with money? Obviously hyperbole and I don't see too many other NFL players getting as much media attention for party antics. What percentage of 27 year olds end up in TMZ or in the gossip rags?

2. Someone said he's a valuable off field commodity. It's not forced at all to point out that the dumb jock party boy routine has limited appeal and tends to get old. Obviously Gronk has more to him off field than being a party animal but that other stuff isn't marketable and has limited actual value to a team. Yeah great he's charitable and does stuff with youth. A ton of players do (remember the complaints here from a few members about cutting Mesko due to his significant contributions to local communities?). Nobody is saying he's not a good guy, a charitable guy or a hard worker. But when you acquire Gronk, the off field image is not a guy who runs youth camps for a week in July. It's the guy who takes drunken shirtless pictures with porn models and hosts huge blowout parties. It might surprise some younger fans, but that type of behavior isn't something everyone finds marketable or desirable in their players. I don't have an issue with it and the Pats tolerate it but it's certainly a consideration in any trade value conversation.

3. I could see his high visibility partying as a distraction to some teams or some coaches. Seems to be a pretty inoffensive and obvious statement and hardly "forced"


I think the issue is that frat bro has negative connotations regarding one's personality traits moreso than actions...which is why I would hesitate to call Gronk a frat bro too.

Gronk loves to party but, being a frat bro involves more than just partying so, it's not a great descriptor for Gronk.
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1ForTheThumb


Joined: 06 Dec 2016
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bluemushrooms wrote:
mcmurtry86 wrote:
1ForTheThumb wrote:
"He's a frat bro" is the biggest forced statement when it comes to Gronk. He parties like your normal 27 year old single guy would with money. I guess you can say because he drinks and enjoys lifting, he's a frat bro. But the guy is an extremely hard worker and has never gotten into any trouble. I think his constant rehab and coming back from injuries shows a lot more about his work ethic and his "off the field" question marks.

Let's not act like he's Johnny Manziel. He's actually a smart dude. He's very involved in the community/giving back, has been opening up a few gyms, runs football camps and hasn't spent a dime of his contract money, only bonuses and endorsements.

The issue comes down to if you value the risk of injury, or frequent injury vs. his current contract status. He's still underpaid and is the best weapon in football. The Pats own all the leverage.

I think it'd be dumb to trade him.


Laughing forced statement to call him a frat bro? Let's break this down

1. Parties like every other normal 27 year old with money? Obviously hyperbole and I don't see too many other NFL players getting as much media attention for party antics. What percentage of 27 year olds end up in TMZ or in the gossip rags?

2. Someone said he's a valuable off field commodity. It's not forced at all to point out that the dumb jock party boy routine has limited appeal and tends to get old. Obviously Gronk has more to him off field than being a party animal but that other stuff isn't marketable and has limited actual value to a team. Yeah great he's charitable and does stuff with youth. A ton of players do (remember the complaints here from a few members about cutting Mesko due to his significant contributions to local communities?). Nobody is saying he's not a good guy, a charitable guy or a hard worker. But when you acquire Gronk, the off field image is not a guy who runs youth camps for a week in July. It's the guy who takes drunken shirtless pictures with porn models and hosts huge blowout parties. It might surprise some younger fans, but that type of behavior isn't something everyone finds marketable or desirable in their players. I don't have an issue with it and the Pats tolerate it but it's certainly a consideration in any trade value conversation.

3. I could see his high visibility partying as a distraction to some teams or some coaches. Seems to be a pretty inoffensive and obvious statement and hardly "forced"


I think the issue is that frat bro has negative connotations regarding one's personality traits moreso than actions...which is why I would hesitate to call Gronk a frat bro too.

Gronk loves to party but, being a frat bro involves more than just partying so, it's not a great descriptor for Gronk.


You hit the nail on the head. Gronk is like a golden retriever, harmless.
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1ForTheThumb


Joined: 06 Dec 2016
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If his "acts" that only "young people don't get bothered by" he wouldn't be landed endorsement deals.
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mcmurtry86


Joined: 02 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1ForTheThumb wrote:
If his "acts" that only "young people don't get bothered by" he wouldn't be landed endorsement deals.


Laughing Laughing Laughing

Who do you think the vast majority of athlete endorsements are targeted towards? Kids and young adults. Other than Dunkin Donuts (local appeal he would lose if he left New England), his endorsements are all with companies that target products to kids and jocks - Nike, Under Armor, Monster.

I'm not trying to bash the guy, but his entire off field persona is built on being a dumb partying jock. That might not be who he truly is, but it's who he is marketing himself to be. There's nothing wrong with that type of persona. But let's call a spade a spade here. In a lot of markets, and in a lot of demographics, that doesn't sell quite as well. I don't think it adds a lot of value to any team trying to acquire him.

He's done a tremendous job building an off-field brand, and it's commendable that he's (reportedly) living off the endorsements and saving/investing his NFL paychecks. But his off field stuff has limited-to-no value to his team and primarily benefits Gronk Inc.
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mcmurtry86


Joined: 02 Mar 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bluemushrooms wrote:
mcmurtry86 wrote:
1ForTheThumb wrote:
"He's a frat bro" is the biggest forced statement when it comes to Gronk. He parties like your normal 27 year old single guy would with money. I guess you can say because he drinks and enjoys lifting, he's a frat bro. But the guy is an extremely hard worker and has never gotten into any trouble. I think his constant rehab and coming back from injuries shows a lot more about his work ethic and his "off the field" question marks.

Let's not act like he's Johnny Manziel. He's actually a smart dude. He's very involved in the community/giving back, has been opening up a few gyms, runs football camps and hasn't spent a dime of his contract money, only bonuses and endorsements.

The issue comes down to if you value the risk of injury, or frequent injury vs. his current contract status. He's still underpaid and is the best weapon in football. The Pats own all the leverage.

I think it'd be dumb to trade him.


Laughing forced statement to call him a frat bro? Let's break this down

1. Parties like every other normal 27 year old with money? Obviously hyperbole and I don't see too many other NFL players getting as much media attention for party antics. What percentage of 27 year olds end up in TMZ or in the gossip rags?

2. Someone said he's a valuable off field commodity. It's not forced at all to point out that the dumb jock party boy routine has limited appeal and tends to get old. Obviously Gronk has more to him off field than being a party animal but that other stuff isn't marketable and has limited actual value to a team. Yeah great he's charitable and does stuff with youth. A ton of players do (remember the complaints here from a few members about cutting Mesko due to his significant contributions to local communities?). Nobody is saying he's not a good guy, a charitable guy or a hard worker. But when you acquire Gronk, the off field image is not a guy who runs youth camps for a week in July. It's the guy who takes drunken shirtless pictures with porn models and hosts huge blowout parties. It might surprise some younger fans, but that type of behavior isn't something everyone finds marketable or desirable in their players. I don't have an issue with it and the Pats tolerate it but it's certainly a consideration in any trade value conversation.

3. I could see his high visibility partying as a distraction to some teams or some coaches. Seems to be a pretty inoffensive and obvious statement and hardly "forced"


I think the issue is that frat bro has negative connotations regarding one's personality traits moreso than actions...which is why I would hesitate to call Gronk a frat bro too.

Gronk loves to party but, being a frat bro involves more than just partying so, it's not a great descriptor for Gronk.


Not going to go down this road too much but when you say stuff like this about your frat parties

Rob Gronkowski wrote:
Guys were coming at me from behind and from all angles … Eventually eight of them got me to the ground, and I was taking kicks everywhere, but our quarterback, Willie Tuitama, ran in and helped get me out of there. The girl I had been friendly with told me that I looked like the Hulk throwing four dudes off me. She loved it and definitely made it up to me later.


Quote:
“We would invite all the hot athletic and sorority girls over then take dishwashing liquid and squirt it all over the floor to get it slippery. We would then squirt it all over ourselves... then throw water all over the place. The name of the game was to make it from door to door sliding on your chest.”

“Somebody was always naked and the girls loved it when our underwear slid off,” he writes.


You're going to be the idol of every frat bro out there. He's written a book about that lifestyle, has had his own party cruises, party buses, and his antics are legendary in Arizona (like how he "charged" women their bikini tops to go into his hot tub).

Whether or not you consider him to be that type of guy is irrelevant. It is exactly who he is portraying himself to be.
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goldfishwars


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's keep it on topic guys.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2017 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think this has to be the year they bring in competition for Blount as the "lead" back. Despite the bulk stats this year, he wasn't especially good, doesn't offer anything in the pass game, is getting old and is only effective against specific opponents. Bringing in a veteran probably doesn't make sense since that guy is likely to be a gameday inactive most weeks (assuming Blount is re-signed and White, Bolden and Lewis all return). Someone who can take over in 2018 would be ideal. Typically, it takes a year of development for a RB to learn the offense and pass protections.

There is a glut of RB's available this year in the draft so I would hope that a 3rd - 5th rounder is used on one. with another body brought to camp via undrafted FA.
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ChazStandard


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2017 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the topic of RBs, I'm confused by the teams apparent attachment to DJ Foster, he's been essentially a wasted roster spot since Lewis came back, and didn't contribute anything meaningful before that either. The coaches obviously value him.

I didn't follow his college career at all, assuming he stays around next year could he ever be a true RB at pro level? Or is he purely a scat-back type? If he stays around next year, will it be at the expense of White and/or Lewis?
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