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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:14 pm    Post subject: 2017 Draft Prospects & Discussion Reply with quote

Figured we'd get this started now. Quiet couple of weeks ahead before our next game Wink

Watching the Cotton Bowl, I really like the look of Wisconsin's left tackle, Ramczyk. Not sure he'll be available where we're picking in the first, but he's gonna have hip surgery after this game which might let other guys build more hype and jump ahead of him in the draft.
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reamer


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty far into my evaluations this year. Let me know if there any requests for a player or position. I'm not always right, but I do try to grade consistently and explain what I've seen with a prospect. Very exciting defensive class this year.
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ChazStandard


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With Gronk's back possibly a long-term issue, and Bennett already 30, you have to think TE is a draft priority. Unless there's a trade or FA move, I would expect a TE in first three rounds.

That's just based on the roster as is, I don't follow CFB so I have no idea what prospects there are at TE.

Harmon's likely exit means safety will be a need - so pencil-in whoever started at safety for Rutgers with our second rounder.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with drafting a TE early is that if Gronk is healthy and if Bennett is retained for 3-4 years, you've just spent a valuable draft asset on a guy who needs to wait for Gronkowski to get hurt to play. Sure, you could rotate and they would find snaps for him, but it's a bit of a waste when there are real holes on the roster.

I think their best play, unless they have a top prospect slide into their lap, is to take a few shots on mid/late round talent to develop. Or maybe they think Lengel can be that guy. On top of that, they have Michael Williams coming back and they can find a #3 veteran with some ability to at least be a #2 (e.g. Hoomanawanui type).

If Bennett is back, he's your starting TE for the foreseeable future and you really just need a guy who can stand in for 3-4 weeks if Bennett has a minor/moderate injury (e.g. sprained ankle). Whatever Gronk gives you is a bonus. I think they have to move away from expecting Gronkowski to be healthy and an important team because his body clearly doesn't have much left in it.
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Starless


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The way I see it, the top priorities should be:

1. Pass rusher (either edge or 3/5-tech. Flowers has showed he can man one spot, and Long/Sheard could be valuable rotational guys for another year or two but they need to set themselves up for life after them).

2. WLB (McClellin has been decent the last few weeks but they can definitely upgrade from him)

3. DB (depends on where things fall with Harmon and Ryan but they would need to add both a corner and a safety if they lose both).

4. RB (Blount will be coming off a career year but he just turned 30 so they need to have someone on board who could fill a similar role should he hit the wall)

5. OC (Andrews is decent but his upside is limited and he was clearly the weak link on the OL this year)
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1ForTheThumb


Joined: 06 Dec 2016
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Desmond King is a corner who's really impressed me throughout his career and wouldn't mind them drafting.

I hope they go LB or DE in round 1.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 6:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Starless wrote:
The way I see it, the top priorities should be:

1. Pass rusher (either edge or 3/5-tech. Flowers has showed he can man one spot, and Long/Sheard could be valuable rotational guys for another year or two but they need to set themselves up for life after them).

2. WLB (McClellin has been decent the last few weeks but they can definitely upgrade from him)

3. DB (depends on where things fall with Harmon and Ryan but they would need to add both a corner and a safety if they lose both).

4. RB (Blount will be coming off a career year but he just turned 30 so they need to have someone on board who could fill a similar role should he hit the wall)

5. OC (Andrews is decent but his upside is limited and he was clearly the weak link on the OL this year)


In terms of overall offseason strategy - they need impact players in the front 7 and depth in the secondary. They need to bring in some competition for Blount, at least someone who can be on the practice squad. A kick returner needs to be considered too.

I expect that they'll stick with Andrews at C. Maybe bring someone in as a backup who could compete for the spot, but I doubt they try to significantly upgrade there.
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dhunt2402


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I mean you talk "needs" in the pure sense of the word...I'm just not seeing a ton on the roster that truly has to be upgraded in a major way.. You look at the free agents they could lose: if they lose Logan Ryan, you have Rowe under contract through 2018, a guy who at times this season has already supplanted Ryan on the depth chart. Harmon is a nice player to have that knows the system and can step in for either safety in a pinch, but he's not a guy who's been on the field for the majority of snaps, especially later in the season. I'd be surprised if he gets an offer that we're unwilling to match this offseason, and if he does I'm confident we can sign a guy that can fill his role . Or maybe Jordan Richards is ready to step in, as we saw with Flowers this season you never know.

Defensive tackle is an obvious spot that could be upgraded, but they've more than survived this season with what I'd consider a mediocre at best rotation of Branch, Brown, Valentine et al. On the edge I don't see Long going anywhere unless he retires, and while Sheard might leave they showed he's not a guy they can't live without when they benched him. Definitely a spot that could use depth, but like the interior linemen not in need of an immediate marquee player or high draft pick. LB, as long as Hightower gets re-upped I have no real concerns, they were able to completely re-shuffle the position during the season this year and have it turn out pretty damn well.

On offense it's pretty straightforward. With TE, I think bringing Bennett back is a no-brainer and is something both player and team will want (if he leaves, you certainly have to make a move there). Receiver the only real question is with Amendola and Floyd, both guys they can live with or without IMO. And RB, keep the three top guys in place and draft a guy in the later rounds to take the load off Blount, nothing pressing there.

Obviously depending on who stays/goes there will be a few holes that need to be filled, but there's nothing on this team that is or will be a glaring hole at any point this offseason, barring something unforeseen happening. We'd all obviously love to see them take an impact guy for the defensive line in the 1st round, but as we know from the last few years that doesn't always work out. What's great about this year is they have a ton of options for the draft picks. Moving down in the draft or into next year, taking players early with an eye toward filling holes in 2018 and beyond (left tackle, Y/Z receiver come to mind). They've done a masterful job positioning this roster and I'm really looking forward to seeing what it leads to this offseason.
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young juice


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dont really look up players until after the SB but IMO positions that do or will need some help from the draft are:

CB: Butler will be resigned but Ryan will get paid big $$$ from someones. After Ryan the team has Rowe, Jones, C Jones and and Coleman. The last 3 I do not see as starters. Mainly 4th or 5th CBs. Rowe is a 3rd CB but a 2nd CB on a bad team.

DL - Sheard, Long and Branch may all leave. Even if they retain 2/3 the still need some influx of speed, strength and youth. Flowers, Valentine, Brown and Grissom are a good start but this team needs a pass rush.

LB - I miss the days of this team having 2-3 good LBs. Guys like Mayo, Spikes, Hightower, Collins. Now it seems they only have Hightower. Mingo experiment seems to have failed. I would give Van Noy a full season since he has shown some flashes before he's called a bust. Nink is older and the other guys aren't really starters IMO. Would be great to have another athletic LB on the team to help Hightower.

RB: Blount is 30 and a power back. He will start to decline after this post season I believe. Dion Lewis isn't really a starter to me. He is too small. I like the package of Lewis/Blount sharing carries. Bolden is mostly special teams and White is a backfield catching option. It would be nice if they drafted someone like Corey Dillon, Mark Ingram or Ladainian Tomlinson.
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

young juice wrote:
Dont really look up players until after the SB but IMO positions that do or will need some help from the draft are:

CB: Butler will be resigned but Ryan will get paid big $$$ from someones. After Ryan the team has Rowe, Jones, C Jones and and Coleman. The last 3 I do not see as starters. Mainly 4th or 5th CBs. Rowe is a 3rd CB but a 2nd CB on a bad team.


Rowe has been starting and doing a solid job. So I'm not sure how you can say he's a 2 on a bad team. I don't see any big moves coming at CB if/when Ryan leaves. Cyrus Jones will get a shot to be a top 3 guy and I would think they will reinforce with a midtier or low-end veteran and a mid/late round pick

Quote:

RB: Blount is 30 and a power back. He will start to decline after this post season I believe. Dion Lewis isn't really a starter to me. He is too small. I like the package of Lewis/Blount sharing carries. Bolden is mostly special teams and White is a backfield catching option. It would be nice if they drafted someone like Corey Dillon, Mark Ingram or Ladainian Tomlinson.


It sure would be nice if they could draft one of the best RB's of all time or at least one of the better backs of his generation. Kind of tough to do though Laughing Laughing
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mcmurtry86


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dhunt2402 wrote:
I mean you talk "needs" in the pure sense of the word...I'm just not seeing a ton on the roster that truly has to be upgraded in a major way.. You look at the free agents they could lose: if they lose Logan Ryan, you have Rowe under contract through 2018, a guy who at times this season has already supplanted Ryan on the depth chart. Harmon is a nice player to have that knows the system and can step in for either safety in a pinch, but he's not a guy who's been on the field for the majority of snaps, especially later in the season. I'd be surprised if he gets an offer that we're unwilling to match this offseason, and if he does I'm confident we can sign a guy that can fill his role . Or maybe Jordan Richards is ready to step in, as we saw with Flowers this season you never know.

Defensive tackle is an obvious spot that could be upgraded, but they've more than survived this season with what I'd consider a mediocre at best rotation of Branch, Brown, Valentine et al. On the edge I don't see Long going anywhere unless he retires, and while Sheard might leave they showed he's not a guy they can't live without when they benched him. Definitely a spot that could use depth, but like the interior linemen not in need of an immediate marquee player or high draft pick. LB, as long as Hightower gets re-upped I have no real concerns, they were able to completely re-shuffle the position during the season this year and have it turn out pretty damn well.

On offense it's pretty straightforward. With TE, I think bringing Bennett back is a no-brainer and is something both player and team will want (if he leaves, you certainly have to make a move there). Receiver the only real question is with Amendola and Floyd, both guys they can live with or without IMO. And RB, keep the three top guys in place and draft a guy in the later rounds to take the load off Blount, nothing pressing there.

Obviously depending on who stays/goes there will be a few holes that need to be filled, but there's nothing on this team that is or will be a glaring hole at any point this offseason, barring something unforeseen happening. We'd all obviously love to see them take an impact guy for the defensive line in the 1st round, but as we know from the last few years that doesn't always work out. What's great about this year is they have a ton of options for the draft picks. Moving down in the draft or into next year, taking players early with an eye toward filling holes in 2018 and beyond (left tackle, Y/Z receiver come to mind). They've done a masterful job positioning this roster and I'm really looking forward to seeing what it leads to this offseason.


Where I would disagree is the level of true need. They've been very fortunate this season with injuries to the front 7. Can you imagine if Branch or Hightower went down week 9 with a torn ACL? The D could survive a week or two without those guys (as they showed without Hightower) but I don't think this is a true Super Bowl contending D without talent in that front 7 (and Branch is nothing special, but significantly better than the NT replacements they have).

Furthermore, getting the front 7 from solid to very good would make the Pats almost unbeatable IMO assuming reasonable health on offense. Right now, that group is the clear weak spot on the team both in terms of starting talent and quality depth and I'd bet that if they fall in the playoffs, it will be largely due to the front 7's lack of ability in interior rush and pass coverage.
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1ForTheThumb


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TJ Watt is someone I could see BB falling in love with. Though, I'm pretty confident he's going to kill the combine and not be available at 32.
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Donut


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't watched a ton on him and I just noticed him during the bowl games but Carlos Henderson really stood out. He seemed like a pretty good route runner, good hands, quick feet w/ good enough speed to be a vertical threat.

I also love Zach Cunningham. But unless we get a top 15 pick for Jimmy no way we're getting him.

As for DE I still like Charles Harris. I want to go back and watch more Dawaune Smoot. Some of his JR tape it seemed like he was lacking instincts and would just rush w/o concern for running game and the one game i watched this year his play versus the run got a lot better and seemed like a much better football player.
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young juice


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 7:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mcmurtry86 wrote:
young juice wrote:
Dont really look up players until after the SB but IMO positions that do or will need some help from the draft are:

CB: Butler will be resigned but Ryan will get paid big $$$ from someones. After Ryan the team has Rowe, Jones, C Jones and and Coleman. The last 3 I do not see as starters. Mainly 4th or 5th CBs. Rowe is a 3rd CB but a 2nd CB on a bad team.


Rowe has been starting and doing a solid job. So I'm not sure how you can say he's a 2 on a bad team. I don't see any big moves coming at CB if/when Ryan leaves. Cyrus Jones will get a shot to be a top 3 guy and I would think they will reinforce with a midtier or low-end veteran and a mid/late round pick

Quote:

RB: Blount is 30 and a power back. He will start to decline after this post season I believe. Dion Lewis isn't really a starter to me. He is too small. I like the package of Lewis/Blount sharing carries. Bolden is mostly special teams and White is a backfield catching option. It would be nice if they drafted someone like Corey Dillon, Mark Ingram or Ladainian Tomlinson.


It sure would be nice if they could draft one of the best RB's of all time or at least one of the better backs of his generation. Kind of tough to do though Laughing Laughing


All I know about Rowe is I like the guy but a lot of PIs. Only in his second year so he can grow and mature.

I couldn't think of many RBs off the top of my head. Prolly said LT cuz I just watched primetime Embarassed Laughing
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MoJo63


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChazStandard wrote:
With Gronk's back possibly a long-term issue, and Bennett already 30, you have to think TE is a draft priority. Unless there's a trade or FA move, I would expect a TE in first three rounds.

That's just based on the roster as is, I don't follow CFB so I have no idea what prospects there are at TE.

Harmon's likely exit means safety will be a need - so pencil-in whoever started at safety for Rutgers with our second rounder.


I was thinking about this yesterday if they do trade Jimmy and get the proposed 1st and 4th (?), I think reaching for OJ Howard from Bama is a solid move by the Pats. Gronk is annually hurt at this point and Bennett may command a large deal in the offseason. The Pats have to make a choice on one of them IMO. I am willing to bet today Gronk will not play the entire season next year.
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