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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 11261
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nah. Revis is done. There are some other interesting veterans still available but most of them are older too. Not great for cornerbacks. Especially when the Ravens need them to be able to stick in coverage/react and run to the ball as quickly as their scheme depends on with the bend but don't break mentality. Can't have older and/or slower corners out there. I'm thinking that rules out Flowers, Carr, etc.

Claiborne looks to be a good cover guy who's only 27. He can run too. It's just the injuries that scare everybody. And rightfully so. I'm kind of surprised the Ravens are interested in him given their own durability issues in the secondary over the past few seasons but they're also desperate for quality talent/depth at cornerback too. This is a risk worth taking at that position in my opinion, as long as they draft someone at that position fairly high as well.

I would like to see Baltimore go after Robey as a slot guy but that doesn't seem to be their focus. Which makes sense since Young is better inside, although he's still a fine option outside. Just get better cover talent regardless.

Patrick Robinson wouldn't surprise me but... eh.
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Flaccomania


Joined: 12 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

5 is about right for Claiborne. No way he's anywhere near a $7.5m/yr guy.
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Danand


Joined: 12 Nov 2015
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without knowing much about contracts, 5 seems like a price you pay because he is a 1. round pick. Bradford cashed in that way and still haven't proven anything more than most career backups.

Robey has been a favorite of mine for some time, but we have Tavon Young who could be just as good inside and we will get William Likely in the draft who may not be as scrappy as Robey but is more explosive.
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Mancunian Raven


Joined: 09 Oct 2012
Posts: 3469
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Claiborne will end up sucking. I'd put money on it. He's got all the hallmarks of another Ravens FA CB disaster.

Look at the amount of games he's missed in his career. Never played 16 games in a seasin. Signing him when the other starting CB is Jimmy Smith seems insane.
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mancunian Raven wrote:
Claiborne will end up sucking. I'd put money on it. He's got all the hallmarks of another Ravens FA CB disaster.

Look at the amount of games he's missed in his career. Never played 16 games in a seasin. Signing him when the other starting CB is Jimmy Smith seems insane.


Depends on if he's good on the field. I probably look at it differently but to me missing games due to injury =/= sucking. Disappointing for sure. Just not quite a bust.

And if not Claiborne, then who? Cornerback is a dire need right now. I don't think that's overstating it when there are two rotation-worthy players at that position on the team right now. One of them is Jimmy Smith, who also misses a lot of games. Baltimore needs more than just a single addition here. The team isn't in a position to take two highly in the draft either given all the other needs. Although I would still do it anyways. It's that bad.

Doubling-down on another talented, yet constantly injured cornerback is not my preferred outcome at all but if the Ravens want someone who's more than just a body there aren't many options left. Or any. Robey would be the about the only other real choice since he's pretty good but there's also the size thing which seems to be a turnoff for the front office. Which is fine and makes some sense although I lean much more towards just getting good cover guys regardless. He wouldn't count for the compensatory formula either since Buffalo released him (McDermott really likes size at corner).
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Mancunian Raven


Joined: 09 Oct 2012
Posts: 3469
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
Mancunian Raven wrote:
Claiborne will end up sucking. I'd put money on it. He's got all the hallmarks of another Ravens FA CB disaster.

Look at the amount of games he's missed in his career. Never played 16 games in a seasin. Signing him when the other starting CB is Jimmy Smith seems insane.


Depends on if he's good on the field. I probably look at it differently but to me missing games due to injury =/= sucking. Disappointing for sure. Just not quite a bust.

And if not Claiborne, then who? Cornerback is a dire need right now. I don't think that's overstating it when there are two rotation-worthy players at that position on the team right now. One of them is Jimmy Smith, who also misses a lot of games. Baltimore needs more than just a single addition here. The team isn't in a position to take two highly in the draft either given all the other needs. Although I would still do it anyways. It's that bad.

Doubling-down on another talented, yet constantly injured cornerback is not my preferred outcome at all but if the Ravens want someone who's more than just a body there aren't many options left. Or any. Robey would be the about the only other real choice since he's pretty good but there's also the size thing which seems to be a turnoff for the front office. Which is fine and makes some sense although I lean much more towards just getting good cover guys regardless. He wouldn't count for the compensatory formula either since Buffalo released him (McDermott really likes size at corner).


If it's a choice of giving money to a decent player who is always hurt, or giving a lot less money to someone who isn't as good, but is more likely to be healthy? I pick the crap, healthy guy. I'd rather not spend anything on someone who has missed as many games as Claiborne has.

It all amounts to the same thing in the end - you still need to find a replacement for the guy at some point in the imminent future.

The Ravens have Smith and Young as a base to build on. They have Levine who has played CB in a pinch in the past. And Maurice Canady, who should hopefully be able to fill out the depth a little, by now.

This is the draft to find a CB who is going to make that unit better, and then sign a cheap vet like Darius Butler to round out the group. If you end up having to put your depth guys in for any extended period, you're screwed anyway.
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mancunian Raven wrote:
If it's a choice of giving money to a decent player who is always hurt, or giving a lot less money to someone who isn't as good, but is more likely to be healthy? I pick the crap, healthy guy. I'd rather not spend anything on someone who has missed as many games as Claiborne has.


And that's a fine stance to take. Philosophically different than mine though so we're probably going to have to agree to disagree.

Quote:
It all amounts to the same thing in the end - you still need to find a replacement for the guy at some point in the imminent future.

The Ravens have Smith and Young as a base to build on. They have Levine who has played CB in a pinch in the past. And Maurice Canady, who should hopefully be able to fill out the depth a little, by now.


I like Levine anywhere he lines up, but at the same time I don't think it's very likely the team relies on him at cornerback unless it's an extremely dire situation which is how he got snaps there in the past. Seems to be more of a safety in their eyes. Not sure about Canady but he played safety in the preseason and only special teams before he got hurt if I remember correctly. They might both be looked at as depth at safety instead of cornerback... which would pretty much complete that position group. There's no excess there either. Another "bruiser" might be added though.

Quote:
This is the draft to find a CB who is going to make that unit better, and then sign a cheap vet like Darius Butler to round out the group. If you end up having to put your depth guys in for any extended period, you're screwed anyway.


Yeah, I don't see it that way. Say the team drafts someone like Quincy Wilson (but I hope not) in the second round. A group of Smith-Young-Wilson forms a solid base (if you like Wilson at least) of the three main guys that will get snaps, but that's it. No contingency plan for if/when Smith gets hurt. Of course you would need that as well even if Claiborne is signed since he can't be relied on to stay healthy either but adding him to that mix looks a lot better in my opinion.

Teams can get by with depth guys for an extended period if those depth guys are worth anything. Not if they're a cheap vet in the likes of Darius Butler. Those are the type of moves that have screwed the Ravens in the past if/when they have to get on the field. Doesn't make much sense to keep doing things the same way in the future. Different outcomes won't happen. I'm not saying the team should go out and spend all their cap and draft picks on corners, because that's not realistic, but committing to quality depth and less band-aid options has to be a priority. We've seen time and time again that their method isn't working.
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ilovecroissants


Joined: 24 Sep 2014
Posts: 396
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ravens have signed CB Brandon Carr to a 4 year contract. Numbers aren't immediately known. Solid signing.
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ravens5520


Joined: 20 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very intrigued on why we chose to give him a 4 year deal. Solid signing who can offer lots of experience & knowledge to hopefully 1-2 corners drafted
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M.10.E


Joined: 24 Dec 2007
Posts: 1693
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ravens5520 wrote:
Very intrigued on why we chose to give him a 4 year deal. Solid signing who can offer lots of experience & knowledge to hopefully 1-2 corners drafted
It's a fake 4 year deal like every NFL contract.
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ravens5520


Joined: 20 Dec 2007
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Location: New York
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

M.10.E wrote:
ravens5520 wrote:
Very intrigued on why we chose to give him a 4 year deal. Solid signing who can offer lots of experience & knowledge to hopefully 1-2 corners drafted
It's a fake 4 year deal like every NFL contract.


Numbers just came out. It's likely a 2 year 12 mill deal with two team options to get to year 4. Little more expensive per year but worth it
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter 5m5 minutes ago

Brandon Carr signing a 1-year deal with series of options to make it a 4-year, $24M deal w/ Ravens, per source. Likely a 2-year, $12M deal.


Man, I don't know about that. It's a solid deal for a cornerback but is he good enough to not be a liability in Pees' scheme? There's a lot of pressure put on the corners to be able to react quickly and make a quick tackle off of the cushion so the short passes don't go for first downs. Brandon is certainly more durable than Claiborne, but also older and not what he once was.

On the other hand with his durability it makes eventually losing Smith to injury a bit less hurtful. Especially if another cornerback is drafted highly. Should give that player decent time to develop while hopefully not needed to be thrown into the fire right away. Maybe more like 6 or 8 games into the season. I don't hate this move, just a bit leery about Carr's effectiveness. Although coming fro Marinelli's zone scheme his role might not be too different...

Quote:
Adam Schefter‏Verified account @AdamSchefter 52s52 seconds ago

Former Cowboys' CB Morris Claiborne is expected to sign with the Jets, per league source. CB market now moving.


Will be interesting to see what kind of deal he gets.


Last edited by coordinator0 on Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ravens5520


Joined: 20 Dec 2007
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Location: New York
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1 int & only 1 positive grade from PFF (2016) in the last 3 seasons
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wackywabbit


Joined: 20 Dec 2009
Posts: 11998
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like that he stays healthy. And he can play outside. Just needs to be reasonably competent for it to be a good deal. I really prefer this move over Claiborne.
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santiagomn8


Joined: 27 Dec 2010
Posts: 301
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wackywabbit wrote:
I like that he stays healthy. And he can play outside. Just needs to be reasonably competent for it to be a good deal. I really prefer this move over Claiborne.


Agreed with Jimmy, Carr, Young and a 1st/2nd round rookie that's a pretty nice group with Weddle and Jefferson I'm feeling pretty good about the backend
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