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Five Titans selected to the Pro Bowl....what?
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ragevsuall17


Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 6574
Location: TX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanLegend wrote:
ttitansfan4life wrote:
All-pro but not a pro-bowler.... what a joke the pro bowl is Laughing


He doesn't deserve the all-pro slot, so it's irrelevant overall really.


I can't say I've seen all other RT's play, but I know Conklin played RT at a level not seen here in a long time. He played besides Warmack and a in season waiver pick up, and he still looked good.

I know the "help" thing has been blowing up on Twitter and elsewhere, but where is the comparison to other tackles? On non-blitz plays, there are still 5 OL for 3-4 rushers... there's also RBs to stay in to help or who chip on their way out for a route... and TE's as well. So we're saying Conklin is the only that gets help? Until someone can prove that Conklin is receiving significantly more help than other RT's, I'll trust what I saw (every player is going to have individual plays he loses, it happens to everyone, but overall, Conklin was as strong and consistent as I've ever seen a RT). Conklin was penalized 3 times all season... all 3 being pre snap penalties... no holding calls... and gave up 2 sacks all season. Those are all-pro numbers.
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TitanLegend


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ragevsuall17 wrote:
TitanLegend wrote:
ttitansfan4life wrote:
All-pro but not a pro-bowler.... what a joke the pro bowl is Laughing


He doesn't deserve the all-pro slot, so it's irrelevant overall really.


I can't say I've seen all other RT's play, but I know Conklin played RT at a level not seen here in a long time. He played besides Warmack and a in season waiver pick up, and he still looked good.

I know the "help" thing has been blowing up on Twitter and elsewhere, but where is the comparison to other tackles? On non-blitz plays, there are still 5 OL for 3-4 rushers... there's also RBs to stay in to help or who chip on their way out for a route... and TE's as well. So we're saying Conklin is the only that gets help? Until someone can prove that Conklin is receiving significantly more help than other RT's, I'll trust what I saw (every player is going to have individual plays he loses, it happens to everyone, but overall, Conklin was as strong and consistent as I've ever seen a RT). Conklin was penalized 3 times all season... all 3 being pre snap penalties... no holding calls... and gave up 2 sacks all season. Those are all-pro numbers.


Only one that gets help? No.

Gets more help than most? Yes.

Conklin was a good player, but not an elite one. We schemed our line and TEs(and even in some cases use formations to cause delay for pass rush) to give him a good amount of help, and while he stood up generally well in 1v1, it's still evident that Mularkey and Grimm felt he needed help more often than not. Even if you just compare the tackles on our team, Taylor Lewan was left on an island an extreme amount(relative to Conklin).

I have no idea how to make gifs from NFL Gamepass(something I need to learn how to do), but here's a good article from former NFL offensive lineman Geoff Schwartz about how our scheme is unique(and praises it for such) and how Conklin receives help.

http://www.sbnation.com/2016/12/27/14066912/nfl-pass-protection-offensive-line-how-to

He played RT at a level not seen here in a long time, yes, but that's mostly because ever since Stewart was on his decline our RT play has been abysmal. He is not as good of a player as Stewart was in his prime at this point, though.

Munchak's offensive line schemes don't give nearly as much help as Conklin received this year. Marcus Gilbert is one of the RTs(Steelers RT) that ranks above Conklin this season for me, he's dominated on an island most plays, just like Stewart did here under Munchak.

As it stands right now, from the "top tier" RTs I've watched(Strief, Gilbert, Conklin, Johnson, Schwartz, Bulaga, Moses, Schraeder are those tackles) Conklin ranks 6th for me.

My personal ranking of those is as follows:

1. Johnson(worth noting that Johnson isn't in contention for the All-Pro because of how much he missed to suspension, but he's without a doubt the best RT in football, IMO)
2. Strief
3. Gilbert
4. Bulaga
5. Schwartz
6. Conklin
7. Moses
8. Schraeder

I think Conklin has the ability to be right up there with Johnson and Strief though because I think another off-season in an NFL weight room/training facility can give him the extra athleticism he's currently lacking. His movements now are at times stiff, for example his kick step often a bit slow to match the faster pass rushers in the NFL, but if he gets in his stance, you're not getting past him. His power is incredible and when his form is right I've not seen a single d-lineman/lb all year overpower him.

Grimm will get his technique right, and Lewan should be of some help in that regard too. Lewan has some of the best technique for an offensive tackle in the NFL today IMO, it's beautiful to watch.

I also want to make note that I'm not an expert in offensive line play/not a coach/don't understand every scheme/etc, this is just my amateur evaluation of play. The guys at PFF( as much as I disagree with them) probably overall have a better football IQ than me, and they ranked Conklin higher than me, and so does the guy who ranked/graded the offensive tackles for BleacherReport's NFL1000(Duke Manyweather), who ranked Conklin as the 12th best RT in football this season - http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2685170-nfl1000-final-regular-season-breakdown-of-the-leagues-top-players/page/10
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ragevsuall17


Joined: 26 Jan 2005
Posts: 6574
Location: TX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bleacher Report also named Conklin to their 1st team all pro team... receiving 6 of the 12 votes (Bulaga getting 2nd team with 4 votes). In the end, it's all relative.

As I've said, I don't spend time watching film on every game... unless I happen to be watching it live, I could care less what 31 other teams are doing on any particular day.

I spend a good amount of time reading, and posting, and all that, but I'd be lying if I said I'd have anywhere near the time to watch every snap of every game in the NFL... and/or college.

Conklin was good... and yes, he got help. And that seems to be the trending criticism of his. I have seen the video and breakdown on Twitter where he received "assistance" during the Chiefs game. But again, from my lay point of view, I see similar with all RTs in the pass game most games. LT's are generally considered the elite pass blockers on a team, and hence, are trusted on an island more often than any other position on the line. TE's move around more in today's NFL... but your "traditional" lineup, the TE lined up on the right side to help the T with a chip. Now, teams use slot receivers, RBs, as well as TEs to help chip rushers before starting on routes. You see it constantly on Rak and Morgan... you see it every game. Would I be surprised if a rookie blocking for a 2nd year QB got a little more help than average... no... but I would be surprised if it was any kind of significant number.


Last edited by ragevsuall17 on Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ragevsuall17


Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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Location: TX
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but Conklin was also named to the AP All-Pro, receiving 27.5 of the 50 votes (no other RT received more than 6).

It's one thing to be named to the PFF or Sporting News, or whatevr other publication's All Pro team... it's a completely separate thing to be named to the AP All-Pro team...

Lewan unfortunately only received 1 vote (Smith and Bahktiari made he 1st and 2nd teams). Lewan played great for us, and may be our best player (may have finally bumped Casey from his perch)...he deserves to be named among the best LTs playing right now.
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KingTitan


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With Conklin, all I know is our run game was tops in the league and our pass protection was one of, if not, the best.

We held Mack, Justin Houston, Von Miller and some of the more elite pass rushers in the league sackless. So.......I'll take it.

If he had help, then the rest of the league is dumb for not helping their OT's then. We had one of the top offenses in the league and helping our OT's didn't hinder the passing game......
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titans0021


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 29, 2017 8:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Figure we can bump this since Delanie scored the first touchdown.
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TitanTuff


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And Casey was a beast.
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lamont


Joined: 01 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2017 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It wasn't pretty to see Lewan on the right side last night. Shame on you Michael Bennett could have abused him if he wanted to on several pass pros. Demarco had that fumble as well. Shocked

Glad all 5 guys came out of the game healthy.
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