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Sean Payton - is he the great illusionist?

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Mid Iowa

Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 562
Location: Iowa
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:16 pm    Post subject: Sean Payton - is he the great illusionist? Reply with quote

I just got to doing some comparing of Sean Payton vs. Jeff Fisher. (this is not a Jeff Fisher thread). That brought me to Sean's history.

Prior to the Saint HC job, Sean really hasn't stayed in any one position very long, and hasn't really accomplished much.

In 1987 he was a QB for 4 different teams. 4!

From 1988 until he came to the Saints, he coached for 9 different teams (college and pro) and mostly just 1 or 2 seasons with any of them (3 with each of the Giants and Cowboys), and now he's with the Saints 10 years.

Now, I'm not really knocking him for jumping around, but you've got to look at his type of personality. He's probably got itchy feet. This is the longest he's held a job by 7 years.

No wonder he's losing his interest.
~courtesy of the weak minded
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Joined: 23 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Sean Payton - is he the great illusionist? Reply with quote

I don't view Payton's time as a player as much of a factor as many of the best coaches weren't the most talented players just like many great players failed as head coaches.

As far as his stints as an assistant coach many times you leave and more for opportunities to either expand your resume or to take advantage of learning under proven head coaches to build your portfolio. As an assistant Payton worked for coaches such as John Gruden, Jim Fassel and Bill Parcells all of whom established themselves as quality coaches in the NFL at one point while he was a member of their staffs.

Payton did show great potential as a young assistant and even turned down a few head coaching opportunities in 2005 before he missed out of the Packers job in 2006 and eventually took the Saints job.

So by the time Payton accepted his first head coaching job with the Saints he had already established himself as a top flight assistant that had paid his dues and was ready to take the next step. Once he became head coach of the Saints things really fell right for both he, Loomis and the franchise with the signing of Brees and etc.

What stands out to me from the Payton of then to the Payton now is the fact that he's no longer just a head coach... now he's got his hands far to much into everything with this franchise. Much like Parcells before him and other coaches like Holmgren and others, once you meddle to much into the personnel side of things you simply become overwhelmed and take you eye off what made you successful. Payton's downfall was his quest for power within this franchise and the bad decisions that piled on after that was acquired. To Payton's credit he's tried to take a step back with the hiring of Jeff Ireland but by the time that occurred the damage was done as the team was feeling the effects of 5 years of bad drafts, bad free agency and league leading DEAD MONEY.

Payton isn't Jeff Fisher but the results are what they are and ultimately that's on him but it wasn't his coaching that doomed his team, it was his personnel decisions.

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Joined: 27 Dec 2009
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Location: South Mississippi
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he definitely knows how to design great plays, but he's too predictable with them. And I've seen us run some pretty clever legit plays in the passing game to get guys open, and then I never saw them again. He also seems to go back to his triple reverse, or sends Ingram on a deep route, or some garbage toss play that loses 6 yards.

He gets way too cute, when all he ever needed to do was get guys open. Or run downhill, instead of a negative 10 yard semi-circle. And how many times have you seen us panic pass for a first down, then immediately run the ball. Everyone on the planet know when we're about to run the ball. I can even predict our draw plays like 75% of the time, and I don't watch tape.

Also, Brees has been forcing balls to Cooks which I was afraid would happen. He literally almost got Cooks killed last Sunday throwing to him in triple coverage. If he had gone for the ball, he would've been molested. Brees always forces a few passes, especially when he's getting frustrated, but I hope this isn't a symptom of Cooks' whining.
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