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Free agents to keep an eye on '17
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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 12124
Location: Mack on the sig
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

indifference wrote:
Panthers just drafted Vernon Butler last year in the first round. I would be shocked if they signed him with that contract demand. He'll probably be back though via franchise tag, I don't think their GM will make the same mistake twice. And he is absolutely NOT worth $17M per season. I know we have a crap load of cap room but we need to allocate it at different positions. For 17M, we can pick-up two quality wide receivers for Winston and still have money left over to get a big name guy. I'll take Poe or Berry on this team.


If the $17M is an issue for you then you might want to rethink wanting Berry.
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ravishingone


Joined: 07 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2017 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reviewing the free agency list for safeties, I believe the second best option after Berry is McDougald. For his age and production, McDougald is the better option then some of the other guys on the market. I thought of possibly Tony Jefferson from AZ, but I'm not sure he is that much better. I think Licht will ultimately resign McDougald to a multi-year deal.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 11065
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any one who wants to pay short that kinda money is insane. He's not JJ watt and licht does value pay vs performance.

Berry is a stud and elite player at his position. That would be the exception if shell out the money to pay him like best at his position bc he's a game changer.
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indifference


Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 3225
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 10:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
Panthers just drafted Vernon Butler last year in the first round. I would be shocked if they signed him with that contract demand. He'll probably be back though via franchise tag, I don't think their GM will make the same mistake twice. And he is absolutely NOT worth $17M per season. I know we have a crap load of cap room but we need to allocate it at different positions. For 17M, we can pick-up two quality wide receivers for Winston and still have money left over to get a big name guy. I'll take Poe or Berry on this team.


If the $17M is an issue for you then you might want to rethink wanting Berry.
17M is an issue for Kawaan Short. The highest paid safety right now is making 12M and that belongs to the Honey Badger. Berry won't come close to making 17M. If anything a Berry contract offer would be around 13-14M, 15 TOPS(including incentives). But 17M for a safety? That's QB money.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 11065
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing is licht is going to reward Mike Evans. 14 million for the number 1 wide out. That's where the big money goes in my opinion.

Guys who licht will try and bring back:
- DE will Gholston
- s Keith Tandy
- possibly S mcdougald
- CB josh Robinson
- wr Russell shepherd
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indifference


Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 3225
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
The thing is licht is going to reward Mike Evans. 14 million for the number 1 wide out. That's where the big money goes in my opinion.

Guys who licht will try and bring back:
- DE will Gholston
- s Keith Tandy
- possibly S mcdougald
- CB josh Robinson
- wr Russell shepherd
Yeah but we'll still have a crap load of money to pay other big players like a Berry. We're off the books with V-Jack contract and can save up to 6.5M by cutting ATV. Think the Bucs should go after Robert Woods and DeSean Jackson in March. Jackson can line up anywhere and Woods is a perfect #2 WR.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 11065
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

indifference wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
The thing is licht is going to reward Mike Evans. 14 million for the number 1 wide out. That's where the big money goes in my opinion.

Guys who licht will try and bring back:
- DE will Gholston
- s Keith Tandy
- possibly S mcdougald
- CB josh Robinson
- wr Russell shepherd
Yeah but we'll still have a crap load of money to pay other big players like a Berry. We're off the books with V-Jack contract and can save up to 6.5M by cutting ATV. Think the Bucs should go after Robert Woods and DeSean Jackson in March. Jackson can line up anywhere and Woods is a perfect #2 WR.


I think we'll spend but not crazy money. We may target berry if he hits the market. I wouldn't be opposed then.

But I don't see us throwing boat loads of cash. After next year we can extend Winston remember. That will command a lot of cash.
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Buc Ball


Joined: 09 Oct 2011
Posts: 3569
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
indifference wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
The thing is licht is going to reward Mike Evans. 14 million for the number 1 wide out. That's where the big money goes in my opinion.

Guys who licht will try and bring back:
- DE will Gholston
- s Keith Tandy
- possibly S mcdougald
- CB josh Robinson
- wr Russell shepherd
Yeah but we'll still have a crap load of money to pay other big players like a Berry. We're off the books with V-Jack contract and can save up to 6.5M by cutting ATV. Think the Bucs should go after Robert Woods and DeSean Jackson in March. Jackson can line up anywhere and Woods is a perfect #2 WR.


I think we'll spend but not crazy money. We may target berry if he hits the market. I wouldn't be opposed then.

But I don't see us throwing boat loads of cash. After next year we can extend Winston remember. That will command a lot of cash.

Tandy is under contract I think. Did he not sign a 2 year deal last offseason?

I agree with the list of players we'll bring back. I just wonder if there's room for vjax on a discounted deal. He could add value as a role model to a young receiving corps, but he'd likely be our fourth receiver, at best, which I don't think he'd accept.
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indifference


Joined: 08 Nov 2010
Posts: 3225
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Buc Ball wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
indifference wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
The thing is licht is going to reward Mike Evans. 14 million for the number 1 wide out. That's where the big money goes in my opinion.

Guys who licht will try and bring back:
- DE will Gholston
- s Keith Tandy
- possibly S mcdougald
- CB josh Robinson
- wr Russell shepherd
Yeah but we'll still have a crap load of money to pay other big players like a Berry. We're off the books with V-Jack contract and can save up to 6.5M by cutting ATV. Think the Bucs should go after Robert Woods and DeSean Jackson in March. Jackson can line up anywhere and Woods is a perfect #2 WR.


I think we'll spend but not crazy money. We may target berry if he hits the market. I wouldn't be opposed then.

But I don't see us throwing boat loads of cash. After next year we can extend Winston remember. That will command a lot of cash.

Tandy is under contract I think. Did he not sign a 2 year deal last offseason?

I agree with the list of players we'll bring back. I just wonder if there's room for vjax on a discounted deal. He could add value as a role model to a young receiving corps, but he'd likely be our fourth receiver, at best, which I don't think he'd accept.
VJax is done as a player. And he damn sure not taking a pay cut to be going through practice and training camps. If anything we ask him to join the coaching staff.
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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 12124
Location: Mack on the sig
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

indifference wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
Panthers just drafted Vernon Butler last year in the first round. I would be shocked if they signed him with that contract demand. He'll probably be back though via franchise tag, I don't think their GM will make the same mistake twice. And he is absolutely NOT worth $17M per season. I know we have a crap load of cap room but we need to allocate it at different positions. For 17M, we can pick-up two quality wide receivers for Winston and still have money left over to get a big name guy. I'll take Poe or Berry on this team.


If the $17M is an issue for you then you might want to rethink wanting Berry.
17M is an issue for Kawaan Short. The highest paid safety right now is making 12M and that belongs to the Honey Badger. Berry won't come close to making 17M. If anything a Berry contract offer would be around 13-14M, 15 TOPS(including incentives). But 17M for a safety? That's QB money.


$15,000,000 isn't close to $17,000,000? Short averaged 8.5 sacks the last two seasons. From the inside those are great numbers. With the cap jumping so much every year the contract numbers that you would normally equate with that production is no longer the norm.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 11065
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 4:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
Panthers just drafted Vernon Butler last year in the first round. I would be shocked if they signed him with that contract demand. He'll probably be back though via franchise tag, I don't think their GM will make the same mistake twice. And he is absolutely NOT worth $17M per season. I know we have a crap load of cap room but we need to allocate it at different positions. For 17M, we can pick-up two quality wide receivers for Winston and still have money left over to get a big name guy. I'll take Poe or Berry on this team.


If the $17M is an issue for you then you might want to rethink wanting Berry.
17M is an issue for Kawaan Short. The highest paid safety right now is making 12M and that belongs to the Honey Badger. Berry won't come close to making 17M. If anything a Berry contract offer would be around 13-14M, 15 TOPS(including incentives). But 17M for a safety? That's QB money.


$15,000,000 isn't close to $17,000,000? Short averaged 8.5 sacks the last two seasons. From the inside those are great numbers. With the cap jumping so much every year the contract numbers that you would normally equate with that production is no longer the norm.


You give that money to an elite edge rusher. We have McCoy at was 14 mil? We're not going to have 31 million invested into 2 guys at one position. You're dreaming guys.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 11065
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The panthers the panthers will tag Short. Then give butler another year to develop. At this time next year, they'll have a decision to make between loutelli and short to go with victor butler. I was under the impression butler was loutellei long term replacement ?
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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 12124
Location: Mack on the sig
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
indifference wrote:
Panthers just drafted Vernon Butler last year in the first round. I would be shocked if they signed him with that contract demand. He'll probably be back though via franchise tag, I don't think their GM will make the same mistake twice. And he is absolutely NOT worth $17M per season. I know we have a crap load of cap room but we need to allocate it at different positions. For 17M, we can pick-up two quality wide receivers for Winston and still have money left over to get a big name guy. I'll take Poe or Berry on this team.


If the $17M is an issue for you then you might want to rethink wanting Berry.
17M is an issue for Kawaan Short. The highest paid safety right now is making 12M and that belongs to the Honey Badger. Berry won't come close to making 17M. If anything a Berry contract offer would be around 13-14M, 15 TOPS(including incentives). But 17M for a safety? That's QB money.


$15,000,000 isn't close to $17,000,000? Short averaged 8.5 sacks the last two seasons. From the inside those are great numbers. With the cap jumping so much every year the contract numbers that you would normally equate with that production is no longer the norm.


You give that money to an elite edge rusher. We have McCoy at was 14 mil? We're not going to have 31 million invested into 2 guys at one position. You're dreaming guys.


Again... $15 is probably what $10/12 was a few seasons ago. He doesn't hit the market thats is fine. If he does though you're out because two inside guys would be getting paid? What the heck is the problem with that?

EVERYONE REALIZES WE WILL HAVE AROUND $95,000,0000 IN CAP RIGHT????????????

We can sign Berry ($14,000,000), Short ($16,000,000), give Evans a raise($14,000,000) and just to show how hard the Glazers ball extend Wiinston THIS offseason for $20,000,000 per and STILL have like $30,000,000 in cap space and it's going up again next offseason.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But what about depth? Front load deals into two guys knowing you're going to drop probably 22 mil for Winston and 14 for Evans. 15 and 14 for short and Berry.

Realistically , It's not going to happen. I can see if Berry becomes available, we can offer him the money of 12-13 mil per say. Tops honey badgers deal.

Then use the money to resign our own and explore the market. I'm guaranteeing realistically short will be tagged.
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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 12124
Location: Mack on the sig
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
But what about depth? Front load deals into two guys knowing you're going to drop probably 22 mil for Winston and 14 for Evans. 15 and 14 for short and Berry.

Realistically , It's not going to happen. I can see if Berry becomes available, we can offer him the money of 12-13 mil per say. Tops honey badgers deal.

Then use the money to resign our own and explore the market. I'm guaranteeing realistically short will be tagged.


I was being sarcastic in my last post. Obviously not handing out that money this year but I'm just saying we could hand out four MASSIVE deals to anyone we wanted to and after that still probably be middle of the road in cap compared to the rest of the league. $95,000,000!!!! Boggles my mind that guys are so tight with the cap. $15 is ok but $17 is out of this world? We have our core group of guys we are going to want to build around. In my eyes IF some hind end guys become available now is the time to act. We were a win out of the playoffs. Adding a high end piece or two, a few other solid signing and drafting as we have last few season who says we can't make a run once we get into the dance next year?
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