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Wk 5 GDT: Redskins (2-2) @ Ravens (3-1)
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BaltimoreTerp


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
wackywabbit wrote:
The defense is pretty much playing as well as we could have hoped, even if it's not perfect.


That's not a bad way to put it. I'm not happy with the defense at all, but on a strict points basis they're doing well enough for the most part. Especially being backed into a corner constantly by the awful offensive sequences.


Seems like a stretch for anyone to not be happy with the defense "at all" - I think you're letting your dislike of Pees get in the way. The reality is that even with an offense that has consistently put them in awful situations, the defense has consistently kept us in games this year and basically outside of a busted quarter vs. Cleveland and a tough matchup with an offense that is increasingly looking like one of the best in the league (Oakland), they've been excellent. Today they gave up a touchdown and a FG - which should always be enough to get a W. Hell, if not for the freakish Mosley fumble, they would have singlehandedly won the game for us today which wouldn't have been the first time this season.

We should rag on Pees when it's deserved. But it cheapens the real criticisms when we harp on him/the defense even when they do the job.
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RavensDefense3


Joined: 21 Apr 2011
Posts: 2332
Location: Baltimore
PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
coordinator0 wrote:
wackywabbit wrote:
The defense is pretty much playing as well as we could have hoped, even if it's not perfect.


That's not a bad way to put it. I'm not happy with the defense at all, but on a strict points basis they're doing well enough for the most part. Especially being backed into a corner constantly by the awful offensive sequences.


Seems like a stretch for anyone to not be happy with the defense "at all" - I think you're letting your dislike of Pees get in the way. The reality is that even with an offense that has consistently put them in awful situations, the defense has consistently kept us in games this year and basically outside of a busted quarter vs. Cleveland and a tough matchup with an offense that is increasingly looking like one of the best in the league (Oakland), they've delivered pretty consistently. Today they gave up a touchdown and a FG - which should always be enough to get a W. Hell, if not for the freakish Mosley fumble, they would have singlehandedly won the game for us today which wouldn't have been the first time this season.

We should rag on Pees when it's deserved. But it cheapens the real criticisms when we harp on him/the defense even when they do the job.


completely agree. ST and offense are trash
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
Seems like a stretch for anyone to not be happy with the defense "at all" - I think you're letting your dislike of Pees get in the way. The reality is that even with an offense that has consistently put them in awful situations, the defense has consistently kept us in games this year and basically outside of a busted quarter vs. Cleveland and a tough matchup with an offense that is increasingly looking like one of the best in the league (Oakland), they've been excellent. Today they gave up a touchdown and a FG - which should always be enough to get a W. Hell, if not for the freakish Mosley fumble, they would have singlehandedly won the game for us today which wouldn't have been the first time this season.

We should rag on Pees when it's deserved. But it cheapens the real criticisms when we harp on him/the defense even when they do the job.


I don't like this style of defense at all. Never have, never will. It's the same thing as when Mattison was coordinating the defense. Statistically really good, even great, but situationally unreliable. The defense has done their part to keep opposing offenses from scoring points and keeping the team in the game.

To me it's more than that though. It's creating momentum. It's not allowing opposing offenses easy, yet small drives to get them in position to make great punts that pin Baltimore's struggling offense deep. It's making plays and capitalizing on opportunities. It's plain just doing smart things. None of those things happen in conjunction with another and you just can't trust it.

I know I'm far more critical than most and even so like I've said a couple times now the defense is doing enough to keep the team competitive. But it could be so much more. I'm not satisfied with the product on the field given their talent overall. Not by a longshot. The offense is obviosuly at fault for the poor performances thus far. But that doesn't wipe away all the things that the defense could be doing better. Nothing is ever going to be perfect, but is it too much to expect a little more in the way of helping the team be in a better position to win?
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RavensTillIDie


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just to lighten the mood...

At least this eases the pain from the loss just a little bit. Laughing

http://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2016/10/8/13210096/if-the-ravens-lose-to-the-redskins-the-ravens-are-your-2016-super-bowl-champions
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bananabucket wrote:
Matts4313 wrote:
For years the argument has been, mostly, Peyton V Joe V Brady as the GOAT QB.

Flacco?
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wackywabbit


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BaltimoreTerp wrote:
coordinator0 wrote:
wackywabbit wrote:
The defense is pretty much playing as well as we could have hoped, even if it's not perfect.


That's not a bad way to put it. I'm not happy with the defense at all, but on a strict points basis they're doing well enough for the most part. Especially being backed into a corner constantly by the awful offensive sequences.


Seems like a stretch for anyone to not be happy with the defense "at all" - I think you're letting your dislike of Pees get in the way. The reality is that even with an offense that has consistently put them in awful situations, the defense has consistently kept us in games this year and basically outside of a busted quarter vs. Cleveland and a tough matchup with an offense that is increasingly looking like one of the best in the league (Oakland), they've been excellent. Today they gave up a touchdown and a FG - which should always be enough to get a W. Hell, if not for the freakish Mosley fumble, they would have singlehandedly won the game for us today which wouldn't have been the first time this season.

We should rag on Pees when it's deserved. But it cheapens the real criticisms when we harp on him/the defense even when they do the job.


Yea, I was going to say, I meant that I am very happy with the defense. Yards... points... heck they got 2 turnovers today, too. The fact that those didn't help the game at all (taking away points, setting up points, or gaining field position) were fluke events.
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drd23


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RavensTillIDie wrote:
Just to lighten the mood...

At least this eases the pain from the loss just a little bit. Laughing

http://www.baltimorebeatdown.com/2016/10/8/13210096/if-the-ravens-lose-to-the-redskins-the-ravens-are-your-2016-super-bowl-champions


Laughing

Maybe something will change
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Flaccomania


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think large changes to our play calling need to happen quick. You can tell Joe isn't happy with the dink and dunk stuff. You can tell things stall. And it's very telling when you as a team are averaging 6.2 YPC and you run the ball 19 times and throw the ball 46.

This all reminds me of Cam Cameron all over again -- ignoring the run game and wanting to stick to their ideology instead of actually paying attention to what's working.
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coordinator0


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 3h3 hours ago
Lot of questions whether OC Marc Trestman is in jeopardy of losing job. Harbaugh gave no indication that was case after the game but


Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 3h3 hours ago
the frustration with the offense/Trestman's play calling was palpable throughout the Ravens' locker room.


Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 2h2 hours ago
Trestman's habit of abandoning the run -never more obvious than today - is confounding and he hasn't been able to unlock downfield pass game


Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 2h2 hours ago
Harbaugh said today the problem was offense wasn't getting enough plays, so they couldn't sustain run, but that's curious given fact that ..


Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 2h2 hours ago
Ravens averaged just 3.88 yards per play on Flacco's 50 dropbacks; and 6.2 yards on the 18 rushes. Running was how they were moving ball


Quote:
Jeff Zrebiec ‏@jeffzrebiecsun 2h2 hours ago
This offense has issues that Trestman can't be blamed for. Flacco needs to play much better. WRs dropping too many passes. Pass pro not good


http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/ravens/bs-sp-ravens-redskins-1010-20161009-story.html

Quote:
"It starts with me. We're not playing the type of football we need to play to win a football game like that. Way too many self-inflicted mistakes. It's a long season. We're 3-2; we have plenty of time to get it fixed. We have the players, we have the scheme, we have everything we need. But we can't play like that and make the mistakes we made and win the football game."


Quote:
Harbaugh defended the play-calling and said he didn't feel the team abandoned the running game. He cited the offense's overall lack of execution: The Ravens had eight consecutive drives of four plays or fewer.


So yeah, John isn't going to be making any moves.
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Danand


Joined: 12 Nov 2015
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When some of us critize Pees, it is very often (almost every time) a matter of defensive philosophy which in my opinion basically can be summarized to the following.
- Off coverage
- Blitz pressure
- 2-minute defense
The off coverage relates to the ďbend-donít breakĒ philosophyĒ, where we often play an off-man coverage (despite having a Jimmy Smith who is at his best, when he gets to press his man). We tend to give up the easy pass for 6-7 yards and are ďOKĒ with that, which often gives the opposing offense the opportunity to get easy completions/drives. Unless the pressure gets to the QB fast, our cornerbacks canít really do much to prevent the completion.

Blitz pressure is directly related to our off coverage, because if we get pressure fast, we force bad throws = no easy completions and we stall drives and our good run defense isnít forced into a lot of 3 and short. When we had a top defense with Pees scheme, it was directly related to Dumervil and Suggs getting fast pressure off the edge. Quarterbacks were forced to either deliver the ball fast (and routes doesnít have time to develop) or were forced to throw on the run.
With that in mind, yes, the scheme can work and work really well, but atm we donít get the fast pressure and it seems we basically send 3-4-5 guys in a bunch towards the QB and hope they beat their man straight up. That hasnít worked well the last couple of season, and we donít get the sacks we did, when Pees defense was at its best.
So far, we havenít been beat deep, that much, but we havenít been tested against a really good offense (Yes, I donít put the Raiders and superman Crabtree in that category).

We say it every time, we have a slight lead or just when the game is within the last 2 minutes ďdonít go soft, PeesĒ. We go soft. There is this idea, that as long as we donít allow the big play, we can get the win or at least get one last chance on offense to go on a winning drive. This is puzzling, especially in the games where we have the momentum and initiative on defense and have a good grasp on the defense. Instead of doing what worked the entire game, we sit back and let the offense march down the field and then hope we can tighten up once in the red zone. That way, we lose a game against the Raiders, who got easy TD-drives when we decided to sit back.

We are no way the worst defense in the league talent wise. Often we will have nice stats or at least be in the middle of the pack. We are not, and I think most agree with me, we are not a WINNING defense (and when we had the chance to be yesterday, we fumbled/threw the ball away).

The sky is not falling, we still have a chance to get to the playoff, but I don't see us as a playoff team the way we play or with how our players deliver on the field.

Btw. I have rarely seen coordinators throw their players under the bus like Pees. The "players" are not executing - there is some truth to it, but I would like to see some criticism directed toward the coaching staff as well.
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Dashing


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your offense was trash but it was harbough fault for not attempting a FG instead of a Fake FG pass .

Could of least made it a tie game and went into OT
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paraven


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So after calming down a bit from yesterdays disaster, im trying to look at this situation with the utmost optimism. I still believe this team has the talent to be a playoff team but a few things need to change. One of our WR's needs to start showing up and make plays for Flacco. Week after Week you see Wr's make plays for their QB and it never seems to happen with the expection of a SSS play where he breaks a few tackles. Its time for our 1st round WR to start playing like one. Second the O line needs to play much much better. I hope Stanley can play next week and we get O line continuity for the remainder of the season.
With that said, if the team can live up to its potential I still see a chance for us to enter the bye at 5-2 and finish the year 10-6. If the ravens continue to play like they are, then I see a 7-9 finish coming there way.
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tavon Young played all of his snaps on the outside yesterday after Price hurt his hamstring on the first defensive series. He did pretty well out there too. There was the play where Jackson beat him easily on a deep route and Cousins just missed, but other than that Tavon was fine. Should be the starter next week too.

Washington doesn't have big receivers that would have given him fits but neither do the Giants so I'm not too worried there. Hopefully Powers isn't awful in the slot.


Last edited by coordinator0 on Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
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RavensDefense3


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

5-2 before the bye would be awesome. The offense just needs to be average, and if the defense keeps doing what they're doing we win both of these next 2 games. Hopefully Stanley can come back this week.
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BareYourTeeth


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
Tavon Young played all of his snaps on the outside yesterday after Price hurt his hamstring on the first defensive series. He did pretty well out there too. There was the play where Jackson beat him easily on a deep route and Cousins just missed, but other than that Tavon was fine. Should be the starter next week too.

Washington doesn't have big receivers that would have given him fits but neither do the Giants so I'm not too worried there. Hopefully Powers isn't awful in the slot.


Yup for sure saw an improvement with out Wright, who if they are dumb enough to bring back next week against the Giants then we might as well forget about winning that game.

Also, I think our best lineup at offensive line is Stanley-Lewis-Jensen-Yanda-Wagner
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RavensDefense3


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2016 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Urschel would not be bad either instead of Lewis.
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