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Mitch Trubisky
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Rich7sena


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Posts: 6845
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more I watch, the less impressed I am with Trubisky. Apart from short accuracy, I don't see him stand out in many ways. He wins on UNC in a lot of the same ways Prescott is winning in Dallas. His ball placement on short passes outside the hashes is very good and he's an opportunistic hunter in the deep and intermediate game. Like Prescott, he also predominantly throws the ball from the shotgun.

For a guy playing in a spread offense with such little experience, I can't see how top half of the first round is a viable landing spot. To me, he's clearly a mid second to early third rounder for a team looking for a starting option.

From where I'm sitting, he's a lesser Alex Smith.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 16483
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trubisky got a 1st round grade from the Draft Advisory Board.

Can't see him going back now.
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Bonanza23


Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 11386
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JBURGE25 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


And you're trying to oversimplify things, see I can do it too.


Trust me I can overly complicate it too. I have the brain power. But why when I see what I see?


/r/iamverysmart


Hashtag ihazsmarts
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NormSizedMidget


Joined: 28 Mar 2011
Posts: 17813
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bonanza23 wrote:
JBURGE25 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


And you're trying to oversimplify things, see I can do it too.


Trust me I can overly complicate it too. I have the brain power. But why when I see what I see?


/r/iamverysmart


Hashtag ihazsmarts


I went to that subreddit and...



We got rekt.
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Bonanza23


Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 11386
PostPosted: Mon Dec 19, 2016 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NormSizedMidget wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
JBURGE25 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


And you're trying to oversimplify things, see I can do it too.


Trust me I can overly complicate it too. I have the brain power. But why when I see what I see?


/r/iamverysmart


Hashtag ihazsmarts


I went to that subreddit and...



We got rekt.


Hashtag solvedmankindsproblems Shocked

Could it be? Think

Laughing
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buno67


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 40670
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
It actually is. Can he throw with adequate velocity? Y/n. Can he throw with good accuracy? Y/n. Does he fumble with frequency? Y/n. If yes diagnose said fumbles. Don't complicate things. Can he play or not. I'm actually more concerned with the strength of his grip over hand size. If you can grip it with strength you can spin it.

Btw lets not be rediculous, if his hand is far under 9" I will have an issue Wink


It's another piece to the puzzle. I'm not just going to magically dock him three rounds if his hands come in under 9", but it isn't something you throw out the window. It's something that needs to be noted. There's no denying that smaller hands tend to lead towards more fumbles, and if you're not able to completely grasp the ball than you're going to have issues with grip in worse weather. Outside of maybe that hurricane weekend, what was the worst weather that Trubisky dealt with? Like anything, it needs to be under consideration. Should it push things one way or the other significantly? No.


Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


I can speak on the weather, I remember watching his HS teams in the playoffs and sitting there freezing my butt off! Wasn't playing joke teams either, playing the elite programs in the state and him having some amazing games in the poor weather
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JBURGE25


Joined: 25 Jan 2012
Posts: 18365
Location: Canada
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NormSizedMidget wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
JBURGE25 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


And you're trying to oversimplify things, see I can do it too.


Trust me I can overly complicate it too. I have the brain power. But why when I see what I see?


/r/iamverysmart


Hashtag ihazsmarts


I went to that subreddit and...



We got rekt.


one of my fav medium sized subs Laughing
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blueswedeshoes wrote:
JBURGE25 wrote:
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So I gathered.
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VanS


Joined: 21 Apr 2016
Posts: 344
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lark25 wrote:
What's not to like? He has played well against good competition consistently, makes NFL throws, has an arm, pocket presence; confidence etc and clearly upside to get better with better Qb coaching.

Who do you like as Qb prospects? Sorry to break it to you but there's not a lot of good pro prospects this year


You have to WOW me at least once as a QB before I say first round.

I've never watched Mitch Trubisky in a game and gone WOW. He does nothing remarkable. He has no remarkable physical gifts. Like someone said earlier, he's like a lesser Alex Smith. Now that is great if you're picking him in the 3rd round. But folks are talking about him as a first rounder. And that simply makes no sense to me.
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candyman93


Joined: 02 Dec 2009
Posts: 58754
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

buno67 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
It actually is. Can he throw with adequate velocity? Y/n. Can he throw with good accuracy? Y/n. Does he fumble with frequency? Y/n. If yes diagnose said fumbles. Don't complicate things. Can he play or not. I'm actually more concerned with the strength of his grip over hand size. If you can grip it with strength you can spin it.

Btw lets not be rediculous, if his hand is far under 9" I will have an issue Wink


It's another piece to the puzzle. I'm not just going to magically dock him three rounds if his hands come in under 9", but it isn't something you throw out the window. It's something that needs to be noted. There's no denying that smaller hands tend to lead towards more fumbles, and if you're not able to completely grasp the ball than you're going to have issues with grip in worse weather. Outside of maybe that hurricane weekend, what was the worst weather that Trubisky dealt with? Like anything, it needs to be under consideration. Should it push things one way or the other significantly? No.


Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


I can speak on the weather, I remember watching his HS teams in the playoffs and sitting there freezing my butt off! Wasn't playing joke teams either, playing the elite programs in the state and him having some amazing games in the poor weather


I can't believe he said Mentor isn't cold as Cleveland.
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BleedTheClock


Joined: 17 Nov 2014
Posts: 5317
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VanS wrote:
You have to WOW me at least once as a QB before I say first round.


Does Tom Brady make you say WOW? Drew Brees? Alex Smith?

You know who made me say wow in college? Robert Griffin III. Tahj Boyd. Jamarcus Russell. Johnny Manziel.

Have fun with those guys. I'll take the consistently good QB's over the occasional WOW guys.
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Yes, you guys will still win series but jokes on you because lebron going to fail again in the finals for CLE against GS or SA. Cool Sometimes i feel bad for cleveland
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G08


Joined: 28 Feb 2011
Posts: 6860
Location: World Championsville
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BleedTheClock wrote:
VanS wrote:
You have to WOW me at least once as a QB before I say first round.


Does Tom Brady make you say WOW? Drew Brees? Alex Smith?

You know who made me say wow in college? Robert Griffin III. Tahj Boyd. Jamarcus Russell. Johnny Manziel.

Have fun with those guys. I'll take the consistently good QB's over the occasional WOW guys.


Great post.

Give me the accurate dude that consistently reads defenses well over the flash in the pan, rocket armed QBs.
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topwop1 wrote:
My point is you can find a franchise guy like [Derek] Carr in every draft


"I thought it was a stroke of genius. You give [Pace] an A++++ for the move to get Trubisky. That was magnificient." - Bill Polian
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Bonanza23


Joined: 10 Nov 2008
Posts: 11386
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

candyman93 wrote:
buno67 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
CWood21 wrote:
Bonanza23 wrote:
It actually is. Can he throw with adequate velocity? Y/n. Can he throw with good accuracy? Y/n. Does he fumble with frequency? Y/n. If yes diagnose said fumbles. Don't complicate things. Can he play or not. I'm actually more concerned with the strength of his grip over hand size. If you can grip it with strength you can spin it.

Btw lets not be rediculous, if his hand is far under 9" I will have an issue Wink


It's another piece to the puzzle. I'm not just going to magically dock him three rounds if his hands come in under 9", but it isn't something you throw out the window. It's something that needs to be noted. There's no denying that smaller hands tend to lead towards more fumbles, and if you're not able to completely grasp the ball than you're going to have issues with grip in worse weather. Outside of maybe that hurricane weekend, what was the worst weather that Trubisky dealt with? Like anything, it needs to be under consideration. Should it push things one way or the other significantly? No.


Again you're making it too complicated. Can he throw or no?

Btw he played in Mentor Ohio in high school. Not necessarily snow belt weather but I can guarantee you he's faced adversity and has done just fine.


I can speak on the weather, I remember watching his HS teams in the playoffs and sitting there freezing my butt off! Wasn't playing joke teams either, playing the elite programs in the state and him having some amazing games in the poor weather


I can't believe he said Mentor isn't cold as Cleveland.


Who said that?
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Rich7sena


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Posts: 6845
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BleedTheClock wrote:
VanS wrote:
You have to WOW me at least once as a QB before I say first round.


Does Tom Brady make you say WOW? Drew Brees? Alex Smith?

You know who made me say wow in college? Robert Griffin III. Tahj Boyd. Jamarcus Russell. Johnny Manziel.

Have fun with those guys. I'll take the consistently good QB's over the occasional WOW guys.


One of these is not like the other. Also, Brady and Brees "wow" pretty often.

On your second point, many of the successful QBs in recent drafts did possess "wow" traits, not just the busts you cherry picked (and weirdly threw Tahj Boyd in the mix).

QBs who "wowed" in college and are doing alright in the NFL: Dak Prescott, Jameis Winston, Marcus Mariota, Derek Carr, Matthew Stafford, Joe Flacco, Russell Wilson, Cam Newton, Ben Roethlisberger

I could name more - to me "wow" means more than just running around and throwing the ball - but it's not a bad thing to show some above average traits in college.
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BleedTheClock


Joined: 17 Nov 2014
Posts: 5317
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 9:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay but if you NEED to be wowed by QB's in college, you're going to miss out on good ones. He was also referencing WOW traits. Like having monster arms and having the ability to run all over the place.

I want an accurate pocket passer that can make big time throws under pressure. Accuracy to all levels. Protects the football. Zip on the ball instead of how far you can throw it.

You whiff on guys like Carr & Bridgewater if you watch tapes looking to simply be wowed by spectacular plays. Matt Ryan made nobody say wow at BC. Dalton? Rivers? Cousins? All pretty meh in college.

Sometimes the simpleton prospects are great prospects. Trubisky is not an elite prospect, but he's worthy of a top 5 selection. Also, he's got considerable upside. He is a better athlete than given credit for and he's got a beastly arm. Not sure what kind of freaks Van wants, but Trubisky has above average arm strength and movement skills when compared to the average NFL QB.
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Yes, you guys will still win series but jokes on you because lebron going to fail again in the finals for CLE against GS or SA. Cool Sometimes i feel bad for cleveland
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Rich7sena


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Posts: 6845
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2016 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BleedTheClock wrote:
Okay but if you NEED to be wowed by QB's in college, you're going to miss out on good ones. He was also referencing WOW traits. Like having monster arms and having the ability to run all over the place.

I don't think that's out of the question when you're considering a QB in the first round. Drafting a QB in the first is a pretty big commitment. Displaying elite traits is exactly what a first round QB should do.

Quote:
I want an accurate pocket passer that can make big time throws under pressure. Accuracy to all levels. Protects the football. Zip on the ball instead of how far you can throw it.

I'd contest the player you described is not Mitch Trubisky.

Quote:
You whiff on guys like Carr & Bridgewater if you watch tapes looking to simply be wowed by spectacular plays. Matt Ryan made nobody say wow at BC. Dalton? Rivers? Cousins? All pretty meh in college.

Carr displayed "wow" arm strength at Fresno State. I graded Bridgewater as the #1 QB form that class and contest he had "wow" pocket presence/mobility and "wow" ball placement and accuracy. I didn't evaluate Ryan, Rivers or Cousins. Dalton is in Trubisky's wheelhouse skills-wise, but I'd argue he went right where he was supposed to go in the draft.

Quote:
Sometimes the simpleton prospects are great prospects. Trubisky is not an elite prospect, but he's worthy of a top 5 selection. Also, he's got considerable upside. He is a better athlete than given credit for and he's got a beastly arm. Not sure what kind of freaks Van wants, but Trubisky has above average arm strength and movement skills when compared to the average NFL QB.

I disagree with the bolded. A QB going top 5 should be an elite prospect. I also disagree that he has a beastly arm. I think there needs to be more caution around Trubisky considering his small sample size, lack or experience, and offensive system (compounded).
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