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fly eagles fly


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's hard to say but I imagine that we'd be going after Hargreaves if it were between the two. Howie's methodical and I think he'd be one of the guys who doesn't believe he needs to draft a running back that high. I could certainly be wrong but that's what I'd assume he'd do. I would also do the same, so I'm sure that's clouding my judgment.
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JayWood2010


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Elliot very well could be going to Dallas, so definitely not a lock.

Even at that I could see Eagles going Guard or Cornerback.
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NorfNorf


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayWood2010 wrote:
Elliot very well could be going to Dallas, so definitely not a lock.

Even at that I could see Eagles going Guard or Cornerback.


Top ten pick on a guard??
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JayWood2010


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NorfNorf wrote:
JayWood2010 wrote:
Elliot very well could be going to Dallas, so definitely not a lock.

Even at that I could see Eagles going Guard or Cornerback.


Top ten pick on a guard??


An OT or OG, yeah. We have strengthened the line in FA, but there is still issues. While Peters will be staying he is also aging, and a bit of an injury risk with all of what happened last year.

If Pederson has a similar style to Andy Reid, i can imagine he believes in a strong offensive line.

Not saying it would happen, but i wouldnt doubt it either. Though you are right that it is unlikely.
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EaglesPeteC


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JayWood2010 wrote:
NorfNorf wrote:
JayWood2010 wrote:
Elliot very well could be going to Dallas, so definitely not a lock.

Even at that I could see Eagles going Guard or Cornerback.


Top ten pick on a guard??


An OT or OG, yeah. We have strengthened the line in FA, but there is still issues. While Peters will be staying he is also aging, and a bit of an injury risk with all of what happened last year.

If Pederson has a similar style to Andy Reid, i can imagine he believes in a strong offensive line.

Not saying it would happen, but i wouldnt doubt it either. Though you are right that it is unlikely.


It's kind of hard to justify picking a guy at 8 who's future is at G or RT. Lane was drafted and played RT but we all knew his future was at LT. If we take Stanley at 8 he is staying at RT. A good RT or G can be had in the 3rd.
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Kiltman


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EaglesPeteC wrote:
JayWood2010 wrote:
NorfNorf wrote:
JayWood2010 wrote:
Elliot very well could be going to Dallas, so definitely not a lock.

Even at that I could see Eagles going Guard or Cornerback.


Top ten pick on a guard??


An OT or OG, yeah. We have strengthened the line in FA, but there is still issues. While Peters will be staying he is also aging, and a bit of an injury risk with all of what happened last year.

If Pederson has a similar style to Andy Reid, i can imagine he believes in a strong offensive line.

Not saying it would happen, but i wouldnt doubt it either. Though you are right that it is unlikely.


It's kind of hard to justify picking a guy at 8 who's future is at G or RT. Lane was drafted and played RT but we all knew his future was at LT. If we take Stanley at 8 he is staying at RT. A good RT or G can be had in the 3rd.

Depends what you're asking of your RT, and as a whole it's a step down from LT but ever increasingly more important. But yea top ten is a stretch.

As for guard...yea never draft a guard top 10. The impact just isn't there.
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EAGLES3658


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think RT is becoming every bit as important as LT. Look at the guys who line up over the RT now...Von Miller...JJ Watt. You don't want a 3rd rounder going up against those guys. They could single-handedly lose the game for you.
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ninjapirate


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2016 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pederson is coming from a team that drafted a rookie of the year type corner in the first that helped shore up that defense.


Howie is a gator.


Corner is an Andy reid valued position.



Vh3 almostmakes too much sense
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McNabb2Maclin


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would pick a Gaurd in the top 10 over a RB in the top 10 if they are similar talents, especially with us because I think we are a Guard away from a potentially elite offensive line.
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Kiltman


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McNabb2Maclin wrote:
I would pick a Gaurd in the top 10 over a RB in the top 10 if they are similar talents, especially with us because I think we are a Guard away from a potentially elite offensive line.

But we lack playmakers and offensive identity...both of which a RB could provide. The sheer amount of impact a top 10 RB provides blows guard out of the water.

I have nothing against guards, hell I played and now coach them. But the value just isn't there unless it's a historically bad top of a draft.

Guard is a position you can find anywhere in the draft. Need to find a guy whose skillset matches what you ask of your guards...which is different team to team. We will be able to find a guard in the 3rd or 4th who can come in and be good.
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EaglesPeteC


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kiltman wrote:
McNabb2Maclin wrote:
I would pick a Gaurd in the top 10 over a RB in the top 10 if they are similar talents, especially with us because I think we are a Guard away from a potentially elite offensive line.

But we lack playmakers and offensive identity...both of which a RB could provide. The sheer amount of impact a top 10 RB provides blows guard out of the water.

I have nothing against guards, hell I played and now coach them. But the value just isn't there unless it's a historically bad top of a draft.

Guard is a position you can find anywhere in the draft. Need to find a guy whose skillset matches what you ask of your guards...which is different team to team. We will be able to find a guard in the 3rd or 4th who can come in and be good.


This. With Bradford and our current WR crop, Elliott at 8 and a G in the 3rd could really be the best thing for this team.

Right now as the team is currently constructed, we are asking Bradford to win games with Mathhews, Agholor, Huff and Ertz with decent RB's. That isn't going to end well.

Add Elliott and another G and we are asking Bradford and those WR's to compliment. That makes much more sense to me.
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jaymiz


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EaglesPeteC wrote:
Kiltman wrote:
McNabb2Maclin wrote:
I would pick a Gaurd in the top 10 over a RB in the top 10 if they are similar talents, especially with us because I think we are a Guard away from a potentially elite offensive line.

But we lack playmakers and offensive identity...both of which a RB could provide. The sheer amount of impact a top 10 RB provides blows guard out of the water.

I have nothing against guards, hell I played and now coach them. But the value just isn't there unless it's a historically bad top of a draft.

Guard is a position you can find anywhere in the draft. Need to find a guy whose skillset matches what you ask of your guards...which is different team to team. We will be able to find a guard in the 3rd or 4th who can come in and be good.


This. With Bradford and our current WR crop, Elliott at 8 and a G in the 3rd could really be the best thing for this team.

Right now as the team is currently constructed, we are asking Bradford to win games with Mathhews, Agholor, Huff and Ertz with decent RB's. That isn't going to end well.

Add Elliott and another G and we are asking Bradford and those WR's to compliment. That makes much more sense to me.



How often is a team in a position to draft a potential shut down CB? And how often is a team in a position to draft a good RB?

This debate is about positional value. The RB who holds this franchise's ALL TIME rushing record was drafted in the second round.

Were drafting in the top 10. We have a franchise LT of the future on the team. There is no pass rusher worth the pick. There is no QB (Cook, Lynch) worth the pick.

QB
LT
DE
CB


The studs of those positions are taken in the top 10. The only one that makes sense for THIS TEAM is Vernon.


Elliot is a great player but when you have a shot at a shut down CB you take it. It completely transforms your defense. Take Sherman, Revis, Peterson, et al away from their teams and the defenses are markedly less effective.
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killdawabbit


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jaymiz wrote:
EaglesPeteC wrote:
Kiltman wrote:
McNabb2Maclin wrote:
I would pick a Gaurd in the top 10 over a RB in the top 10 if they are similar talents, especially with us because I think we are a Guard away from a potentially elite offensive line.

But we lack playmakers and offensive identity...both of which a RB could provide. The sheer amount of impact a top 10 RB provides blows guard out of the water.

I have nothing against guards, hell I played and now coach them. But the value just isn't there unless it's a historically bad top of a draft.

Guard is a position you can find anywhere in the draft. Need to find a guy whose skillset matches what you ask of your guards...which is different team to team. We will be able to find a guard in the 3rd or 4th who can come in and be good.


This. With Bradford and our current WR crop, Elliott at 8 and a G in the 3rd could really be the best thing for this team.

Right now as the team is currently constructed, we are asking Bradford to win games with Mathhews, Agholor, Huff and Ertz with decent RB's. That isn't going to end well.

Add Elliott and another G and we are asking Bradford and those WR's to compliment. That makes much more sense to me.



How often is a team in a position to draft a potential shut down CB? And how often is a team in a position to draft a good RB?

This debate is about positional value. The RB who holds this franchise's ALL TIME rushing record was drafted in the second round.

Were drafting in the top 10. We have a franchise LT of the future on the team. There is no pass rusher worth the pick. There is no QB (Cook, Lynch) worth the pick.

QB
LT
DE
CB


The studs of those positions are taken in the top 10. The only one that makes sense for THIS TEAM is Vernon.


Elliot is a great player but when you have a shot at a shut down CB you take it. It completely transforms your defense. Take Sherman, Revis, Peterson, et al away from their teams and the defenses are markedly less effective.


Eh. (Once again, saying that a lot here lately) There are exactly 3 Elite level prospects in this draft. In order: Ramsey, Elliot, Jack. Hargreaves is a good CB prospect, but he's not Ramsey.

The Eagles have something like 9 CBs on the roster right now. They made a point of picking up 2 in FA and re-signing a third. It would be a mild surprise if they went CB early.

As of right now, the Eagles have no proven impact players on offense. Zero. The offense lacks anything resembling an identity and offers nothing that opposing coodinators need to account for. They also have no starting RB. Of the ones they have, one is too often injured, one is good but getting old and not a 3 down player, and one is mediocre at best.

There have been exactly 2 RB prospects in the last 10 years as good or better than Zeke. No, they didn't immediately put their team on their back and run them to a superbowl, but they did provide their offenses with an identity. They did provide impact. Couple that with the defense the team seems to be building and you just might have something.

I'm not saying the Eagles will take him if he is there, but I am saying they should strongly consider it. "Positional value" be damned when an elite talent is on the board.

A draft with Zeke in the first and a guy like Westerman or McGovern in the third would be a big win.
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Kiltman


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2016 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll try to find video of Howie talking, but here are some of his comments about RBs...

Quote:
Roseman on RBs: When you find a special talent at that position .. thatís a unique weapon. I donít think the position is de-valued


Quote:
Howie said "narrative" that RBs are easy to find late in draft isn't necessarily true. Distinguished b/w a role player and difference-maker.


I agree, and I think it's what some of us who are pro-RB or at least ok with taking a RB have said.

Difference-makers/impact playmakers are what we need. A role player like he talks about might do alright..but since we don't have difference-makers many other places you have to consider using #8 on Elliot if he's BPA. Otherwise it's a bunch of role players going nowhere. Probably Ertz is the closest difference-maker if he continues where he left off last year. But adding a RB like that would help everything.
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Hockey5djh


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

killdawabbit wrote:
There are exactly 3 Elite level prospects in this draft. In order: Ramsey, Elliot, Jack. Hargreaves is a good CB prospect, but he's not Ramsey.


You keep projecting Elliott as one of these can't miss "Elite" prospects. Where do you think he would rank if he came out with next year's crop? (Fournette, Cook, Chubb, McCaffery)

Part of my reasoning in asking this is to promote patience.

I agree with not missing an elite talent but because of RB being a devalued position (despite how people want to use Howie's words) I believe we can get a very comparable talent NEXT year at a much cheaper price when we have a better idea of what the direction of the team is and what the team needs going forward.
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