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hornbybrown


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:15 pm    Post subject: Time to name a Starter Reply with quote

Both QB's looked terrible.

Someone needs a chance to get in synch with the WR's Someone needs to get all the first team reps.

This is not fair on either QB.

We have to name a starter now.

I want it to be Manziel but if it's Hoyer that's fine.
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Dawgpoun8017


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

after both looking bad I would say if it was me id prolly go Manziel, he has potential on his side atleast, Hoyer imo is what he is
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pettine will go with Hoyer almost guarenteed. They really don't want to start a rookie and the only way Manziel starts is if Hoyer is injured.

Defensive minded HC's think they can win with Defense and running the football. They don't need an offense nor do they need offensive playmakers just someone to manage the game and swap field position.
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sdrawkcab321


Joined: 23 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The fans didnt buy season tickets to see hoyer. Give em johnny. Give him all the 1st team reps. Get the chemistry down
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bosko1616


Joined: 22 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.
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hornbybrown


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.


I get the feeling everyone thinks he is at least a year away. Maybe 2. So they will red-shirt him this year. Pettine is that stubborn to the point he would rather start a vet than a rook even if it meant he would go 0-16.

He is a defensive head coach and thinks he can beat you with running the ball and defense (which with all these defensive holding calls is an absolute joke). Why bother throwing the ball. Just eat up time and field position and maybe get 1 more FG than the opposing team.
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hornbybrown


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.


I get the feeling everyone thinks he is at least a year away. Maybe 2. So they will red-shirt him this year. Pettine is that stubborn to the point he would rather start a vet than a rook even if it meant he would go 0-16.

He is a defensive head coach and thinks he can beat you with running the ball and defense (which with all these defensive holding calls is an absolute joke). Why bother throwing the ball. Just eat up time and field position and maybe get 1 more FG than the opposing team.


He needs to have more smarts than that. I have no doubt Haslim is ok with dumping another Coach after one year.

Which scares me as we need to be patient
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.


I get the feeling everyone thinks he is at least a year away. Maybe 2. So they will red-shirt him this year. Pettine is that stubborn to the point he would rather start a vet than a rook even if it meant he would go 0-16.

He is a defensive head coach and thinks he can beat you with running the ball and defense (which with all these defensive holding calls is an absolute joke). Why bother throwing the ball. Just eat up time and field position and maybe get 1 more FG than the opposing team.


He needs to have more smarts than that. I have no doubt Haslim is ok with dumping another Coach after one year.

Which scares me as we need to be patient


Yes we need to be patient. I can see certain things happening mostly Pettine thinking that he can beat you like the Ravens did in 2001 with Trent Dilfer.

He is of that mindset. We need to have long drives on offense (eat clock) and short drives on defense.

Doesn't say anything about scoring on those long offensive drives they just need to happen.
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ArrowheadRage58


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BooyaCS wrote:
Pettine will go with Hoyer almost guarenteed. They really don't want to start a rookie and the only way Manziel starts is if Hoyer is injured.

Defensive minded HC's think they can win with Defense and running the football. They don't need an offense nor do they need offensive playmakers just someone to manage the game and swap field position.


I agree...when it's too close to call, yet another coach who will go with experience over the guy who will actually improve. Which makes no sense. Experience is PART of being good, if you have that over the other QB and STILL aren't better, you go with the upside.

BooyaCS wrote:


You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

.


How many TO's does Manziel have so far? Sure he will eventually, but where is the evidence he is more TO prone than Hoyer? From what I can tell Hoyer's been "off" high more often, Manziel "off" low. The high throws will lead to more picks.
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Last edited by ArrowheadRage58 on Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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hornbybrown


Joined: 25 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.


I get the feeling everyone thinks he is at least a year away. Maybe 2. So they will red-shirt him this year. Pettine is that stubborn to the point he would rather start a vet than a rook even if it meant he would go 0-16.

He is a defensive head coach and thinks he can beat you with running the ball and defense (which with all these defensive holding calls is an absolute joke). Why bother throwing the ball. Just eat up time and field position and maybe get 1 more FG than the opposing team.


He needs to have more smarts than that. I have no doubt Haslim is ok with dumping another Coach after one year.

Which scares me as we need to be patient


Yes we need to be patient. I can see certain things happening mostly Pettine thinking that he can beat you like the Ravens did in 2001 with Trent Dilfer.

He is of that mindset. We need to have long drives on offense (eat clock) and short drives on defense.

Doesn't say anything about scoring on those long offensive drives they just need to happen.


I think our running game is going to be able to help a lot with that. My fear is that defenses have tape on Hoyer now and that they are going to blow him up this year.

Also he is not stepping into his throws properly which will be because of his knee. He doesn't look near the QB that sparked us last year.

Which may partly be down to not getting all the first team reps. But he didn't get them last year till the week he became starter....
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
Pettine will go with Hoyer almost guarenteed. They really don't want to start a rookie and the only way Manziel starts is if Hoyer is injured.

Defensive minded HC's think they can win with Defense and running the football. They don't need an offense nor do they need offensive playmakers just someone to manage the game and swap field position.


I agree...when it's too close to call, yet another coach who will go with experience over the guy who will actually improve. Which makes no sense. Experience is PART of being good, if you have that over the other QB and STILL aren't better, you go with the upside.


Except when the coach and gm have come out and basically said the QB doesn't matter they will be a run first team that beats you with Defense.

That worked 20 years ago. Now not so much. Why do we go with coaches that are so adverse to running anything that resembles a passing attack? The league isn't you run to set up the pass the league is you pass to set up the run. Has been that way for the past 10 to 15 years.
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BooyaCS


Joined: 27 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
hornbybrown wrote:
BooyaCS wrote:
bosko1616 wrote:
Hoyer will start. Get crushed the first three games. Manziel will start after the bye week when the OL starts to jell and Gordon's suspension is over Wink


I doubt Manziel sees the field at all this season. Remember Pettine said he wants to be a run first offense and have a good defense.

You don't have a playmaking QB do that you stick in the guy that doesn't do much except not turn the ball over.

If Hoyer goes down I think they skip Manziel and go to Grossman. It seems they are going out of their way to not start Manziel.


That's not the feeling I get. I do think they will start Hoyer which I think is a mistake. I don't think Manziel will be number three.


I get the feeling everyone thinks he is at least a year away. Maybe 2. So they will red-shirt him this year. Pettine is that stubborn to the point he would rather start a vet than a rook even if it meant he would go 0-16.

He is a defensive head coach and thinks he can beat you with running the ball and defense (which with all these defensive holding calls is an absolute joke). Why bother throwing the ball. Just eat up time and field position and maybe get 1 more FG than the opposing team.


He needs to have more smarts than that. I have no doubt Haslim is ok with dumping another Coach after one year.

Which scares me as we need to be patient


Yes we need to be patient. I can see certain things happening mostly Pettine thinking that he can beat you like the Ravens did in 2001 with Trent Dilfer.

He is of that mindset. We need to have long drives on offense (eat clock) and short drives on defense.

Doesn't say anything about scoring on those long offensive drives they just need to happen.


I think our running game is going to be able to help a lot with that. My fear is that defenses have tape on Hoyer now and that they are going to blow him up this year.

Also he is not stepping into his throws properly which will be because of his knee. He doesn't look near the QB that sparked us last year.

Which may partly be down to not getting all the first team reps. But he didn't get them last year till the week he became starter....


He doesn't trust the knee and is afraid to get hit. He is throwing the ball so quick that he doesn't get hit. He is skittish in the pocket because of that and will cost us games.
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Thomas5737


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 18, 2014 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see no way you can't start Manziel. Manziel can move around in the pocket which will lead to at least one illegal contact penalty per set of downs. We can storm down the field one 5 yard penalty at a time. Seems obvious to me.

Over/Under number of illegal contact flags get thrown (and picked back up) on runs this year. I'm going with 10.
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