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What does Dennis Allen need to do to stick around?
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MrOaktown_56


Joined: 15 Dec 2013
Posts: 1169
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I really like DA but I think it'll take at least 6 wins to keep his job. The problem is if we pick high and DA loses his job, Carr will get the boot so we would have wasted a high 2nd rounder on nothing (a la the Mike Glennon situation in TB). I like the QBs at the top of the draft next year but I would rather roll with carr and land another blue chip prospect (OT/DE/DT/WR). This makes me wonder if in the end it would have been smarter to take Allen Robinson, Rashede Hageman, Kony Ealy, or any other player who could have been a contributor right away for us. Hopefully DA keeps his job so carr can continue to develop. I truly think that he can be special for us in the right situation.
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dawsonleery


Joined: 31 Oct 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Reggie McKenzie will be safe no matter what... Unless we tank and win like 2 games but realistically I think Dennis Allen needs to hit .500, if Raiders go 8-8, I think its a given Allen would return for his 4th year.

I have heard a number of times the Raiders Organization as a whole is pretty high on offensive line coach Tony Sparano, he was brought in by Reggie McKenzie, he was made Assistant Head Coach and Mark Davis made it a point to give him a 2 year contact extension. Sparano took over a 1 win Dolphins team and took them to the playoffs the next season. He was 2931 as Head Coach in Miami and will be in the mix to replace Allen if he is indeed fired. Just my opinion on some of the things I've heard.
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RaiderX


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

6 wins including an upset, but they will have to be competitive in almost every game.
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Chali21


Joined: 07 Feb 2007
Posts: 2915
Location: Cali
PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dawsonleery wrote:
I think Reggie McKenzie will be safe no matter what... Unless we tank and win like 2 games but realistically I think Dennis Allen needs to hit .500, if Raiders go 8-8, I think its a given Allen would return for his 4th year.

I have heard a number of times the Raiders Organization as a whole is pretty high on offensive line coach Tony Sparano, he was brought in by Reggie McKenzie, he was made Assistant Head Coach and Mark Davis made it a point to give him a 2 year contact extension. Sparano took over a 1 win Dolphins team and took them to the playoffs the next season. He was 2931 as Head Coach in Miami and will be in the mix to replace Allen if he is indeed fired. Just my opinion on some of the things I've heard.


Allen goes 8-8 then he'd be a head coach of the year candidate.

But I think the Sparano thing reminds me of the Tom Cable situation we had a few years ago. My hope is that Allen doesn't get fired mid season. Nothing says dissfunctional like that.
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CrashMan510


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

not get blown out, put up a fight, and win some games

be competitive
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SPaceGhost


Joined: 01 Mar 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrOaktown_56 wrote:
I really like DA but I think it'll take at least 6 wins to keep his job. The problem is if we pick high and DA loses his job, Carr will get the boot so we would have wasted a high 2nd rounder on nothing (a la the Mike Glennon situation in TB). I like the QBs at the top of the draft next year but I would rather roll with carr and land another blue chip prospect (OT/DE/DT/WR). This makes me wonder if in the end it would have been smarter to take Allen Robinson, Rashede Hageman, Kony Ealy, or any other player who could have been a contributor right away for us. Hopefully DA keeps his job so carr can continue to develop. I truly think that he can be special for us in the right situation.


Even if RM and DA get the boot after this year, or during the season, Carr will stay. The incoming HC and OC would love to have that kind of prospect to develop, not give away, and like you said it would be wasteful. (*I didn't want Carr, but we got 'im so let's keep and use 'im Wink )
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oakdb36


Joined: 02 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I only know what he can't do. Getting regularly outcoached in the 2nd half. Flip flopping QBs like he has no idea what he's doing. Going through multiple games with the team showing no heart and effort. Getting blown out by division rivals. Failing to adjust his gameplan throughout the year (especially defensively).
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MrOaktown_56


Joined: 15 Dec 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPaceGhost wrote:
MrOaktown_56 wrote:
I really like DA but I think it'll take at least 6 wins to keep his job. The problem is if we pick high and DA loses his job, Carr will get the boot so we would have wasted a high 2nd rounder on nothing (a la the Mike Glennon situation in TB). I like the QBs at the top of the draft next year but I would rather roll with carr and land another blue chip prospect (OT/DE/DT/WR). This makes me wonder if in the end it would have been smarter to take Allen Robinson, Rashede Hageman, Kony Ealy, or any other player who could have been a contributor right away for us. Hopefully DA keeps his job so carr can continue to develop. I truly think that he can be special for us in the right situation.


Even if RM and DA get the boot after this year, or during the season, Carr will stay. The incoming HC and OC would love to have that kind of prospect to develop, not give away, and like you said it would be wasteful. (*I didn't want Carr, but we got 'im so let's keep and use 'im Wink )


In my opinion head coaches like to get their "guy" for their system, especially if they switch from a west coast ofense to a vertical offense (which I think carr could excel at Very Happy). Ideally it wouldn't affect carr but numerous qbs have been replaced following a poor season like Glennon, Clausen (i know he sucked), etc. If we pick top 3, I have a bad feeling a new hc staff will choose mariota or winston and deal carr to a team needing a developmental qb like the saints. Maybe its just me.
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Chali21


Joined: 07 Feb 2007
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Location: Cali
PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrOaktown_56 wrote:
SPaceGhost wrote:
MrOaktown_56 wrote:
I really like DA but I think it'll take at least 6 wins to keep his job. The problem is if we pick high and DA loses his job, Carr will get the boot so we would have wasted a high 2nd rounder on nothing (a la the Mike Glennon situation in TB). I like the QBs at the top of the draft next year but I would rather roll with carr and land another blue chip prospect (OT/DE/DT/WR). This makes me wonder if in the end it would have been smarter to take Allen Robinson, Rashede Hageman, Kony Ealy, or any other player who could have been a contributor right away for us. Hopefully DA keeps his job so carr can continue to develop. I truly think that he can be special for us in the right situation.


Even if RM and DA get the boot after this year, or during the season, Carr will stay. The incoming HC and OC would love to have that kind of prospect to develop, not give away, and like you said it would be wasteful. (*I didn't want Carr, but we got 'im so let's keep and use 'im Wink )


In my opinion head coaches like to get their "guy" for their system, especially if they switch from a west coast ofense to a vertical offense (which I think carr could excel at Very Happy). Ideally it wouldn't affect carr but numerous qbs have been replaced following a poor season like Glennon, Clausen (i know he sucked), etc. If we pick top 3, I have a bad feeling a new hc staff will choose mariota or winston and deal carr to a team needing a developmental qb like the saints. Maybe its just me.


I'd hate Mariota. I think he's going to be a bust.
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SPaceGhost


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oakdb36 wrote:
I only know what he can't do. Getting regularly outcoached in the 2nd half. Flip flopping QBs like he has no idea what he's doing. Going through multiple games with the team showing no heart and effort. Getting blown out by division rivals. Failing to adjust his gameplan throughout the year (especially defensively).


The "flip-flopping QBs" is exactly what I was talking about in relation to RM possibly lording it over DA, the reason I 'heard' is so the RAIDERS could see what they had in Terrell Pryor and if they would move forward with him. If not, then DA looked like a complete idiot ("DASchizo") and has no business being our HC.

I also question the lack of heart... is that the team dropping games on purpose to get a higher draft pick, or on DAs head for not having his team ready with a scheme and properly motivated? Unfortunately I'm no mind-reader and the only people who know would be the coaches and possibly FO execs... and they ain't gonna talk.
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 8675
PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In all honesty I liked the strides our team has made in a lot of areas. Now weaknesses have been revealed for sure but they look to be correctable and we appear to be headed in the right direction. If we take a step back with improved players then he is gone. If we keep moving forward and our guys we got in FA and draft are even 75% of what we think they are then we should be in pretty good shape to win a good amount of games. The development of our young guys will speak volumes and the vets they brought in should really help with that.

I only see fans really questioning why he went to Pryor again at the end of season. Makes sense to see if a talent like that has made enough progression that you can work with in a game that doesnt matter. And most certainly it was an orginazation decision rather than a coaching decision. Personally I was very harsh on second half adjustments and still am. However there was depth issues and we never could really play the way it was intended. For instance 3rd string OL playing a ton of games, Woodson playing almost 100% snaps along with B. Ross. No DL depth at all. These are just some examples that I think the depth we have now can address. Hindsight it could have been a lot worse than it was. Heck could have been a lot better if little things didnt happen. Like Jano having his worst season ever. Imagine how some of those games might have looked with 3 points here and there.

I am not saying DA hasn't made mistakes because he has but stuff you would expect from a young coach. For the most part he has learned from them and the team to me has kept progressing as a whole. I am not sure that if we had any other coach they would have been done much better even though we might feel more confident as fans that they were behind the scenes. I mean really is there any coach out there that you think wow if we had him we would have won more games last year and "x" player would have played much better than they did? I cant looking at our roster last season. Maybe a Pete Carroll type but he really needs a certain type of player also.
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oakdb36


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TiberiusRising wrote:
For the most part he has learned from them and the team to me has kept progressing as a whole.


The team was in a free fall to end the season.
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Baggabonez


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SPaceGhost wrote:
oakdb36 wrote:
I only know what he can't do. Getting regularly outcoached in the 2nd half. Flip flopping QBs like he has no idea what he's doing. Going through multiple games with the team showing no heart and effort. Getting blown out by division rivals. Failing to adjust his gameplan throughout the year (especially defensively).


The "flip-flopping QBs" is exactly what I was talking about in relation to RM possibly lording it over DA, the reason I 'heard' is so the RAIDERS could see what they had in Terrell Pryor and if they would move forward with him. If not, then DA looked like a complete idiot ("DASchizo") and has no business being our HC.

I also question the lack of heart... is that the team dropping games on purpose to get a higher draft pick, or on DAs head for not having his team ready with a scheme and properly motivated? Unfortunately I'm no mind-reader and the only people who know would be the coaches and possibly FO execs... and they ain't gonna talk.


My issues with keeping DA on a short lease are two-fold: 1) DA didn't flipflop QBs he was mandated to make switches. When he went to McGloin he wanted to stick with him. I think that the majority of folks who think DA is a flipflopper are people who wanted him to stick with Pryor. (I still don't get the adoration but whatever) 2) The FO gutted the team so they should credit DA those years.

If the Raiders were dropping games on purpose them they did a [inappropriate/removed]-poor job as they didn't get Clowney (and probably better off now). The thing I will hold DA directly accountable for is hiring Knapp, which I believe should have gotten him fired and McKenzie on the hotseat but now that's in the past. My primary concern now is the development of Carr and Mack (who I think can become the face of the franchise). I'm really excited to see how DA uses Mack. If DA does get the axe the next guy needs to keep the defensive system. I really do believe Mack can play very similar to Miller, less explosive pass rusher but stronger and more stout.
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RaisinBran


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Allen needs to get at the very least 6 wins IMO. There should be a slight improvement from last season. Of course this assumes no injuries that completely destroy the season.
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TiberiusRising


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oakdb36 wrote:
TiberiusRising wrote:
For the most part he has learned from them and the team to me has kept progressing as a whole.


The team was in a free fall to end the season.

That is why as I said as a whole. While it would appear the whole team free falled I dont believe that to be true. Some players actually elevated their play towards the end of the season. However the poor QB play by both guys, Jano's continued failures and even more injuries were more visible and contributed greatly to said free fall.
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