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The Vikings 2014 offense under Norv Turner
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How will the 2014 Vikings offense compare to last year?
Much better
37%
 37%  [ 17 ]
Better
53%
 53%  [ 24 ]
More or less the same
8%
 8%  [ 4 ]
Worse
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Much worse
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 45

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Virginia Viking


Joined: 27 Dec 2007
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Location: Winchester, VA
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I picked "better." While Turner is a better OC then head coach, I am reminded that his Super Bowl success came when he really wasn't running an Air Coryell offense. The Coryell offense has been around now more than 40 years! Good defensive coordinators have pretty much been able to scheme against it pretty well. For it to be successful in this age, the Vikings are going to have to have the best performers in the skill positions every game day. The Vikings major glaring weakness this coming season will be at QB. It's a learning year for Bridgewater, and neither Ponder or Cassell are going to lead the Vikings anywhere...heck, they may even have trouble leaving the locker room to find the field at Gopher Stadium!!!
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Bermuda Viking


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My rosy pick was much better - top 10. Certainly not top five, but maybe #10.

Norv improves the scheme.

Our defense gets more turnovers and stops leading to more offensive opportunities.
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since72


Joined: 16 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

StarTribune wrote:
Turner surprisingly loud

While Zimmer has the reputation as a fiery coach, his voice hasn’t been the loudest during the open OTA sessions.

It’s been offensive coordinator Norv Turner. Even Zimmer didn’t anticipate that from Turner.

“I love it; he’s coaching them hard,” Zimmer said. “He’s demanding. He’s very similar to me in a lot of ways, and it’s been great.”

It surprised receiver Greg Jennings as well because of Turner’s laid-back personality.

“You catch him out here, and you would never know that was him on the football field,” Jennings said. “You got to love a guy like that because he’s going to work when it’s time to work, and he’s going to be able to loosen up when he can.”


http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/261914511.html

.
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Krauser


Joined: 20 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Aaron Schatz ‏@FO_ASchatz 4h
Shocking fact just discovered while working on FOA: 2013 Minnesota had worst offensive DVOA on second-and-short EVER. That's just nuts.

Ken Berman ‏@kenberman 4h
@FO_ASchatz is DVOA by splits predictive or more explanatory? IOW, does that point to MINN being bad again on 2nd and short vs explain?

Aaron Schatz ‏@FO_ASchatz
Poor DVOA on 2nd-short is historically a good indicator of improvement in Y+1


Translation: Football Outsiders stat DVOA (an indicator of overall offensive efficiency, including 1st downs, TDs, turnovers) shows the 2013 Vikings were the worst offense ever in their history of charting (dating back to 1989) on 2nd down and short, a situation that usually greatly favors the offense.

A poor performance on that stat tends to predict that the offense will be more successful the next year, presumably because some element of their 2nd-and-short failures was due to bad luck or other statistical noise, not an actual lack of quality.
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xmichaelp


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Better this year. Much better down the line.
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rpmwr19


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you have Adrian Peterson, second and short should be your bread and butter down/distance.

That's just pathetic.
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vikingsrule


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rpmwr19 wrote:
When you have Adrian Peterson, second and short should be your bread and butter down/distance.

That's just pathetic.


Perhaps they threw more on 2nd and short than they should have.

This is just a personal preference of mine, but when it is 2nd and short, i'm most always taking a shot down the field. Its a free down if you have an offense that you can trust in third and short situations.

Given that MN has dealt with inept QB play, either defenses sold out to stop Peterson on 2nd and short or the QBs simply made careless decisions. Probably a combination of both.
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UpperDecker30


Joined: 08 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2014 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

vikingsrule wrote:


Perhaps they threw more on 2nd and short than they should have.

This is just a personal preference of mine, but when it is 2nd and short, i'm most always taking a shot down the field. Its a free down if you have an offense that you can trust in third and short situations.

Given that MN has dealt with inept QB play, either defenses sold out to stop Peterson on 2nd and short or the QBs simply made careless decisions. Probably a combination of both.


This is why I can't wait for Teddy to be leading the charge, he has always been fantastic on 3rd down. Let's hope that transfers.
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disaacs


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree. I think it's just that the offense ran so much on 1st down that they were just passing on 2nd and short...and we know how mediocre the passing game was.
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Krauser


Joined: 20 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2014 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.draftbrowns.com/2013/10/browns-film-room-packaged-plays-and-reading-defenders/

^^ Breakdown with images of some of the newfangled ideas Norv worked into Cleveland's offense last year, including read option running plays, packaged plays (run plus pass called on same play), and something from a wildcat formation

Bonus: shows the Vikings defense for half the article and the Bengals for the other half
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Matt Cassel: "Coach Turner is going to coach you hard, but I think those are the things that are going to elevate our players, elevate my game, because there are no small details overlooked. We have the talent here. And we have the potential to be a very good offense. The scheme is going to be in place. It’s up to us to learn it, to start build a rapport with receivers and what we’re trying to accomplish with every play."

http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/262262411.html
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Krauser


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Norv wanted Cassel in Cleveland last year: http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_25911764/vikings-matt-cassel-norv-turner-nearly-joined-forces

Quote:
After Cassel was released by Kansas City in March 2013, then-Cleveland offensive coordinator Norv Turner wanted the Browns to sign him. But Cleveland brass elected instead to go with a cheaper option to compete with starter Brandon Weeden and eventually signed Jason Campbell to a one-year, $1.5 million deal.

...

Cassel opted out of his contract after last season before re-signing in March on a two-year, $10 million deal. One reason he returned was to work under Turner, who became Minnesota's offensive coordinator the year after being unsuccessful in getting Cassel to Cleveland.

"I think that would have been at the time a good move for us,'' Turner said. "I gave my evaluation (for the Browns to sign Cassel). I thought he would have fit. ... Sometimes it works out, and sometimes it doesn't.''

Cassel knew about Turner having interest in him, but it soon became apparent Cleveland officials wanted to go a cheaper route.

"I just remember that there were conversations about the Browns being a possible landing spot for me,'' Cassel said. "Obviously, I've got a tremendous amount of respect for Coach Turner.''


(For those posters who are skeptical of reported information not put in quotation marks, note that this detail -- "One reason [Cassel] returned was to work under Turner" -- is another one of those facts that could only come from a conversation with the source, even though a direct quote is not used. Since Cassel is quoted throughout the article, it's obviously an indirect quotation of something he said, even if it's not word-for-word and attributed to him.)

This story would lend some credit to the idea that Turner would actually see Cassel as a viable starting QB. That's encouraging, because it means that if and when Bridgewater gets the starting job, he'll have earned it.
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Klomp


Joined: 11 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2014 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Krauser wrote:
(For those posters who are skeptical of reported information not put in quotation marks, note that this detail -- "One reason [Cassel] returned was to work under Turner" -- is another one of those facts that could only come from a conversation with the source, even though a direct quote is not used. Since Cassel is quoted throughout the article, it's obviously an indirect quotation of something he said, even if it's not word-for-word and attributed to him.)


Or you could just bring up the fact that he's said in previous interviews that Norv was part of his reason to return. (though I fail to find a link right now)

EDIT: Heres one:

Quote:
“We loved the team and my familiarity with it, and I think the direction that [General Manager] Rick Spielman and the Wilf family have gone with hiring Coach [Mike] Zimmer and now with Coach [Norv] Turner on the offensive side of the ball, I was really excited to be back. I think that we have a lot of potential to do great things this year.”

Cassel said he hasn’t played under Turner but does have some familiarity with him.

“I played against him when I was in Kansas City a lot, and the one thing that I know is that every time we played against him, you had to be ready to score a lot of points, because their teams would always put up a lot of points,” Cassel said. “I’ve always had a great deal of respect for Coach Turner just because he does such a tremendous job of creating mismatches, taking what they give you, and bringing out the best in his players.”

Cassel said that after watching Turner with other teams for so long, he’s excited to work for him.

“There’s no doubt,” Cassel said. “I’m excited to get to work with him. We start April 7th and get going, and that’s one of those things where it will be fun to get started and see where we can go.”


http://www.startribune.com/sports/vikings/251334531.html
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Krauser


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 10, 2014 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://vikingsterritory.com/2014/analysis/2014-minnesota-vikings-draft-profile-jerick-mckinnon-breakdown

Darren Page's analysis of Jerick McKinnon includes a breakdown of Norv Turner's heavy usage of pass-catching RBs:

Quote:
Turner is already inclined to utilize his backs in the passing game quite heavily. Past statistics indicate that. Dating back to 1991, Turner has held three head coaching roles (Redskins, Raiders, Chargers) and four offensive coordinator roles (Cowboys, Chargers, Dolphins, Browns).

11 of his backs posted at least one season with 50 receptions, those being Emmitt Smith (twice), Darryl Johnston, Ricky Ervins, Larry Centers (twice), Ladainian Tomlinson (three times), Ricky Williams, LaMont Jordan, Frank Gore, Darren Sproles, Ryan Mathews, and Mike Tolbert.

The NFL only had 216 backs haul in 50 catches in a season during that time frame. 711 individual teams took the field over that stretch, which means 30% of teams had a back hit that milestone, though a small number would have had multiple backs do it in a season. Counting the doubles separate, 65% of Norv Turner led offenses had a back hit that mark as a pass catcher. Turner had two seasons with two backs that each caught more than fifty passes.

There’s one other telling way to interpret the data. An average of 30.9 teams took the field each year over those 23 seasons. 216 outcomes divided out to those 30.9 teams means each should have 7 outcomes over the time frame. Norv Turner more than doubled that with 15. Simply put, his running backs will catch the football.


With Bridgewater being very good at checking down, Peterson and McKinnon may get a lot of work.

Page also speculates about McKinnon's likely usage in the run game:

Quote:
What kind of carry totals can McKinnon expect in the meantime? Let’s go back to Tomlinson’s prime years under Turner, 2007 and 2008. In 2007, Michael Turner got 4.4 carries per game and Darren Sproles got 2.3 carries per game. Sproles then carried is 3.8 times per game in 2008. Somewhere around four seems like the sweet spot but maybe less initially.
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vike daddy


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kyle Rudolph: "Coach Turner brings so much energy out there to practice every day. The thing I respect most is it doesn't matter if you're the 53rd guy on the roster fighting for a spot to make the team or Adrian, who has been to more Pro Bowls than anybody and one of the best players at his position if not the best player at his position ever. It doesn't matter which guy you are. He's going to coach you up to make you the best player that you can be. Just loves coaching football and you can't ask for more than that as a player."

Greg Jennings: "He's very vocal, that kind of threw me a little bit. But he is so laid back. I mean, one of the things you've got to love about him is he doesn't care who it is, he's going to jump on them and the next play he's going to come up to you and be like, 'Now, let's go, let's get it right."

Matt Cassel: "He creates this intensity and this sense of urgency in practice that I haven't seen throughout my 10 years. Which is great, because what I think it does is, it creates a sense of urgency so on game day you know when things are going 100 miles a minute that you're prepared for that. I think that he's meticulous in his details and he wants to push you during practice because that's the only way you prepare for game day."

Mike Zimmer: "I love it. He's coaching them hard, he's demanding. He's very similar to me in a lot of ways and it's been great. Like there's a reputation on me, I guess there's a reputation on him as well. But it's nothing like what I've anticipated. It's really good."

http://msn.foxsports.com/north/story/loud-and-clear-turner-gets-vikings-players-attention-respect-quickly-061314
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