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With the 64th pick in the 2014 NFl draft, Seattle selects...
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
Tatupu_64 wrote:
imani wrote:
Tatupu_64 wrote:
We didn't draft him to play guard. We drafted a swing tackle because no one on our roster really can play LT


Right, but RT was supposed to be a battle between Bowie and Bailey. Now we have a tackle that can both tackle spots and possibly start down the line. Isn't that a player you take later in the draft? A versatile back-up? Especially when we have twice the need at guard, I don't buy that "our guy was gone" crap from the FO because no guard had been selected before we traded down.

I completely understand the anger in passing on XSF just to end up with a player like Britt.
I don't know when it was ever said Bailey would be competing for RT other than some speculation by us. Bailey as the size of a Guard and that's realistically where we should expect him to compete.


Here's a clip from a breaking down a game in which Bailey played LT, RG and RT. I'm not painting this as anything official, just saying that there's good reason to assume he'll be competing at RT.

http://ehhawkblog.wordpress.com/tag/alvin-bailey/

Quote:
Offensive Line Rotation Experiment Is a Success: When Michael Bowie was struggling through the Rams game two weeks ago I wondered why not substitute Alvin Bailey in at right tackle to try to shake things up. Today the Seahawks did that and then some. The Seahawks debuted a consistently interchanging offensive line lineup in todayís game and it worked very well, especially in the passing game. Russell Wilsonís confidence in the pocket grew as the game went on and the throws that he made were a reflection of that confidence as the Seahawks had 8 plays that went for 20 yards or more. Alvin Bailey saw playing time at left tackle, right guard, and right tackle while James Carpenter also saw time at both guard positions this week
Again, I didn't say I think he can't play RT. I think he's looked decent at RT. But Seattle, you know, the team he plays for Wink has shown very little interest in playing him at RT or LT in the regular season. Even when McQ was getting eaten alive Bailey didn't see any time there.

The only time Bailey as lined up at a tackle position is when he comes in as a unbalanced tackle, basically a blocking TE, in run only situations. My assumption is the team must think he's too short to play tackle consistently in pass pro and they view him as a guard. The reason they like him as an extra tackle is those are purely run situations and he's great as a drive blocker
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imani


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tatupu_64 wrote:
imani wrote:
Tatupu_64 wrote:
imani wrote:
Tatupu_64 wrote:
We didn't draft him to play guard. We drafted a swing tackle because no one on our roster really can play LT


Right, but RT was supposed to be a battle between Bowie and Bailey. Now we have a tackle that can both tackle spots and possibly start down the line. Isn't that a player you take later in the draft? A versatile back-up? Especially when we have twice the need at guard, I don't buy that "our guy was gone" crap from the FO because no guard had been selected before we traded down.

I completely understand the anger in passing on XSF just to end up with a player like Britt.
I don't know when it was ever said Bailey would be competing for RT other than some speculation by us. Bailey as the size of a Guard and that's realistically where we should expect him to compete.


Here's a clip from a breaking down a game in which Bailey played LT, RG and RT. I'm not painting this as anything official, just saying that there's good reason to assume he'll be competing at RT.

http://ehhawkblog.wordpress.com/tag/alvin-bailey/

Quote:
Offensive Line Rotation Experiment Is a Success: When Michael Bowie was struggling through the Rams game two weeks ago I wondered why not substitute Alvin Bailey in at right tackle to try to shake things up. Today the Seahawks did that and then some. The Seahawks debuted a consistently interchanging offensive line lineup in todayís game and it worked very well, especially in the passing game. Russell Wilsonís confidence in the pocket grew as the game went on and the throws that he made were a reflection of that confidence as the Seahawks had 8 plays that went for 20 yards or more. Alvin Bailey saw playing time at left tackle, right guard, and right tackle while James Carpenter also saw time at both guard positions this week
Again, I didn't say I think he can't play RT. I think he's looked decent at RT. But Seattle, you know, the team he plays for Wink has shown very little interest in playing him at RT or LT in the regular season. Even when McQ was getting eaten alive Bailey didn't see any time there.

The only time Bailey as lined up at a tackle position is when he comes in as a unbalanced tackle, basically a blocking TE, in run only situations. My assumption is the team must think he's too short to play tackle consistently in pass pro and they view him as a guard. The reason they like him as an extra tackle is those are purely run situations and he's great as a drive blocker


We'll just have to......wait and see
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I don't believe for one second that Seattle makes it out of their first playoff game.

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Last edited by imani on Sat May 10, 2014 1:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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Bigjoe0075


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watching Missouri vs South Carolina.
-First thing I noticed is Britt can move. He has very agile feet. I also would like to see better body control. He looks off balance at time. Quick kick slide.

-Plays with good pad level and doesn't let Defensive players get into his body. (Plays with leverage)

-Love his nastiness. He pancakes a LB and when the guy attempts to get up he slams the guy back to the ground.

-Stays in front of JClowney all night. He has good not great punch. Is able to stop and knock JClowney off balance regularly.

-This tape has a lot of read option and I'm not sure if it's designed for Britt to get to the 2nd level immediately and he does get on the LBs quickly. I'd like to see him latch on better during his blocks. He seems to fall off a few blocks. This is very coachable.

-For his size I am really shocked how nimble he is.

-Way too many 2 point stances in this game really wish I could see his hand in the dirt more.

For me if he could put together an entire year of game tape this good he would be talked about more. I have no problem taking Justin Britt here. If cable can turn a 7th round DT into a serviceable starter with Sweezy, he might actually have a dominating RT prospect here in Britt.




http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb-8ePTyOnQ
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imani


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bigjoe0075 wrote:


-Stays in front of JClowney all night. He has good not great punch. Is able to stop and knock JClowney off balance regularly.


http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb-8ePTyOnQ


From what I've tried to evaluate so far, he relies on this initial punch a lot as a blocker. He doesn't really hold is block after that, but seems to try to body shield a lot after that. Is that what you meant by saying he doesn't "latch on" much as a blocker?
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I don't believe for one second that Seattle makes it out of their first playoff game.

Russell Wilson Fan since July 2012
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SwiftTexan


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bigjoe0075 wrote:
Watching Missouri vs South Carolina.
-First thing I noticed is Britt can move. He has very agile feet. I also would like to see better body control. He looks off balance at time. Quick kick slide.

-Plays with good pad level and doesn't let Defensive players get into his body. (Plays with leverage)

-Love his nastiness. He pancakes a LB and when the guy attempts to get up he slams the guy back to the ground.

-Stays in front of JClowney all night. He has good not great punch. Is able to stop and knock JClowney off balance regularly.

-This tape has a lot of read option and I'm not sure if it's designed for Britt to get to the 2nd level immediately and he does get on the LBs quickly. I'd like to see him latch on better during his blocks. He seems to fall off a few blocks. This is very coachable.

-For his size I am really shocked how nimble he is.

-Way too many 2 point stances in this game really wish I could see his hand in the dirt more.

For me if he could put together an entire year of game tape this good he would be talked about more. I have no problem taking Justin Britt here. If cable can turn a 7th round DT into a serviceable starter with Sweezy, he might actually have a dominating RT prospect here in Britt.




http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Mb-8ePTyOnQ


That's the impression I got as well. He played a lot in a 2pt but what I really like is that I think he can play either RT or LT. If Okung continues to struggle with injuries at least we have some flexibility in maintaining a competent lineup. I think he could play guard too but it's probably not his best position. He looks a lot stronger on tape than his 23 reps at the combine seem to indicate. I know most people expected him to be a later round guy but honestly I'm just happy we addressed the O-Line early. If the FO says this guy is a 2nd Round talent then I believe them.
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imani


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 1:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One positive I can take from this pick, is Britt definitely has plenty of experience being a blocker in an offense where things break down with a lot of broken plays. Having to block for a QB scrambling around in the backfield won't be new to him at all.
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I don't believe for one second that Seattle makes it out of their first playoff game.

Russell Wilson Fan since July 2012
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've watched Georgia and South Carolina tape

General:
++So quick off the snap sometimes and looks natural moving in space at the second level
+Generally has good knee bend and doesn't rely too much on bending at the waist to get low
+/- Good effort but will quit on a block when he thinks the play is over. Its good that its not an effort thing, but I don't know how he hasn't got chewed out about it. Cable will light a fire under his butt when he quits on a Lynch run and he'll figure it out
+ Short term memory
- Needs to work on his strength. For 325 he doesn't show a lot of great upper body strength in the bench. It would be nice if he had that pop in pass pro. An NFL strength program will do great things for him in terms of putting on some more muscle and drop a little extra fat he doesn't need to carry
+/- Doesn't play out of a 3 point stance. On the flip side, a 3 point stance could help him with his pad level in pass pro
+Disciplined enough to not jump when the defender encroaches (Clowney at that)

Pass Blocking:
- - Sits back too much when he's in pass blocking generally. You generally WANT this from a tackle in pass pro, but he leans too far back and it causes him to let guys get into his chest and get knocked off balance
-Opens the door too much on his kickstep (after watching So Car too this really looks like it might be how he was taught..). When a guy really tries to loop he occasionally tries to punch before dropping into that kickstep
+When he puts himself in position he looks very good in pass pro. Does a good job of being patient with the defender and letting the defender come to him
- - Can be a little slow to recognize when to switch as a defender. In general needs to get better at recognizing his responsibility. Hopefully Unger can help with that
-Forgets to keep his feet going in slide protection sometimes. He sets himself up well often against Clowney but lets his feet go slow and it leaves him in a position of having to try to wash Clowney out of the play
+Looks athletic enough to actually handle a speed rusher, it's more of a technique issue
+Played surprisingly well against Clowney. It speaks volumes to his potential as a pass blocker when he keeps his feet live and doesn't sit too far back.

Run Blocking:
+ Great initial pop
++/- Gets excellent drive when he keeps his feet going, but sometimes relies too much on his initial pop. Drove Clowney 8 yards down the field on an inside run
+ Generally dictates where the defender goes rather than letting the defender dictate him
+ Gets his head on the correct side of the defender and does a good job at sealing off the defender
++ Looks natural double teaming as a zone blocker. To build off of that, he's really good at the second level. So quick of the snap and has the punch to knock down LBs and Safeties
+/- good cut blocker. This is a solid + if it's situations where he's asked to do it and a +/- if he's doing it out of desperation. I lean towards a straight +
+Walls off defenders well
-Can lunge at the 2nd level to try and get a guy down when he needs to be a little choppier and work up to the player

Assessment:
-He's a better athlete than I was expecting. Really quick off the snap and does such a great job getting to the 2nd level and looks good in the screen game too. As a pass blocker there's alot that needs to be refined in his game. The one thing I see over and over is that he sits too far back and it can cause him to get knocked off balance with a strong bull rush. He opens the door a little bit on his kickstep. He has his good moments in pass pro where everything comes together and you see good potential. Luckily, these are aspects that should be coachable.
-As a run blocker there's a lot to like. He gets great drive and seals blocks well. He's a natural as a zone blocker whether doubling, working to the backer, or cutting the backside defender. Has a natural feel for setting up the end on a draw. Gets too excited to pancake LBs and will sometimes lunge and almost dive. Shows a short term memory and doesn't seem to be affected by past plays. Needs to work on working the defender till the whistle in the run game

Bottom Line:
Mid to Late 5th rounder as a LT
Mid 3rd round prospect as a RT who can play LT in an emergency

We over-drafted him, but not by all that much in my opinion. It's easy for me right now to look at this with optimism because I want him to be good, but I admire them for going after him. He's obviously a guy Cable believes he can coach up. He's a better athlete than Breno and a better fit in the ZBS. IF Cable can work with him on keeping his feet going and finding his balance in pass pro I am warming up to the selection.

Whatever scout question his foot speed is an idiot.
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I'll put the 2013 Seahawks one spot over the 2008 Steelers on the Top 10
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Bigjoe0075


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 2:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very good assessment. I agree with most of that. Except what do you mean when you say open the door on a kick slide? Is it allowing the defender to have the edge and run him out at the hips? That's what we call it.

I didn't think he was all that bad in pass pro. A few times he looked off balance against a very powerful Jadaveon. But had a recovers very nicely.

I don't think he's the cleanest prospect. He is going to need work but he has the right attitude and is athletic enough to GROW into a dominant role.
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 3:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bigjoe0075 wrote:
Very good assessment. I agree with most of that. Except what do you mean when you say open the door on a kick slide? Is it allowing the defender to have the edge and run him out at the hips? That's what we call it.

I didn't think he was all that bad in pass pro. A few times he looked off balance against a very powerful Jadaveon. But had a recovers very nicely.

I don't think he's the cleanest prospect. He is going to need work but he has the right attitude and is athletic enough to GROW into a dominant role.
i know what a kickstep is. I played LT and coach OL. I understand the technique you're describing but he truly takes a 90 degree angle sometimes. There's a lone between forcing the player one direction and just giving him a free pass and relying on your athleticism to get you back into the play. He more than floret with it sometimes. He actually looked better in pass pro against clowney them he did against Georgia. The Geprgia player had a solid bull rush and it caught Britt off balance sometimes
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I'll put the 2013 Seahawks one spot over the 2008 Steelers on the Top 10
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Bigjoe0075


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bottom line is I think they wanted Jack Mewhort OT OSU at #64. But Indy took him 6 spots ahead of us.

This is what Cable said in his interview.



Quote:
Cable was targeting two linemen with the last pick in the second round. One went earlier, but Britt was there.
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animaltested


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds like the FO and Cable fell in love with him and his skill set. Going out on a limb here, but I'd venture a guess during the evaluation process they figured out a couple of teams would target this kid in the 3rd or early forth. So they took him a little early because they lack a third, and want more middle round flexibility (not wanting to trade up) My Guess.
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imani


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

animaltested wrote:
Sounds like the FO and Cable fell in love with him and his skill set. Going out on a limb here, but I'd venture a guess during the evaluation process they figured out a couple of teams would target this kid in the 3rd or early forth. So they took him a little early because they lack a third, and want more middle round flexibility (not wanting to trade up) My Guess.


I don't know. They could have just traded down again.

That's another issue for me, did they really think he wouldn't be there a mere 10-15 picks later?
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I don't believe for one second that Seattle makes it out of their first playoff game.

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Tooki


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

animaltested wrote:
Sounds like the FO and Cable fell in love with him and his skill set. Going out on a limb here, but I'd venture a guess during the evaluation process they figured out a couple of teams would target this kid in the 3rd or early forth. So they took him a little early because they lack a third, and want more middle round flexibility (not wanting to trade up) My Guess.


I listened to the Day 2 Press Conference and John said that he was partly selected there because he predicted a run-off on lineman that would result in a big drop in talent by the teams' next pick. (Which actually ended up happening)

Another factor that played into his selection was that he's quite grounded (He's married with a child and is currently studying for a Masters degree). That's probably in reaction to John Moffitt who was the complete opposite.
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Tatupu_64


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
animaltested wrote:
Sounds like the FO and Cable fell in love with him and his skill set. Going out on a limb here, but I'd venture a guess during the evaluation process they figured out a couple of teams would target this kid in the 3rd or early forth. So they took him a little early because they lack a third, and want more middle round flexibility (not wanting to trade up) My Guess.


I don't know. They could have just traded down again.

That's another issue for me, did they really think he wouldn't be there a mere 10-15 picks later?
He might have been, but conditional picks are scary. Teams can't trade them so if they like a guy they just have to grab him.

If they really loved Britt but could only get a 7th to move back 10 spots maybe they decided it wasn't worth the risk
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Bigjoe0075


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PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

imani wrote:
animaltested wrote:
Sounds like the FO and Cable fell in love with him and his skill set. Going out on a limb here, but I'd venture a guess during the evaluation process they figured out a couple of teams would target this kid in the 3rd or early forth. So they took him a little early because they lack a third, and want more middle round flexibility (not wanting to trade up) My Guess.


I don't know. They could have just traded down again.

That's another issue for me, did they really think he wouldn't be there a mere 10-15 picks later?


I think we saw Easly come off right before our pick at #32, then XSF, Bitinio go right in front of them at #40. Cyrus kouandjio 1 pick in front of them at #45. And mewhort 6 picks before they picked at #64! I honestly doubt Britt was in their top 5 OTs but they picked for need not best player available.

Also did anyone notice late round OG and OT prospects being picked up quickly last night. Linder, Schofeild, spencer long, Chris Watt? All of these guys were considered to be reaches by the draft "experts" all of them are 4th round grades or later but picked in the 3rd.

If this guy ends up being a solid starter or even pro bowler all you guys are. Going to be eating crow. It will be a crow Buffett.
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