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With the 17th Pick, the Ravens select... CJ Mosley
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Do you guys think Ozzie is just lying to you when he says best player available.

I just wish we could have traded down. I wonder exactly how high ranked Mosley was on the board.

That said, I thought Fuller would be on the board... and I was confident he would be the pick if available. But he wasn't. I had him ranked higher than most though.

I think this pick means we should switch our base defense to a 43 look. I'd rather get Mosley/Smith/Brown all on the field than to have Canty on the field as a starter on the line. Ngata and Williams are both big and strong enough to keep blockers off of our LBers and let them work.

I think no question we're now a much better fit at 43 than at 34.
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sp6488


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diamondbull424 wrote:
DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Do you guys think Ozzie is just lying to you when he says best player available.

I just wish we could have traded down. I wonder exactly how high ranked Mosley was on the board.

That said, I thought Fuller would be on the board... and I was confident he would be the pick if available. But he wasn't. I had him ranked higher than most though.

I think this pick means we should switch our base defense to a 43 look. I'd rather get Mosley/Smith/Brown all on the field than to have Canty on the field as a starter on the line. Ngata and Williams are both big and strong enough to keep blockers off of our LBers and let them work.

I think no question we're now a much better fit at 43 than at 34.


Or it gives us flexibility to do both... Hybrid baby
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DB, I was just thinking about us making a switch to the 4-3 defense. I mean, think about this:

---- Brown --- Smith--- Upshaw/Mosley
Suggs ---- Canty ----- Ngata ---- McPhee/Dumervil

That would be a pretty awesome 4-3 front. You've got 3 athletic linebackers playing behind a defensive line that would thrive on 1v1 matchups and can also eat blockers.

I think that suits us much better than a 3-4, IMO.
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sp6488 wrote:
diamondbull424 wrote:
DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Do you guys think Ozzie is just lying to you when he says best player available.

I just wish we could have traded down. I wonder exactly how high ranked Mosley was on the board.

That said, I thought Fuller would be on the board... and I was confident he would be the pick if available. But he wasn't. I had him ranked higher than most though.

I think this pick means we should switch our base defense to a 43 look. I'd rather get Mosley/Smith/Brown all on the field than to have Canty on the field as a starter on the line. Ngata and Williams are both big and strong enough to keep blockers off of our LBers and let them work.

I think no question we're now a much better fit at 43 than at 34.


Or it gives us flexibility to do both... Hybrid baby

Yeah, we're always going to be a hybrid defense and run some 34 looks... but I'm talking about our base defense.

I think no question it makes more sense to get Brown/Mosley both on the field vs getting Chris Canty/Brandon Williams both on the field. My reservation against taking Mosley was that he wouldn't touch the field as a starter (or Brown wouldn't) in a 34 defense... and it would waste two high value picks. And we just signed Smith to a four year deal as well and so it wouldn't have made sense to take Mosley considering we're a 34 base defense... however, moving to a 43 based hybrid scheme would be a compromise to keep all those LB pieces usable and worth their value and on the field.

You consider also that Chris Canty only has one more year left on his deal and that our DL depth was thinned out a little with the loss of Arthur Jones and it's never been a better time for us to transition to a different base defense.

You figure that guys like Ozzie Newsome and Bill Belichick are always trying to stay a step ahead of the opposition. And you consider that both teams transitioned to a 34 back when most teams were running the 43 because it was easier to find 34 OLB for your pass rushing scheme and be successful than it was to find 43 DE talents... now you look at the NFL and most teams sort of becoming more 34 base oriented in their hybrid schemes and now you see Belichick switching to a 43 and now perhaps the Ravens could see this as a prime opportunity to switch strategies as more and more 43 DL talents likely become available and fall down draft boards, making it easier to have usable talent fall to you at a later pick.

Thus switching to a 43 base CREATES value for our team down the road. But I don't know. This is just me trying to best rationalize this Mosley selection and what it could mean and how I think it best fits us.

You also look at the fact that our secondary coach and Assistant HC has been a big time user of the 43 in the past... and it makes even more sense. I think that's probably the thinking from the team.
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dcfields


Joined: 28 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was not happy when Dallas took Martin. Then I was confident Clinton-Dix would be the pick. That said, I have to agree with something DBull said not long ago, "It always seems like Clinton-Dix arrives a millisecond too late" (paraphrasing).

I had Mosley rated #14 overall so there's definitely value in the pick. Unfortunately, it doesn't fill an immediate need. That fine though.

This is one of those "In Ozzie We Trust" pick. The last two times I felt this way about a Ravens 1st round pick the players were Ben Grubbs and Ed Reed. So...
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sp6488


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sp6488 wrote:
mddeckie wrote:
In Ozzie we trust. I like the pick knowing all the safeties were still on the board. Tells me he was high on the ravens board and we went bpa


I would have liked one of the safeties. Martin would have been awesome if he lasted.

2nd round hopes:
Hoping one of the FS prospects falls
Jordan Matthews
Hageman (dt Minnesota, on my phone)


If add biotino (sp?) to that list as well.

Benjamin to Carolina, interesting.
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Bucketheadsdad


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was really hoping he was going to end up in Cleveland (and not just once a year)....

I think he's going to be a stud for you guys.
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dcfields


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mosley was far from the flashiest Crimson Tide player during his four-year career, but he was as close to irreplaceable as anyone on the roster. A consensus first-team All-America in 2012 and then both the SEC Defensive Player of the Year and - Butkus Award winner in 2013, Mosley totaled more than 300 tackles at Alabama — 215 coming over his junior and senior seasons.

His career numbers may have been even more striking had he not battled so many injuries. Mosley missed two games in 2011 with an elbow injury, sat out the ’12 BCS championship after dislocating his hip, and needed surgery prior to the combine to fix a labrum issue. Because of that last setback, Mosley skipped the 40-yard dash and the bench press at the combine, adding to the concerns about his ability to withstand the rigors of an NFL schedule.

At Alabama’s pro day last month, Mosley told NFL.com the worries were all for nothing.

“Everything went well. Before the combine even happened, in January, I got MRIs on everything I hurt in the past all the way to my freshman year,” he said. “Everything was good then. [There] were [not] red flags thrown up or anything they had questions on, I got an MRI or X-Ray on, so it turned out well.”

A healthy Mosley is considered far and away the top inside linebacker in this draft, though he excelled playing on the weakside for Alabama’s 3-4 attack. He likely will be ticketed for an ILB or MLB slot in the NFL, depending on the defensive scheme. As he showed Saban, he’ll produce no matter what he is asked to do.

http://nfl.si.com/2014/04/23/2014-nfl-draft-top-64-cj-mosley/
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Do you guys think Ozzie is just lying to you when he says best player available.


What came to my mind was how Ozzie immediately said inside linebacker when asked what they needed in that interview on Baltimore's website a couple of days ago.

Man, I don't like this pick too much. As a player I'm fine with Mosley and I actually think he's really good, but I don't think it actually makes the team significantly better. He might start right away over Arthur Brown but I don't think Mosley is that much better or brings a whole lot more to the table. A future tandem of Mosley and Brown is nice and I'm not all that worried about having two WILL linebacker types since that what was going to happen with Smith and brown anyways but I really hope they can address their bigger needs with the rest of the draft.
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dcfields


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2014 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bottom Line: Smart, instinctive, fast-flowing, every-down linebacker capable of manning any position in a "40" front or steering a defense from the weak side in a "30" front, where he starred for a national-championship defense as a junior and carried the Tide as a senior. Has the football temperament, desire and work habits to emerge as a tackling machine in the pros. Has Pro Bowl potential.

- Nolan Nawrocki
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dcfields


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

An underrated impact player perhaps because inside linebackers are thought to be devalued in today's NFL, although they are keys to three of the best defenses in the league -- Seattle, San Francisco and Carolina. Mosley is a must-draft, mobile mass of natural football genius who has no negatives and works full speed, full time. He is even a blocker on punts, covers kicks and if you want more, just ask.

- Frank Cooney, NFLDraftScout.com

He was an extension of Nick Saban on the football field at Alabama with his unwavering intensity and overall instincts and intelligence to know what the offense wanted to do before the ball was snapped. Mosley is outstanding in pass coverage, and he has the versatile skill set to play inside or outside.

- Dane Brugler, NFLDraftScout.com
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diamondbull424


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
DontTazeMeBro wrote:
Do you guys think Ozzie is just lying to you when he says best player available.


What came to my mind was how Ozzie immediately said inside linebacker when asked what they needed in that interview on Baltimore's website a couple of days ago.

Man, I don't like this pick too much. As a player I'm fine with Mosley and I actually think he's really good, but I don't think it actually makes the team significantly better. He might start right away over Arthur Brown but I don't think Mosley is that much better or brings a whole lot more to the table. A future tandem of Mosley and Brown is nice and I'm not all that worried about having two WILL linebacker types since that what was going to happen with Smith and brown anyways but I really hope they can address their bigger needs with the rest of the draft.

Yeah, this was my thought of the pick initially as well... but under the assumption that we move to a base 43 scheme... I think it's definitely a fit defensively.

I've been thinking about this pick and the potential scheme change a lot and what I see is that Mosley, Brown, and Smith are all possessed of the ability to cover RBs and TEs in space. They're all good coverage linebackers. Brown is also very good at blitzing up the middle like Darly Washington. So you've got a trio of LBers that can be used in coverage to counter the big TEs you see coming into the league.

So now we can use our safeties to play more of a cover two concept or to assist in the box. So as opposed to using a Matt Elam to cover a Jordan Cameron in coverage, we can have Mosley/Brown/Smith cover him and have Elam covering slot WRs, putting an extra body in the box, or playing cover two.

So under a 43 defense with such talented cover LBers, it should mean size at our FS position is less of a need. That guy won't have to be asked to cover your TE that often and thus can specialize in another area of coverage. This makes a playmaking safety option like Lamarcus Joyner a great fit for such a defense. We could best utilize his all around safety ability. I shied away from him before because of his similarities to Elam, but now... he'd make a lot of sense for a revised defensive structure. Means our base defense has the potential to use both Elam and Joyner as nickel defenders (if needed) without compromising our coverage... meaning less need for substitutions/weakness against no-huddle teams.

The more I think about it, the more I convince myself that I like the Mosley pick. It's a different strategy than I would've taken, but assuming we switch schemes I like the pick... if we remain a base 34 defense... than I'm not a fan of the pick.
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coordinator0


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just wrote this elsewhere:

Quote:
If they do decide to go to a 4-3 base I think they would be fine with Ngata and Williams inside because Dean Pees will still probably be using his 2-gap principles. Canty and Tyson rotating in with the possibility of Lewis-Moore eventually taking over Canty's spot in the rotation. With Suggs, Dumervil, McPhee, and maybe Upshaw and Simon (they would probably be defensive ends just as much as strong side linebackers) it's definitely something that's feasible just by looking at the roster. We're talking about Dean Pees though and the whole team seems to want to stick to their 3-4/hybrid scheme anyways.


If they move to a 4-3 I'd like it and the Mosley pick a lot more. It's probably not going to happen though.
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SnA ExclusiVe


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 1:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coordinator0 wrote:
I just wrote this elsewhere:

Quote:
If they do decide to go to a 4-3 base I think they would be fine with Ngata and Williams inside because Dean Pees will still probably be using his 2-gap principles. Canty and Tyson rotating in with the possibility of Lewis-Moore eventually taking over Canty's spot in the rotation. With Suggs, Dumervil, McPhee, and maybe Upshaw and Simon (they would probably be defensive ends just as much as strong side linebackers) it's definitely something that's feasible just by looking at the roster. We're talking about Dean Pees though and the whole team seems to want to stick to their 3-4/hybrid scheme anyways.


If they move to a 4-3 I'd like it and the Mosley pick a lot more. It's probably not going to happen though.


I'm in that same boat as well.

It's funny, last year I was asking for some athleticism at ILB. We now have that with Mosley and Brown it's just a matter of getting them to a scheme that maximizes their ability to flow and be athletic, and I feel that a 4-3 scheme would best allow that, especially considering the players we have in front of them (Upshaw, Suggs, Ngata, Williams, Canty, McPhee).
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I'd say he's [Dennis Pitta] the fourth best TE in the division... Cameron > Miller > Gresham > Eiffert = Pitta
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gooselovechild


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 1:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was opposed to the pick initially, but then I started thinking about it, especially in comparison to what other teams are doing and some of the comments being made by the analysts, and I may have changed somewhat.

When one of your starters at a position is aging, even if he's still productive, and you get the opportunity to add the best player at that position in the draft, it has value. If we had drafted the best edge rusher available to rotate with Suggs/Dumervil, it would have been hailed as a great selection with future value, so I don't see much of a difference here. If you're strong up the middle, you can be just as dominant as if you have good edge rushers. Mosley, along with Elam, Brown, and Williams from last year's draft, is a pretty good middle of the defense for the long term, and adding a FS will be the final piece to that puzzle.

The other thing is, neither Mosley nor Brown have to be the guy who replaces the legend now either. When Smith either retires or is cut, there isn't the same pressure from that transition as there would have been in replacing Lewis. Neither guy is ever going to be Ray Lewis, and now the pressure of expectations to be the immediate successor has been eliminated while still giving them a solid veteran to watch to pick up the nuances of the pro game. I think we all may be overlooking that factor to some degree.

And Brown was drafted as an OLB, so there's flexibility to get him on the field with Mosley this year in certain packages. He may be better suited as an ILB, but he has a history playing outside, so he has scheme diversity.

Therefore, after some reflection, and even though it may not be my ideal selection, I'm having a hard time calling it a wasted pick. I think it was more a reflection of how important Ozzie views the position to be, and how he weighed Mosley as a talent against what is currently on the roster and what would likely be available in the next few years in the draft.
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