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Watkins better than Evans: What am I Missing?
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Mayhem50


Joined: 28 Apr 2009
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Location: Beverly Hills, Mi.
PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 5:47 pm    Post subject: Watkins better than Evans: What am I Missing? Reply with quote

Going to stir the pot a little. Sat up last night watching quite a few Highlight reels of both receivers. Yes, Watkins numbers are better, but Evans looks to be the player who will come in and produce for any team. A lot of Watkins catches, he was wide open with no one around against sub par teams. Evans on the other hand, showed great hands and the ability to go get balls which I don't think Watkins could have gotten. Evans seemed to keep a lot of drives going with circus catches with 2 to 3 guys hanging all over him. In my opinion, if the Lions were to go after a reciever in the first round, pick Evans and get someone who can contribute right away.
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detfan782004


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly don't think Watkins better compared to Jordan Mattews either. If better it is minimal at best
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Mayhem50


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed. I think there's to much hype on Watkins. Lions would be foolish to trade up for this guy. Other options later in the draft. I know it won't happen, but if Watkins & Evans dropped to #10, I would take Evans.
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RIP CITY


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Williams, WR, USC -

6'4'' - 229 Pounds

4.56 40 Time - 37 Inch Vertical Leap

2002 - 81 Receptions, 1265 Yards, 14 TD's
2003 - 95 Receptions, 1314 Yards, 16 TD's

Selected #10 by the Detroit Lions in the 2005 NFL Draft.

Mike Evans, WR, Texas A&M -

6'5" - 231 Pounds

4.53 40 Time - 37 Inch Vertical Leap

2012 - 82 Receptions, 1105 Yards, 5 TD's
2013 - 69 Receptions, 1394 Yards 12 TD's

The Detroit Lions hold the #10 Pick in the 2014 NFL Draft.

Even I like Mike Evans more than Mike Williams and I don't think Evans will be a bust but I just thought this was interesting. I'm sure 4-5 guys will come in with their hemorrhoids all flared up and try to tear this apart but I'm just going to leave this here for the lulz.

Sammy Watkins is just flat out better. He's a better, more fluid athlete (MUCH better change of direction/cutting ability/lateral quickness), he's much better at getting separation from CB's, his hands are just as good, he's a much, much better route runner, he's capable of going up to high point the ball (though admittedly not as well as Evans). Honestly Evans' only real advantage is that he's just much bigger than Watkins and any defender he matches up against. That's the one thing about him that actually translates well to the NFL, his size. His speed and leaping ability are matched or exceeded by plenty of CB's in the NFL. His route running is subpar so NFL CB's won't have nearly as much trouble as the College CB's he faced, most of which won't be in the NFL or will be backups in the NFL.

Quote:
A lot of Watkins catches, he was wide open with no one around against sub par teams.


Alot of Evans' catches are on broken plays that Manziel kept alive with his scrambling ability. Some say this is because Manziel can't read defenses and work in the pocket and that is definitely true to an extent but you can also watch on those same plays that Evans couldn't get open until Manziel started moving around, Evans then breaks off his route and comes back for the ball. That's not a bad thing, except for when it happens all the time because Evans can't get separation consistently without Manziel breaking the pocket. Evans has one move on his deep route that College CB's consistently fell for, it's basically a hesitation step then full sprint to the end zone. NFL CB's will watch the tape and snuff that out before the 1st Regular season game and he won't be able to outrun many CB's in the NFL like he did in College. He runs like 4 routes, none of them all that well and he'll be facing much, much better competition on every play than he ever did in College.

I think Mike Evans will be effective in the NFL almost solely because of his size, nothing about his skill set or athleticism is something that NFL CB's haven't already seen. He's a mismatch because of his size and will continue to live off of that in the NFL. If he's put in the right situations, a scheme that fits his play style he will be pretty effective but I don't see him becoming a superstar WR in the NFL. If he's just thrown onto a team that doesn't fit, or tries to make him do too much, he's going to struggle alot because he's simply not overly skilled or polished or electric athletically.
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wilson2k3


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You left out one major bit of information -

Mike Williams, WR, USC -

6'4'' - 229 Pounds

4.56 40 Time - 37 Inch Vertical Leap

2002 - 81 Receptions, 1265 Yards, 14 TD's
2003 - 95 Receptions, 1314 Yards, 16 TD's
2004 - 00 Receptions, 0000 Yards, 00 TD's DID NOT PLAY

Selected #10 by the Detroit Lions in the 2005 NFL Draft.

Mike Evans, WR, Texas A&M -

6'5" - 231 Pounds

4.53 40 Time - 37 Inch Vertical Leap

2012 - 82 Receptions, 1105 Yards, 5 TD's
2013 - 69 Receptions, 1394 Yards 12 TD's

The Detroit Lions hold the #10 Pick in the 2014 NFL Draft.


Mike Williams IMO was a bust for 2 reasons, one being he didn't play in 2004, and two being he seemed like a guy in it for the money because he thought he was better then everyone else and wanted to challenge the system so he could get his payday in the NFL for the 2004 draft which he didn't get, thus sat out all of 2004 until drafted in 2005. He might of looked like the best guy in 2004 had he made that draft, but I doubt any team takes him in the first round in 2005, let alone the 2nd round. But the Lions took him, and ended up being one of the worst picks.

For the OP, I too like Evans over Watkins, to me Evens has a chance to be the next Megatron (no most likely not that good, but CJ like) or at least someone like Jeffery for the Bears, hes just that kind of go up and get it kind of player. Where as Watkins to me, might have a good career, but seems like a slot guy at best. Kind of like what Titus Young was.
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1King


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh man. This thread. Full of lulz.

I actually agree with you this time RIP CITY. You already covered pretty much all that needs to be said:

Quote:
Sammy Watkins is just flat out better. He's a better, more fluid athlete (MUCH better change of direction/cutting ability/lateral quickness), he's much better at getting separation from CB's, his hands are just as good, he's a much, much better route runner, he's capable of going up to high point the ball (though admittedly not as well as Evans). Honestly Evans' only real advantage is that he's just much bigger than Watkins and any defender he matches up against.


Watkins also has the added advantage of having return ability.
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RIP CITY


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

wilson2k3 wrote:
You left out one major bit of information -


The major bit of information I left out is that we know through hindsight that Mike Williams was a lazy player with little to no work ethic. We don't know what kind of work ethic Evans has, it's probably much better which is why I again will mention that I don't think Evans will be a bust. I also don't think he's a Top 10 talent in this Draft and don't think he will be a superstar on the NFL level. We've seen guys with his ability and size flop in the NFL, my point was that he's not as unique as people make him out to be and he's certainly not a sure fire star. He has alot of flaws in his game, I don't see why he's so highly regarded.
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nagahide13


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Watkins really has no apparent weaknesses... He's at least 'good' in all facets of the game...

Williams is a good amount bigger and taller than Watkins, but that's really his only clear advantage. He's a better red-zone target. Other than that, they have comparable speed and quickness. Watkins has better awareness, runs better routes, points the ball better, has more consistent hands, has far more ability with the ball after the catch, more versatility, etc etc etc.

That being said, I'm a fan of Williams. I think he'll be successful and I'd be happy if we took him at 10... assuming Watkins is gone, of course. I just see Watkins as a better receiver in almost every way. Laughing
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RIP CITY


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1King wrote:


I actually agree with you this time RIP CITY.


It appears there truly is a first time for everything, lol.
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Montana badboy


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Watkins better than Evans: What am I Missing? Reply with quote

Mayhem50 wrote:
Going to stir the pot a little. Sat up last night watching quite a few Highlight reels of both receivers. Yes, Watkins numbers are better, but Evans looks to be the player who will come in and produce for any team. A lot of Watkins catches, he was wide open with no one around against sub par teams. Evans on the other hand, showed great hands and the ability to go get balls which I don't think Watkins could have gotten. Evans seemed to keep a lot of drives going with circus catches with 2 to 3 guys hanging all over him. In my opinion, if the Lions were to go after a reciever in the first round, pick Evans and get someone who can contribute right away.


Part of the thing I like about Watkins is his ability to get open and create separation, now I haven't watched a ton of tape on him, and really highlight film is not a very good indication of talent, you really can't see much of anything except following the ball, but the biggest problem our receivers have right now is their inability to create separation, making Stafford try to force the ball into tight windows. To me, a receiver like Watkins is exactly what we need to compliment CJ.
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Nnivolcm


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nagahide13 wrote:
Watkins really has no apparent weaknesses... He's at least 'good' in all facets of the game...

Williams is a good amount bigger and taller than Watkins, but that's really his only clear advantage. He's a better red-zone target. Other than that, they have comparable speed and quickness. Watkins has better awareness, runs better routes, points the ball better, has more consistent hands, has far more ability with the ball after the catch, more versatility, etc etc etc.

That being said, I'm a fan of Williams. I think he'll be successful and I'd be happy if we took him at 10... assuming Watkins is gone, of course. I just see Watkins as a better receiver in almost every way. Laughing


I assume you mean Evans instead of Williams, but if not ignore my next point.

How did you come to the conclusion that Watkins has more consistent hands? Evans had the better drop rate.
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nagahide13


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nnivolcm wrote:
I assume you mean Evans instead of Williams, but if not ignore my next point.

How did you come to the conclusion that Watkins has more consistent hands? Evans had the better drop rate.


Yeah, I totally did. Embarassed I must have been caught up by the comparison to Mike Williams above.

As for the drop rate issue... That's not a particularly helpful stat here... Watkins was targeted a ton more than Evans, they played in different offenses, Evans' stats are inflated due to offensive scheme and QB, (tons of yards off broken plays), Watkins plays in traffic far more, etc.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would prefer they pass on the big names and target Donte Moncrief.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
I would prefer they pass on the big names and target Donte Moncrief.

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when would you want Moncrief? He's a nice athlete, but pretty meh on the field. Maybe with a better QB he could improve, but he's nothing too special IMO. In the 4th? Sure. In the 3rd? Wouldn't be awful. In the 2nd? Nah.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDOG_det wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
I would prefer they pass on the big names and target Donte Moncrief.

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when would you want Moncrief? He's a nice athlete, but pretty meh on the field. Maybe with a better QB he could improve, but he's nothing too special IMO. In the 4th? Sure. In the 3rd? Wouldn't be awful. In the 2nd? Nah.


He's a nice athlete that's still improving. He played in a good conference and put up nice numbers.

He's a willing blocker that can improve in that category. Like most receivers he can improve his route running. If I have a concern it's him catching the ball in his gut to often.

I think the 3rd is where he will go and in my opinion it makes much more sense than spending the draft to move up for Watkins, or taking Evans who has a bunch of work to do as well.
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