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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
Posts: 39796
PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoCalNiner wrote:


Back to Garrapolo....


I agree with this much, and am happy to leave this alone... but your recent post including this

SoCalNiner wrote:
You clearly don't like the guy
You keep seeing what you want to see


was to THE biggest supporter of our current QB on this SF forum. Just reminding you of that, if you had forgotten.
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49ers Finest


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The difference between the two is pretty obvious to me. It's not blaming one and not the other.

It's true that Alex didn't win us the game. But he didn't lose it either.
Kap lost us the game. He have the defense the ball 3 times in the most important quarter. And two times in scoring position if I remember right.

That's the difference for me. Oh and Alex signed for 9 after a good season knowing that the team made him better. Kap askin for double... Another difference for me
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Miami49er


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex was just as raw coming out of college and it took him YEARS to get pocket presense, good foot work and read defenses. yet Kap doesn't get that leeway even though he was LARGELY the reason we got to the Superbowl his first year. Kap has only started less than 2 years and some of you talk like he'll never get better. but we all the reason for that.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miami49er wrote:
Alex was just as raw coming out of college and it took him YEARS to get pocket presense, good foot work and read defenses. yet Kap doesn't get that leeway even though he was LARGELY the reason we got to the Superbowl his first year. Kap has only started less than 2 years and some of you talk like he'll never get better. but we all the reason for that.


Think of the comparisons in coaching from 2005-2011... and team talent to a lesser extent. C'mon now...

I think we all like Kaep's chances of getting better... but here's the thing... (1) we have the leverage to wait and see if he gets better before paying him huge, guaranteed money... and (2) this thread should not be about our QBs.. especially the other guy.

Back to GAROPPOLO.... the kid looks like an intriguing prospect, and why not add more quality talent at the QB position? Everyone shouts that QB is THE most important position... but then in a draft when we have lots of extra top shelf picks.. they balk at selecting a cheap and talented QB in rd 2? why?
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49ers Finest


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jim said his release is fast. but sometimes too fast because he doesnt complete the motion

edit: heres the quote "Jim Harbaugh told me on Jimmy Garoppolo: "Quick release, yes, but sometimes too quick. You want to see him go through whole motion." #49ers"
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SoCalNiner


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 06, 2014 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

49ers Finest wrote:
jim said his release is fast. but sometimes too fast because he doesnt complete the motion

edit: heres the quote "Jim Harbaugh told me on Jimmy Garoppolo: "Quick release, yes, but sometimes too quick. You want to see him go through whole motion." #49ers"


Is that why he's getting a lot of Romo comparisons too? Aside from the school.
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Forge


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A year and a half later, and quarterback discussions can still devolve into Alex "haters" and Alex "lovers" Laughing . Such an amazingly polarizing player.

Anyway, I get the love for Jimmy G, and if he's available I don't mind us taking him. He's my 4th rated quarterback right now (below Bridgewater, Carr and Bortles, ahead of Manziel), but he is raw. He has a lot of the same concerns (ironically) that Alex and Kaep both had coming out. He's going to have to work on taking balls from under center, his footwork in 3 and 5 step drops, and of course, going through multiple progressions. I like the upside though. I think we are going to be really active in re-signing and signing guys ahead of the draft, so I think our first round pick could be a very fascinating selection. If we re-sign everyone or sign comparable pieces as the people we lose, it could truly be a BPA pick regardless of position. This is going to be fun.
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Chrissooner49er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

49ers Finest wrote:
The difference between the two is pretty obvious to me. It's not blaming one and not the other.

It's true that Alex didn't win us the game. But he didn't lose it either.
Kap lost us the game. He have the defense the ball 3 times in the most important quarter. And two times in scoring position if I remember right.

That's the difference for me. Oh and Alex signed for 9 after a good season knowing that the team made him better. Kap askin for double... Another difference for me


Shocked Really?! I must have missed something... That is amazingly unselfish if it is true. The essence of sportsmanship and team-player there.
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Forge


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chrissooner49er wrote:
49ers Finest wrote:
The difference between the two is pretty obvious to me. It's not blaming one and not the other.

It's true that Alex didn't win us the game. But he didn't lose it either.
Kap lost us the game. He have the defense the ball 3 times in the most important quarter. And two times in scoring position if I remember right.

That's the difference for me. Oh and Alex signed for 9 after a good season knowing that the team made him better. Kap askin for double... Another difference for me


Shocked Really?! I must have missed something... That is amazingly unselfish if it is true. The essence of sportsmanship and team-player there.


No, I don't think that was a case of altruistic and selfless decision making on the part of Smith. A couple of things to note. One, the team held almost all the leverage in this situation. The apparent interest in Smith was lukewarm at best that off season; he made a free agent visit to Miami and that was it. There may have been discussions with other teams, but nothing serious enough to warrant talk (supposedly Reid was interested in bringing him to Philadelphia). Also important to note that the quarterback market is vastly different now. Flacco, Cutler, Romo had yet to sign their extensions. I don't believe Rodgers had even signed his yet, and that was the year that Brees got his. I think when Smith signs his next contract this year, youll see him earning closer to 14.

Kaepernick would have more suitors on an open market than Smith I believe, which inflates his value and gives him some leverage. He's also younger and seen to have more potential. I really don't think their two contract situations are really comparable.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
3.) Smith was a free agent last season and there was no market for him.
Yes, Smith technically was a free agent in 2012, but there needs to be a large asterisk next to that designation. Everyone in the league assumed the 49ers would re-sign Smith because the 49ers said they would do so - Remember Jim Harbaugh-heart-Alex Smith at Pebble Beach last year? - and because Smith said he wanted to be back. It was only when the 49ers offered Smith a mediocre deal and pursued Peyton Manning that Smith figured he ought to make himself available on the open market. But that was nearly a week into free agency, and most teams already had made their plans.


http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2013/02/the-five-myths-about-the-49ers-and-alex-smith.html


it's a real shame that Alex and the NFCCG has to keep getting brought into this mess... This stuff is all so recycled and old.

As for the NFCCG... an important thing to note was that this was a yr 1 offense. We also had crap on the field like Brett Swain and some other nobodies I can't even recall. I like how someone stated that Alex didn't do enough to win that game, but he sure as hell didn't lose it for us either. Eli had vastly superior WRs that day.. and he still managed to luck out on two would-be easy INTs. 2 TD passes from Alex, right? a 4th quarter drive and TD pass that tied the game 17 all, right? After that, it was back and forth defense forcing punts, right? until finally, KW fumbled yet again in enemy territory.

Time to let this go, and stop using it to deflect on the issues of today...
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Chrissooner49er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Forge wrote:
Chrissooner49er wrote:
49ers Finest wrote:
The difference between the two is pretty obvious to me. It's not blaming one and not the other.

It's true that Alex didn't win us the game. But he didn't lose it either.
Kap lost us the game. He have the defense the ball 3 times in the most important quarter. And two times in scoring position if I remember right.

That's the difference for me. Oh and Alex signed for 9 after a good season knowing that the team made him better. Kap askin for double... Another difference for me


Shocked Really?! I must have missed something... That is amazingly unselfish if it is true. The essence of sportsmanship and team-player there.


No, I don't think that was a case of altruistic and selfless decision making on the part of Smith. A couple of things to note. One, the team held almost all the leverage in this situation. The apparent interest in Smith was lukewarm at best that off season; he made a free agent visit to Miami and that was it. There may have been discussions with other teams, but nothing serious enough to warrant talk (supposedly Reid was interested in bringing him to Philadelphia). Also important to note that the quarterback market is vastly different now. Flacco, Cutler, Romo had yet to sign their extensions. I don't believe Rodgers had even signed his yet, and that was the year that Brees got his. I think when Smith signs his next contract this year, youll see him earning closer to 14.

Kaepernick would have more suitors on an open market than Smith I believe, which inflates his value and gives him some leverage. He's also younger and seen to have more potential. I really don't think their two contract situations are really comparable.


Well, I thought this applied to Alex TODAY as in with the Chiefs....sorry, old news.

Now, I would not be adverse to adding the player whose name this thread carries.
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SoCalNiner


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
Quote:
3.) Smith was a free agent last season and there was no market for him.
Yes, Smith technically was a free agent in 2012, but there needs to be a large asterisk next to that designation. Everyone in the league assumed the 49ers would re-sign Smith because the 49ers said they would do so - Remember Jim Harbaugh-heart-Alex Smith at Pebble Beach last year? - and because Smith said he wanted to be back. It was only when the 49ers offered Smith a mediocre deal and pursued Peyton Manning that Smith figured he ought to make himself available on the open market. But that was nearly a week into free agency, and most teams already had made their plans.


http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2013/02/the-five-myths-about-the-49ers-and-alex-smith.html


it's a real shame that Alex and the NFCCG has to keep getting brought into this mess... This stuff is all so recycled and old.

As for the NFCCG... an important thing to note was that this was a yr 1 offense. We also had crap on the field like Brett Swain and some other nobodies I can't even recall. I like how someone stated that Alex didn't do enough to win that game, but he sure as hell didn't lose it for us either. Eli had vastly superior WRs that day.. and he still managed to luck out on two would-be easy INTs. 2 TD passes from Alex, right? a 4th quarter drive and TD pass that tied the game 17 all, right? After that, it was back and forth defense forcing punts, right? until finally, KW fumbled yet again in enemy territory.

Time to let this go, and stop using it to deflect on the issues of today...


I'm not saying Alex lost the game, I don't think he did. What I was wondering, was why the criticism isn't ever fair. For example, since we're on the topic of Alex's NFCCG game, you're defecting a lot of the loss onto the rest of the team; which is fair imo. However, how come when it comes to Kap, why is it always him? No mention of the terrible o-line play, or insufficient run game?

I don't deny that Kap cost us another SB birth with that interception, but I'm talking about people who are saying he practically cost us TWO Super Bowls. Why didn't Alex cost us one? Much like Kap's SB game, in the 2011 NFCCG, Alex was unable to get us into scoring position after multiple tries. Yet somehow he gets a pass? Kind of unfair don't you think?
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big9erfan


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miami49er wrote:
Alex was just as raw coming out of college and it took him YEARS to get pocket presense, good foot work and read defenses. yet Kap doesn't get that leeway even though he was LARGELY the reason we got to the Superbowl his first year. Kap has only started less than 2 years and some of you talk like he'll never get better. but we all the reason for that.


I honestly don't believe I've seen anyone suggesting that.
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Chrissooner49er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoCalNiner wrote:
oldman9er wrote:
Quote:
3.) Smith was a free agent last season and there was no market for him.
Yes, Smith technically was a free agent in 2012, but there needs to be a large asterisk next to that designation. Everyone in the league assumed the 49ers would re-sign Smith because the 49ers said they would do so - Remember Jim Harbaugh-heart-Alex Smith at Pebble Beach last year? - and because Smith said he wanted to be back. It was only when the 49ers offered Smith a mediocre deal and pursued Peyton Manning that Smith figured he ought to make himself available on the open market. But that was nearly a week into free agency, and most teams already had made their plans.


http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2013/02/the-five-myths-about-the-49ers-and-alex-smith.html


it's a real shame that Alex and the NFCCG has to keep getting brought into this mess... This stuff is all so recycled and old.

As for the NFCCG... an important thing to note was that this was a yr 1 offense. We also had crap on the field like Brett Swain and some other nobodies I can't even recall. I like how someone stated that Alex didn't do enough to win that game, but he sure as hell didn't lose it for us either. Eli had vastly superior WRs that day.. and he still managed to luck out on two would-be easy INTs. 2 TD passes from Alex, right? a 4th quarter drive and TD pass that tied the game 17 all, right? After that, it was back and forth defense forcing punts, right? until finally, KW fumbled yet again in enemy territory.

Time to let this go, and stop using it to deflect on the issues of today...


I'm not saying Alex lost the game, I don't think he did. What I was wondering, was why the criticism isn't ever fair. For example, since we're on the topic of Alex's NFCCG game, you're defecting a lot of the loss onto the rest of the team; which is fair imo. However, how come when it comes to Kap, why is it always him? No mention of the terrible o-line play, or insufficient run game?

I don't deny that Kap cost us another SB birth with that interception, but I'm talking about people who are saying he practically cost us TWO Super Bowls. Why didn't Alex cost us one? Much like Kap's SB game, in the 2011 NFCCG, Alex was unable to get us into scoring position after multiple tries. Yet somehow he gets a pass? Kind of unfair don't you think?


NO ONE has said he single-handedly lost the SB for us, SoCal! I said he CONTRIBUTED to the loss. Unfortunately so did LaMike, Special Teams, etc...
What evidence is there that Alex lost us a chance at the SB? He actually scored TD(s) in the 4th qrtr. He had much worse WRs than we do now. Kyle Williams' 2 disastrous returns coupled with the refs denying us a fumble (Ahmed Bradshaw was stripped of that ball BEFORE he was brought down) is what cost us that game.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SoCalNiner wrote:


Yet somehow he gets a pass? Kind of unfair don't you think?


No matter what, it is still deflecting and irrelevant. Alex didn't cause the turnovers that killed us... Kyle did... Kaep did. Alex was in the playoffs with a yr 1 scheme and severely limited weapons.. Kaep was not on either counts. Time to leave Alex out of this... and as you said... probably time to leave Kaep out of this thread too... IMHO.
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