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Houston should draft AJ McCarron to be their QB
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ThugCityGrunt


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:08 pm    Post subject: Houston should draft AJ McCarron to be their QB Reply with quote

AJ McCarron is, IMO, most comparable to a more successful and athletic Tom Brady as a prospect. I think he is the best fit in Houston at QB because of that. And the best part, besides him being able to start right away, is that you can get him at #33 or a trade down if you're really confident he will get to that pick. So then you can take Jadeveon Clowney #1.

That sounds a lot better than something like Bortles and Cameron Fleming or Manziel and Austin Sefarian-Jenkins.

Houston doesnt need a toolsy guy with potential to carry their team. They already have a good team, they just need competence at QB. You have a chance at the best DE prospect in a long time, to pair him up with the best defensive player in the league. The Seahawks showed having an elite unit on defense and a winner at QB can win a SB.


Dont get me wrong, if there was a Luck or even a Matt Ryan type prospect I would he screaming for the Texans to take that guy. But I dont think the top QBs this year are really that much better than McCarron. He's never gonna be a Peyton or even Brady, but a poor mans Tom Brady (much like a poor man's Peyton Manning in Joe Flavor, kinda) is enough to win the SB with a great defense. You dont need to bet the farm on a QB prospect. Go the safe route, get the winner, while you get the elite pass rusher to pair with your elite pass rusher.

Its obvious, to me.
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jshowers


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why would they want another version of what they already have? McCarron is no better than Yates or Keenum.
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texandominance


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McCarron could be had a lot lower than 33. I don't think he will be good in the pro's and our best bet is on Bortles or Bridgewater.
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jshowers wrote:
Why would they want another version of what they already have? McCarron is no better than Yates or Keenum.


Yup. If we're gonna start a mediocre QB, might as well be one of the two we currently have on roster.

At the very least, Bridgewater compares very favorably to Matt Ryan. I can't see a single scenario in which not drafting Bridgewater is what's best for this team.
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texandominance


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EliteTexan80 wrote:
jshowers wrote:
Why would they want another version of what they already have? McCarron is no better than Yates or Keenum.


Yup. If we're gonna start a mediocre QB, might as well be one of the two we currently have on roster.

At the very least, Bridgewater compares very favorably to Matt Ryan. I can't see a single scenario in which not drafting Bridgewater is what's best for this team.


Teddy goes all JD McCoy on us, breaks his arm and never plays again?
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EliteTexan80


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

texandominance wrote:
EliteTexan80 wrote:
jshowers wrote:
Why would they want another version of what they already have? McCarron is no better than Yates or Keenum.


Yup. If we're gonna start a mediocre QB, might as well be one of the two we currently have on roster.

At the very least, Bridgewater compares very favorably to Matt Ryan. I can't see a single scenario in which not drafting Bridgewater is what's best for this team.


Teddy goes all JD McCoy on us, breaks his arm and never plays again?


Yeah. No. Try again.
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CWood21


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Put down the bottle...but on a more serious note, I'm as big a fan of McCarron as anyone but he's going to be relegated to a Matt Flynn kind of role.
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Jacobys Homey


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lol


lul
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ManInTheMirror


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 6:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, just no.
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I am warming to the idea of taking Clowney (probably because I am thoroughly underwhelmed by Bortles and detest Manziel as an NFL prospect), but there are 5 other guys with comparable skillsets to McCarron that will be taken on day three so wasting #33 on him would be taking a QB just to pacify the nervous nellies who think you have to marquee name value at QB to win. I keep going back to our first draft where Peppers should have been the pick, but David Carr was taken out of some perception that you have to start with that franchise QB despite ample evidence that teams are built from the o-line and d-line back. I think the perception that we are just a Qb away from contention is a dangerous one that will lead us down the road of the Redskins or Browns where a minimal "bump" from competence at the QB position may lead us back to mediocrity, but our holes on the o-line, secondary, and pass rushing have to be addressed before we will truly be contenders. If a Clowney pick allows us to check pass rushing off the list for the next 8 years with much more security than one of these QBs each of which present significant flaws that could render them Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, Tim Tebow quality at the next level then you take the best player at #1, and put a "good enough" placeholder at QB much like the Chiefs did with Alex Smith.

Honestly, Bridgewater is the only QB I'd even want at #33 as I don't see a huge gap between him and Geno Smith although I can acknowledge him having much more going for him between the earholes and at a much more advanced stage coming out than Smith was. However, the "pro ready" thing is fools gold to me as it doesn't much matter to me if a player is great as a rookie if he gets to Pro Bowl level within 4 years and Duane Brown is an easy case to look at for that when you look at him vs. Chris Williams, Jeff Otah, or Sam Baker who were supposedly all "plug and play." While I think Bortles has some nice upside, I'm just not convinced it's a whole lot different than Gabbert/Locker or Osweiler/Foles/Cousins and while some have materialized, they aren't #1 overall quality. Obviously, I've written at length on Manziel, but even if you are 80% sure he's the next Wilson or Brees and I don't see how the poor ints haven't gotten more attention, but even the teams that drafted them graded that potential as 2nd or 3rd round caliber because of the inherent risks and Johnny doesn't have 1/10th the maturity of Wilson or 1/10th the work ethic of Brees. I haven't made up my mind yet and reserve the right to change, but right now I am strongly leaning to Clowney or trading down and grabbing Robinson. For my money, if it's a choice between Manziel or Bortles, I'd rather have Clowney and have O'Brien work with Hoyer, Gabbert, Skelton, Freeman, Henne, Sanchez or Keenum for a season as we'll likely be in a position to grab one of the top 3 QBs again next year.
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mse326


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

^I agree with everything except I think Bridgewater is worth the #1 pick.

You compare him to Geno as if that's a bad thing. Geno has plenty of tools to succeed, it's the mind that is keeping him back. Mentally Bridgewater is as advanced as any QB prospect to come out. He already does pre snap reads and calls audibles. He has shown the ability to go through progressions and not force it. He anticipates routes. When you have that with above average physical tools across the board you have a #1 prospect. He may not be elite in any physical tools, but he is above average in pretty much all of them except size. And he has already put on muscle this offseason before the combine and his athleticism didn't suffer. He is elite mentally and that is where most of these first round busts fail.

Will he ever be a consistent all-pro? Probably not. But I do see multiple pro bowls (deserving at least). I can see him as a top 4-7 QB in this league for years. At the QB position that is worth the #1 pick.
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ManInTheMirror


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
^I agree with everything except I think Bridgewater is worth the #1 pick.

You compare him to Geno as if that's a bad thing. Geno has plenty of tools to succeed, it's the mind that is keeping him back. Mentally Bridgewater is as advanced as any QB prospect to come out. He already does pre snap reads and calls audibles. He has shown the ability to go through progressions and not force it. He anticipates routes. When you have that with above average physical tools across the board you have a #1 prospect. He may not be elite in any physical tools, but he is above average in pretty much all of them except size. And he has already put on muscle this offseason before the combine and his athleticism didn't suffer. He is elite mentally and that is where most of these first round busts fail.

Will he ever be a consistent all-pro? Probably not. But I do see multiple pro bowls (deserving at least). I can see him as a top 4-7 QB in this league for years. At the QB position that is worth the #1 pick.

I agree with everything you just said sir!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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LORK 88


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apollo Stallion wrote:
While I am warming to the idea of taking Clowney (probably because I am thoroughly underwhelmed by Bortles and detest Manziel as an NFL prospect), but there are 5 other guys with comparable skillsets to McCarron that will be taken on day three so wasting #33 on him would be taking a QB just to pacify the nervous nellies who think you have to marquee name value at QB to win. I keep going back to our first draft where Peppers should have been the pick, but David Carr was taken out of some perception that you have to start with that franchise QB despite ample evidence that teams are built from the o-line and d-line back. I think the perception that we are just a Qb away from contention is a dangerous one that will lead us down the road of the Redskins or Browns where a minimal "bump" from competence at the QB position may lead us back to mediocrity, but our holes on the o-line, secondary, and pass rushing have to be addressed before we will truly be contenders. If a Clowney pick allows us to check pass rushing off the list for the next 8 years with much more security than one of these QBs each of which present significant flaws that could render them Jake Locker, Blaine Gabbert, Tim Tebow quality at the next level then you take the best player at #1, and put a "good enough" placeholder at QB much like the Chiefs did with Alex Smith.

Honestly, Bridgewater is the only QB I'd even want at #33 as I don't see a huge gap between him and Geno Smith although I can acknowledge him having much more going for him between the earholes and at a much more advanced stage coming out than Smith was. However, the "pro ready" thing is fools gold to me as it doesn't much matter to me if a player is great as a rookie if he gets to Pro Bowl level within 4 years and Duane Brown is an easy case to look at for that when you look at him vs. Chris Williams, Jeff Otah, or Sam Baker who were supposedly all "plug and play." While I think Bortles has some nice upside, I'm just not convinced it's a whole lot different than Gabbert/Locker or Osweiler/Foles/Cousins and while some have materialized, they aren't #1 overall quality. Obviously, I've written at length on Manziel, but even if you are 80% sure he's the next Wilson or Brees and I don't see how the poor ints haven't gotten more attention, but even the teams that drafted them graded that potential as 2nd or 3rd round caliber because of the inherent risks and Johnny doesn't have 1/10th the maturity of Wilson or 1/10th the work ethic of Brees. I haven't made up my mind yet and reserve the right to change, but right now I am strongly leaning to Clowney or trading down and grabbing Robinson. For my money, if it's a choice between Manziel or Bortles, I'd rather have Clowney and have O'Brien work with Hoyer, Gabbert, Skelton, Freeman, Henne, Sanchez or Keenum for a season as we'll likely be in a position to grab one of the top 3 QBs again next year.

Something tells me if we sign a QB to be the "bridge" to our next QB, it's going to be Matt Cassel. He fits the apparent "mold" that O'Brien looks for and played in the Patriots system. It's a risk, but I think O'Brien could get a serviceable year out of him before having him relegated to backup/mentor duties.

The question after that then becomes take a QB #1 overall still, or take Clowney and find one of the QBs later on. I wouldn't mind taking one of the two QBs who tore their ACL (Mettenberger, Murray) to give them a year get back to full health and to prepare for the next season.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
^I agree with everything except I think Bridgewater is worth the #1 pick.

You compare him to Geno as if that's a bad thing. Geno has plenty of tools to succeed, it's the mind that is keeping him back. Mentally Bridgewater is as advanced as any QB prospect to come out. He already does pre snap reads and calls audibles. He has shown the ability to go through progressions and not force it. He anticipates routes. When you have that with above average physical tools across the board you have a #1 prospect. He may not be elite in any physical tools, but he is above average in pretty much all of them except size. And he has already put on muscle this offseason before the combine and his athleticism didn't suffer. He is elite mentally and that is where most of these first round busts fail.

Will he ever be a consistent all-pro? Probably not. But I do see multiple pro bowls (deserving at least). I can see him as a top 4-7 QB in this league for years. At the QB position that is worth the #1 pick.


Trade down, and let someone else take the risk at #1. Bridgewater is a good QB prospect, but accuracy significantly reduces in passes of 25 yards or more. Just not worthy of the #1 pick.
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2014 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mse326 wrote:
^I agree with everything except I think Bridgewater is worth the #1 pick.

You compare him to Geno as if that's a bad thing. Geno has plenty of tools to succeed, it's the mind that is keeping him back. Mentally Bridgewater is as advanced as any QB prospect to come out. He already does pre snap reads and calls audibles. He has shown the ability to go through progressions and not force it. He anticipates routes. When you have that with above average physical tools across the board you have a #1 prospect. He may not be elite in any physical tools, but he is above average in pretty much all of them except size. And he has already put on muscle this offseason before the combine and his athleticism didn't suffer. He is elite mentally and that is where most of these first round busts fail.

Will he ever be a consistent all-pro? Probably not. But I do see multiple pro bowls (deserving at least). I can see him as a top 4-7 QB in this league for years. At the QB position that is worth the #1 pick.


We're not too far off on this. My issue is that it is need that is pushing Bridgewater, Bortles, and Manziel into discussion for being looked at as top 5 picks, not talent and that almost always leads to poor value (like Locker, Gabbert, Ponder in 2011, Tannehill and Weedon in 2012, or Manuel last year). None of these guys are Newton, Luck, Griffin, or Jameis Winston next year, so we are essentially in the position of taking Locker, Tannehill, or Gabbert quality at #1 overall (who were all top ten picks). Locker and Tanehill may have led more talented teams to a playoff birth by now, but they aren't "put the team on my back" types the way Luck has been both years, RGIII was as a rookie, and Cam last year once their D hit it's stride. I don't think Clowney alone gets us there either, but I think Clowney + servicable QB > above average QB + another Barwin/Reed type pass rusher on a defense lacking game changers beyond Watt / Cushing.

Just because this draft class has 3 or 4 QBs better than last years crop, still doesn't mean any of them are worthy of #1 overall. If you are going to reach for need, I could argue that Mack/Barr, Dennard/Gilbert, Robinson/Matthews are justifiable reaches as well as the lack of a 2nd pass rush option, deep coverage, and o-line play have been problems longer than poor QB play which could be explained by Kubiak's predictable system as much as Schaub falling off a cliff and Keenum being undrafted for a reason. We hired a QB guru who made Matt McGloin into a winning QB, so we should assume that he can actually coach up a QB and that change in an of itself will provide offensive improvement since the opponent doesn't know the entire playbook like they did with Kubiak and Shanny. Last year's implosion could easily be pinned on our failure to adequately replace Mario, Barwin, Winston, and Quin if QB play wasn't the one thing most lay NFL fans point to because they can understand that ints are bad. I don't see a huge movement to ditch Eli Manning or Flacco despite both playing at Schaub level last year, while I maintain that just fixing QB merely gets us back to 7-9 territory like them and a 2 year process means you take the best player, not the best QB at #1.
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