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Jim Harbaugh or Trent Baalke? If you have to pick one
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Jim Harbaugh or Trent Baalke?
Jim Harbaugh
68%
 68%  [ 34 ]
Trent Baalke
32%
 32%  [ 16 ]
Total Votes : 50

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dan77733


Joined: 13 Apr 2014
Posts: 367
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would much rather keep Baalke.

Harbaugh is good but not great. He thinks he's great but he's not. The main reason why I would keep Baalke over Harbaugh is because despite being an ex-NFL QB, I didnt see Kaepernick progress at all in 2013. He simply regressed. Another reason is that he doesnt use the talent he has. James could be explosive out of the backfield as a receiver or on tosses/sweeps/pitch outs, etc. but he doesnt even use him. Hell, he draws up more plays for the FB as a receiver than he does our running backs. Also, Harbaugh likes to hype up guys who he thinks should get contract extensions or be re-signed. Personally, I hate that. Team isnt going to have any leverage when negotiating.

In the end, I like Harbaugh but would let him leave if he wanted to. Hell, if the Browns wanted to give me a Gruden type deal this past march, I would have said, enjoy the snow in Cleveland Jim. LOL.
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

probably no secret... but I liked Harbaugh at first... same for (ugh) Nolan... same for Singletary... and so it goes......

... but as strong as I still love my 49ers... I hate Jim... I do see the remaining "appeal"... but no.. he's a poser and a clown. That's just my 2 cents.. and I don't expect it to get any love... doesn't really much matter, now does it? Go Niners, always.... it's always been about the players and what SF stood for... then. Now... just going to stop. Makes the sadz.
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 3:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DP
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Miami49er


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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Location: Miami, FL (Wade County)
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
probably no secret... but I liked Harbaugh at first... same for (ugh) Nolan... same for Singletary... and so it goes......

... but as strong as I still love my 49ers... I hate Jim... I do see the remaining "appeal"... but no.. he's a poser and a clown. That's just my 2 cents.. and I don't expect it to get any love... doesn't really much matter, now does it? Go Niners, always.... it's always been about the players and what SF stood for... then. Now... just going to stop. Makes the sadz.
and what's the common denominator with those coaches you ended up hating? we all know what that is. how is Harbaugh a poser and a clown? he is easily a top 5 coach in my opinion.
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Miami49er


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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Location: Miami, FL (Wade County)
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dan77733 wrote:
I would much rather keep Baalke.

Harbaugh is good but not great. He thinks he's great but he's not. The main reason why I would keep Baalke over Harbaugh is because despite being an ex-NFL QB, I didnt see Kaepernick progress at all in 2013. He simply regressed. Another reason is that he doesnt use the talent he has. James could be explosive out of the backfield as a receiver or on tosses/sweeps/pitch outs, etc. but he doesnt even use him. Hell, he draws up more plays for the FB as a receiver than he does our running backs. Also, Harbaugh likes to hype up guys who he thinks should get contract extensions or be re-signed. Personally, I hate that. Team isnt going to have any leverage when negotiating.

In the end, I like Harbaugh but would let him leave if he wanted to. Hell, if the Browns wanted to give me a Gruden type deal this past march, I would have said, enjoy the snow in Cleveland Jim. LOL.
Baalke's drafts don't look so hot anymore. his best draft was 2011 and the good players from that draft can't stay out of trouble. not to mention the god-awful 2012 draft and the almost all of the 2013 draft is all wait and see.
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Only so much you can truly know about draft prospects, You can be great at drafting talent... but if that talent afterwards does not put forth the interest or effort, he will fail... or maybe the talent can't stay out of trouble or away from substances... which somehow looks badly on the drafter later... but how fair is that really? Who can really be sure that the motivation and character stays strong....
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J-ALL-DAY


Joined: 17 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny how other fan bases have differing opinions on Harbaugh compared to our fan base. They have high praise for him and believe he is a top 3 HC in the game. I agree with them and it would be a shame the day he leaves. Like Bowman said on 1st take a few weeks ago, he just mentally prepares the guys right for the big games. Baalke is very good in his own right. No way do I want to get rid of him either. I like that he doesn't always see eye to eye with Harbaugh. That is sometimes a good thing as you don't want the HC to have full control.
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oldman9er


Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

J-ALL-DAY wrote:
Funny how other fan bases have differing opinions on Harbaugh compared to our fan base. They have high praise for him.


You think? I'd say that this is very inaccurate from what I have read around the net. Think

At any rate, I think Jim is a competent HC... most people probably think at least that much. He's just not very likable.. which I think most would grudgingly agree with, if being honest.
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J-ALL-DAY


Joined: 17 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh no, Harbaugh is ranked highly on this board. Even Seahawks fans have him top 3 and that is the consensus for most.

Yeah, even those that think he is a great coach believe he is very obnoxious Laughing.
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Miami49er


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
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Location: Miami, FL (Wade County)
PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
Only so much you can truly know about draft prospects, You can be great at drafting talent... but if that talent afterwards does not put forth the interest or effort, he will fail... or maybe the talent can't stay out of trouble or away from substances... which somehow looks badly on the drafter later... but how fair is that really? Who can really be sure that the motivation and character stays strong....
true. but Aldon and Culliver had red flags on their character going into the draft. I don't mind the risk as those guys have been great/good players. but still his other drafts have been down right awful. Now we're shopping Lamichael James. a second round pick. he's still living off of the praise he's gotten for one good draft.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miami49er wrote:
oldman9er wrote:
Only so much you can truly know about draft prospects, You can be great at drafting talent... but if that talent afterwards does not put forth the interest or effort, he will fail... or maybe the talent can't stay out of trouble or away from substances... which somehow looks badly on the drafter later... but how fair is that really? Who can really be sure that the motivation and character stays strong....
true. but Aldon and Culliver had red flags on their character going into the draft. I don't mind the risk as those guys have been great/good players. but still his other drafts have been down right awful. Now we're shopping Lamichael James. a second round pick. he's still living off of the praise he's gotten for one good draft.


Yeah, was just throwing that out there. I'm not really on one firm side or the other when it comes to assessing Baalke's drafting. Definitely some head-scratchers with decisions like LMJ in rd 2... AJJ in rd 1...

I think the only pick I liked in 2012 was the Cam Johnson in the 7th one. I liked most of the 2011 one.. after I warmed to Aldon. All considered, now I wish we'd have gone with who I wanted... Robert Quinn... d'oh!
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rudyZ


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

J-ALL-DAY wrote:
Oh no, Harbaugh is ranked highly on this board. Even Seahawks fans have him top 3 and that is the consensus for most.

Yeah, even those that think he is a great coach believe he is very obnoxious Laughing.



Jay, I must say that from what I've seen too, Jim seems to have a lot more people disliking him than praising him. He's constantly being called a hypocrite and a fraud by a lot of people.

But oldman, it doesn't matter that you don't like him. A head coach can't win if he's not backed by his players. He doesn't owe reporters and fans a likeable persona. Sure, in an ideal world, he could be more like his brother, and be liked unconditionally by everyone, players and fans alike. But that's not Jim's job. His job is to have his players' backs and have them buy into the plan. I was excited when Mike Nolan was hired, because he was a man with a plan. Players didn't buy it. Then with Sing, it was another hope, because he was a bigger man with a smaller plan, and sometimes simplicity wins. But players didn't buy it. Jim came here, and it seems that he effortlessly won the players over, installed his plan, and we've been winning ever since. I don't think you give Jim enough credit for being the coach the players want to play for. He's not amazing with clock management, Xs and Os overall, and stuff like that, but that's not his job either. He has a staff for that. I've been saying it for a couple of years. The two most important things for a head coach is to be able to win over the players and gather a great coaching staff. In that regards, Jim is a great head coach.
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dan77733


Joined: 13 Apr 2014
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Miami49er wrote:
Baalke's drafts don't look so hot anymore. his best draft was 2011 and the good players from that draft can't stay out of trouble. not to mention the god-awful 2012 draft and the almost all of the 2013 draft is all wait and see.


2010 draft would like to have a word with you. While he wasnt the official GM at the time, it was Baalke who ran that draft. Davis, Iupati, Bowman, Dixon and Williams. Mays and Adams are still playing in the NFL. Mays isnt bad but is better suited at LB as opposed to safety. Either way, that was a great draft.

2011 is STILL a great draft. Have to wait and see what happens with Aldon but if anything, the team already got its money's worth from him. Kaepernick is the franchise QB and will eventually sign an extension. Him getting into trouble off the field was a dumb move but thus far, it looks like him, Patton and Lockette wont have any charges pressed against them. Bad decision and bad situation Kaepernick put himself into and hopefully, he wont do anything stupid again. Culliver was a great pick until Super Bowl week and since then, its been all downhill. Hunter has been very good for a fourth rounder, Kilgore is expected to be our starting center and Miller has been an absolute stud and a steal.

2012 sucked and once James gets traded, it will be worse than 2008. At the same time though, Harbaugh hasnt exactly embraced or used some of the guys. James for example should have a set of plays for him only but Harbaugh doesnt use the guy.

Personally, this is why I wouldnt care if Harbaugh leaves next year. To me, he's the cause for the problems between him and Baalke. There's no way Baalke is drafting guys without Harbaugh at the very least being interested and intrigued by the guys Baalke is drafting.

2010 was an A+ and its funny how since Harbaugh arrived, the drafts have gotten worse instead of better.

2013 is more of a wait and see. Reid is a stud and I just hope he can avoid any more future concussions. Carradine and Lattimore were picks for the future which I have no problem with. McDonald was a disappointment but at the same time, like James, the coaching staff doesnt exactly use him properly and that falls directly on Harbaugh. Lemonier looks like he's going to be an excellent OLB for us. Patton showed flashes but breaking his foot slowed his progress. Still hoping he'll win the slot receiver position. Dial is a decent third string NT and Moody is solid on special teams. Bykowski was on our practice squad and he's a developmental guy. Daniels looked good to me and if anything, I would have kept him over McCoy. Cooper turned out to be one hell of a steal....for the Chiefs. Granted, we dont have him but he turned out to be a solid starting CB in KC.

Overall, I still think that Baalke is at the very least 70% positive. Higher if you add in UDFA's since 2010. Brock (2010), Morris (2013), Jerod-Eddie (2012), Dobbs (2011), Tukuafu (2012), Wilhoite (2012), Williams (2011) and Celek (2011).

To me, would much rather keep Baalke. If he had a HC who wasnt such an egomaniac and use the guys that his GM gives him, Baalke would look even better. Personally, I think that Harbaugh doesnt use the talent on purpose to advance his own agenda but thats just my own personal opinion.
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J-ALL-DAY


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rudyZ wrote:
J-ALL-DAY wrote:
Oh no, Harbaugh is ranked highly on this board. Even Seahawks fans have him top 3 and that is the consensus for most.

Yeah, even those that think he is a great coach believe he is very obnoxious Laughing.



Jay, I must say that from what I've seen too, Jim seems to have a lot more people disliking him than praising him. He's constantly being called a hypocrite and a fraud by a lot of people.

But oldman, it doesn't matter that you don't like him. A head coach can't win if he's not backed by his players. He doesn't owe reporters and fans a likeable persona. Sure, in an ideal world, he could be more like his brother, and be liked unconditionally by everyone, players and fans alike. But that's not Jim's job. His job is to have his players' backs and have them buy into the plan. I was excited when Mike Nolan was hired, because he was a man with a plan. Players didn't buy it. Then with Sing, it was another hope, because he was a bigger man with a smaller plan, and sometimes simplicity wins. But players didn't buy it. Jim came here, and it seems that he effortlessly won the players over, installed his plan, and we've been winning ever since. I don't think you give Jim enough credit for being the coach the players want to play for. He's not amazing with clock management, Xs and Os overall, and stuff like that, but that's not his job either. He has a staff for that. I've been saying it for a couple of years. The two most important things for a head coach is to be able to win over the players and gather a great coaching staff. In that regards, Jim is a great head coach.


I think there is two different issues we are talking about. I'm saying most believe he is a great HC and one of the top 3 in the league. I'm NOT arguing most dislike him as I even stated many think he is obnoxious.
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dan77733


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

J-ALL-DAY wrote:
Like Bowman said on 1st take a few weeks ago, he just mentally prepares the guys right for the big games.


Hmmmmm, I disagree with this. *coughSuperBowlcough* We were so UNPREPARED IN EVERY ASPECT that it took a BLACKOUT to get the team to decide to show up. And let's not forget one other important aspect that Baalke has NO CONTROL over and thats Jim's HORRIBLE play-calling at times.

I dont remember if it was three or four in a row but at the end of the Super Bowl, so close to the endzone, why the hell are we passing when we have GORE!!!! Seriously, Harbaugh's play calling leaves a LOT to be desired.

Harbaugh has done a great job in three years but at the same time, he already had the majority of talent already on the team and when you compare it to 2003-2010, of course, he's going to look better than he actually is. Anyone would.

Harbaugh also runs too many different styles of offenses that I dont even remember how many he runs. He should be focusing on just one type of offense and perfecting it as opposed to running several different offenses that sometimes are effective but are also ineffective the same amount of times.

How many times do we have to see a dump off pass to our FB on 2nd and 10? Seriously, Harbaugh could leave next off-season and take both Roman and Fangio with him and I wouldnt shed a single tear.
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