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Will the Browns pick a QB if we stay at #4 or trade up?
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Will the Browns pick a QB if we stay at #4 or trade up?
Yes
74%
 74%  [ 26 ]
No
25%
 25%  [ 9 ]
Total Votes : 35

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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zelbell wrote:
12 of the 32 starting QBs in the NFL were 2nd round picks or later and Brady, Brees, Foles, Kaep, Dalton, and Wilson are 7 of the 12 with the other 5 being on the Texans, Raiders, Bucs, Browns, Jacksonville

All 20 other teams starting QBs were drafted in the 1st round

I'm sick and tired of trading down and passing on QBs at the top of the draft, we need to take one at #4 because those are the only ones who IMHO can turn this damn franchise around


I agree 100% regarding taking QBs high................just not THESE QBs.
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2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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Thomas5737


Joined: 23 Dec 2009
Posts: 5170
Location: WV
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:
Estonianzulu wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Estonianzulu wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Farmer just called me and told me there is no chance we take a QB in the first round.

I mean, IMHO, Farmer just called me and told me there is no chance we take a QB in the first round.

Can we please just trade down and load up on good players in this deep top 60 and not blow it on some project QB Sad


Isn't every player a project?


Absolutely not.

"Project" for an NFL prospect has a pretty distinct meaning. I guess you don't know what a "project"is??


Oh, damn. duke used sarcasm- it was super effective.

I know what a project is. But your basically tarring legitimate starting QB's with the term "project" to discredit them. If Teddy Bridgewater is a "project" than so is Jadeveon Clowney. Nearly no player is a finished product out of college. But a "project" player at QB is a player who is not ready to play, a Logan Thomas if you will.

Last year at this time everyone was in love with the 2014 QB class. On year later, its "2015 is the class to beat" and we're dumping 2014 as full of projects. It happens every year. If you legitimately feel there is no franchise QB we can get at 4- than that's fine but don't call them "projects". They are either franchise QB's or they are busts. The reason Bridegwater and Bortles (and Manziel) are being touted is that they are successful, accomplished, physically gifted football players in all respects exactly like every other player in every other position.

Take this report of a player: Smart player, with great instincts and and a high football IQ. Not the most fiery leader and smaller than desired- but of an adequate size. Needs to put on mass to make it a full 16 games. A hard working high character prospect with top potential.

That, without a position, is either Eric Berry or Teddy Bridgewater. Why does one get no questions about being a top 10 pick and the other get called a "project"


Ok, they are all busts then

And you still seemingly are not sure what a "project" is.

A project is someone who needs so much work that they are not anywhere near worthy of a really high pick. I did not think I would ever have to define that on this forum.


Bingo













I mean










Mingo
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???
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2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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buno67


Joined: 15 Mar 2007
Posts: 30965
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 7:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:
Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???


ahh yes bad picks are players who arent extremely successful the minute they step on the field...
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 7:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

buno67 wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???


ahh yes bad picks are players who arent extremely successful the minute they step on the field...


I didn't like the pick the second they made it.

Mingo didn't do anything to change my feelings about the pick.

I am well aware that players dont need to be really good right away to be a good pick.
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2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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Estonianzulu


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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 25450
Location: Middle of Nowhere VA
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:

Ok, they are all busts then


Ok, I disagree with you.

Quote:
And you still seemingly are not sure what a "project" is.

A project is someone who needs so much work that they are not anywhere near worthy of a really high pick. I did not think I would ever have to define that on this forum.


Nothing like being condescending to really drive home your point there.

A "project" pick is a physically talented player who needs protection and limited playing time to develop. A rotational player at first who is brought into the lineup gradually to develop.

What you are describing is a "reach", a player who isn't worth the pick he's taken at. Those two terms are not universally interchangeable.

And the idea that a player being compared to Ben Roethlisberger, and another player being described as "Pro Ready" can be considered 'projects' tells me that you use the term to liberally.
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nugpimpen


Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 20086
Location: 10 Miles South of Cleveland
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:
buno67 wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???


ahh yes bad picks are players who arent extremely successful the minute they step on the field...


I didn't like the pick the second they made it.

Mingo didn't do anything to change my feelings about the pick.

I am well aware that players dont need to be really good right away to be a good pick.


But you are OK writing him off as a bad pick after 1 year? I mean he was 2nd on the team in sacks and wasn't even a starter.

I'm not saying he had a good year, but it could have been way worse.
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poorbytehshore


Joined: 03 Nov 2009
Posts: 2535
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the subject of Mingo, I've been reading Collision Low Crossers which is about the Jets season in 2011 when Pettine was there. He loves speed and a guy who can use that and just turn bloodthirsty off the edge. If Mingo doesn't work out with Pettine, I don't think he ever will.

His philosophy of the game being stretched out across the field also makes me wonder if he may take Shazier in the draft
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Estonianzulu wrote:
duke2056 wrote:

Ok, they are all busts then


Ok, I disagree with you.

Quote:
And you still seemingly are not sure what a "project" is.

A project is someone who needs so much work that they are not anywhere near worthy of a really high pick. I did not think I would ever have to define that on this forum.


Nothing like being condescending to really drive home your point there.

A "project" pick is a physically talented player who needs protection and limited playing time to develop. A rotational player at first who is brought into the lineup gradually to develop.

What you are describing is a "reach", a player who isn't worth the pick he's taken at. Those two terms are not universally interchangeable.

And the idea that a player being compared to Ben Roethlisberger, and another player being described as "Pro Ready" can be considered 'projects' tells me that you use the term to liberally.


If you look hard enough, you can find someone comparing every rookie to someone great.
_________________
2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nugpimpen wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
buno67 wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???


ahh yes bad picks are players who arent extremely successful the minute they step on the field...


I didn't like the pick the second they made it.

Mingo didn't do anything to change my feelings about the pick.

I am well aware that players dont need to be really good right away to be a good pick.


But you are OK writing him off as a bad pick after 1 year? I mean he was 2nd on the team in sacks and wasn't even a starter.

I'm not saying he had a good year, but it could have been way worse.


Who said I am "writing him off"??

I said I didnt like the pick when they made it, and he didnt do anything last year to change my mind.

How can I be writing him off when I didnt like the pick to begin with?

Of course he can still be a good player, never said he couldnt. I didnt and dont like the pick.
_________________
2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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Estonianzulu


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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 25450
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:

If you look hard enough, you can find someone comparing every rookie to someone great.



And if you're scared of every QB because they aren't Andrew Luck coming into the NFL, you'll never get one.
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nugpimpen


Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 20086
Location: 10 Miles South of Cleveland
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:
nugpimpen wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
buno67 wrote:
duke2056 wrote:
Mingo=bad pick also

I remember at the time thinking...................Mingo???


ahh yes bad picks are players who arent extremely successful the minute they step on the field...


I didn't like the pick the second they made it.

Mingo didn't do anything to change my feelings about the pick.

I am well aware that players dont need to be really good right away to be a good pick.


But you are OK writing him off as a bad pick after 1 year? I mean he was 2nd on the team in sacks and wasn't even a starter.

I'm not saying he had a good year, but it could have been way worse.


Who said I am "writing him off"??

I said I didnt like the pick when they made it, and he didnt do anything last year to change my mind.

How can I be writing him off when I didnt like the pick to begin with?

Of course he can still be a good player, never said he couldnt. I didnt and dont like the pick.



Well when I see "Mingo = Bad Pick" I'm just kind of assuming that you already have your mind made up because it's pretty tough to judge a draft pick after 1 season. Especially one that was so raw
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Estonianzulu wrote:
duke2056 wrote:

If you look hard enough, you can find someone comparing every rookie to someone great.



And if you're scared of every QB because they aren't Andrew Luck coming into the NFL, you'll never get one.


Again, I completely agree,

I just dont want any of THESE guys
_________________
2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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duke2056


Joined: 21 Feb 2005
Posts: 8314
Location: Cleveland area
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nugpimpen wrote:



Well when I see "Mingo = Bad Pick" I'm just kind of assuming that you already have your mind made up because it's pretty tough to judge a draft pick after 1 season. Especially one that was so raw



I thought it was a bad pick when it happened. My mind hasnt been changed since it happened. Not sure what else you want me to say.

I never said he can't be good.
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2014 draft prediction:

Zero chance the Browns draft a QB at pick 4, or trade up for a QB.

And Matt Ryan is so great he has one playoff win.
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Estonianzulu


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Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 25450
Location: Middle of Nowhere VA
PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

duke2056 wrote:
Estonianzulu wrote:
duke2056 wrote:

If you look hard enough, you can find someone comparing every rookie to someone great.



And if you're scared of every QB because they aren't Andrew Luck coming into the NFL, you'll never get one.


Again, I completely agree,

I just dont want any of THESE guys


Fair enough.
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