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Alterraun Verner
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dmudd


Joined: 24 Nov 2009
Posts: 1377
PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 11:45 pm    Post subject: Alterraun Verner Reply with quote

Whats the low down on this guy? The other day on twitter Tulloch tweeted at him to get his agent on the phone and come to Detroit. I admit i know pretty much nothing about him.
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TitanLegend


Joined: 18 Jun 2012
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A guy who is a top end #2 corner in the league. Great in zone coverage, but lacks the speed and at times size to cover man to man. He's yet another results of PFF's retarded rating system completely overrating a player. He's not one of the top corners in the league like they rated him to be, he's not even the best corner on this team(McCourty is).

I hope Verner understands his own limitations and allows us to resign him for a reasonable contract(or if not us, elsewhere for a reasonable contract), but if he gets a huge, #1 CB contract elsewhere, there's obviously no reason for him not to take it, though the team that signs him is going to be seriously disappointed when they ask him to go cover Larry Fitzgerald, Brandon Marshall or Calvin Johnson like he would be paid to do.

He's such a great person to have on your team, not only because of his skill on the field but the leadership in the locker room and his overall intelligence, and the last thing I want to see his people to start bashing him because he's getting paid like one of the best in the game but struggles because the coaches and GMs that wanted him didn't actually watch his tape.
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coleman51


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 17, 2014 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasn't set in stone to be a starter in 2013, but Tommie Campbell made no progress. Those two were in a camp battle all preseason. Campbell didn't pan out at all. Verner went on to have a Pro-Bowl season.

He was more of a ball hawk in his earlier years, specifically as a rookie. Has been solid but nothing wonderful. He's an outstanding person and a great locker room guy. Not a guy with an ego with off field problems.

I'd hate to see him go but wouldn't want to overspend for an already money loaded secondary.
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titans0021


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll just quote what I said about him in the FFMD thread:
titans0021 wrote:
Longhorn wrote:
Just wondering what your guys opinion of Verner is in real life, think he will be tagged if an agreement cant be reached?
I think there's very little chance he is tagged. Too big of a cap number to take on when we don't have a lot of depth at the moment and honestly, he's a #2 corner.

I like Verner. Hell I just won some game-worn gloves and some headphones from him on Twitter. But he doesn't really have the size/speed combination that a great cover corner needs. He's a good football player who, for the most part, understands his shortcomings and is smart enough to work around them. He can be a great #2 corner and his football intelligence really shows up when he is in zone. With that said, I think this past year was about the best you'll see from him. However if he can maintain that play, he'll earn the contract he gets since he was solid in man, great in zone and created some big plays.

I'll put it this way, if he ends up getting huge money, I don't expect a team will ever say wow, this was an incredible investment, but I also wouldn't expect a team to look back a few years into the deal with a bunch of regret either.

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Double Agent


Joined: 15 Oct 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty much what these cats said.

Really good CB. Not elite, maybe not even great, but really good. I'll be very sad to see him go if it happens. Seems likely based on all the talk though.
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Chocolateman78


Joined: 31 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like how Titans fans are trying to underrate Verner to ease the eventual pain when he leaves town.

This is different from the Cortland Finnegan situation. Verner is gonna go somewhere and keep playing at a high level.

I for one don't think the gap between McCourty and Verner is that big at all, if there is one. People get way too tied down in size/speed arguments. Obviously he's not Revis but nobody, save Patrick Peterson, is. I'd pick Verner's instincts and intelligence over a lot of other corner's size/speed specs though.

Calling him a #2 corner is just a gross misnomer to me because it implies that there are at least 32 cornerback's better than Verner. That's not true. I get that the term comes from the thought that he's better suited to cover a teams #2 receiver, but it's not fitting. There really isn't much distinguishable from #1 or #2 corners in today's NFL, there's just starting corners (boundary corners) and nickle and dime backs. The way teams move WR's around, you can't really just match up your best cover guy on their top guy on every single play. Also more and more teams have two guys who you could deem #1 WR's.

Long story short, while Vern might not be a shut down corner (imo Peterson, Revis, and Sherman are the only guys talented enough to silence any WR in the league) but he is a upper echelon starting corner or a "#1 corner" if you will. Obviously he'll benefit more in certain systems. He has a lot of Peanut Tillman and Antonie Winfield in his game, In a Cover 2 he's probably a perennial pro bowler. But even in a press man scheme I think he's effective while he's young. Still think his best position would be the "rover" safety/Free saftey though.

imo Vern's gonna be the one of the few players who we let get away that maintains his greatness. One of the few we might come to regret.
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ttitansfan4life


Joined: 30 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chocolateman78 wrote:
I like how Titans fans are trying to underrate Verner to ease the eventual pain when he leaves town.

This is different from the Cortland Finnegan situation. Verner is gonna go somewhere and keep playing at a high level.

I for one don't think the gap between McCourty and Verner is that big at all, if there is one. People get way too tied down in size/speed arguments. Obviously he's not Revis but nobody, save Patrick Peterson, is. I'd pick Verner's instincts and intelligence over a lot of other corner's size/speed specs though.

Calling him a #2 corner is just a gross misnomer to me because it implies that there are at least 32 cornerback's better than Verner. That's not true. I get that the term comes from the thought that he's better suited to cover a teams #2 receiver, but it's not fitting. There really isn't much distinguishable from #1 or #2 corners in today's NFL, there's just starting corners (boundary corners) and nickle and dime backs. The way teams move WR's around, you can't really just match up your best cover guy on their top guy on every single play. Also more and more teams have two guys who you could deem #1 WR's.

Long story short, while Vern might not be a shut down corner (imo Peterson, Revis, and Sherman are the only guys talented enough to silence any WR in the league) but he is a upper echelon starting corner or a "#1 corner" if you will. Obviously he'll benefit more in certain systems. He has a lot of Peanut Tillman and Antonie Winfield in his game, In a Cover 2 he's probably a perennial pro bowler. But even in a press man scheme I think he's effective while he's young. Still think his best position would be the "rover" safety/Free saftey though.

imo Vern's gonna be the one of the few players who we let get away that maintains his greatness. One of the few we might come to regret.


It's not underrating him at all. It's you overrating him. He'll never be a #1 CB. #1 WRs will bully him all day. He likely want to get paid like McCourty or even more and he's simply not worth it especially when we don't have any cap room as is. McCourty and Griffin are locked up long term. Never agreed with the Griffin extension even though he was solid last year, but you simply can't give an extension to a 3rd guy in the secondary. That would be beyond dumb. What happens when Casey's contract is up? What about Wrights? Verner most likely will be good when he goes elsewhere but so what? I'd love to keep him but this is a business and sometimes you have to make tough decisions. It's not about "easing the pain". It's about smart decisions and not throwing out money to another DB. Verner is what he is. A very good CB, borderline top 10 IMO, but he also plays #2 CB and regardless of what you say, most teams #2 WRs are not as good as the #1. Hell just in our division the difference between the other 3 teams #1 and #2 WRs is huge. Colts - Wayne and I guess Hilton. When healthy, Wayne is way better than Hilton. Texans - AJ is way better than Hopkins. Jags - I'm guessing Shorts is the #1? Not sure where to put put Mr. DUI but fact is Shorts >>> Jacksonville #2 WR. Hell, most teams don't even have a good #2 WR such as the Lions, Ravens, Patriots(don't even have a #1), etc. Verner is a very good player but the money just isn't there for him. We locked up McCourty for a reason. Bc the FO felt he was the better player. They knew Verner's time was coming up during the time of McCourty's extension. He's the better player and its more than just size/speed. McCourty is simply the better overall CB. McCourtys biggest weakness is defending the slant route while Verners biggest weakness is getting burnt. McCourty is better at tackling, in run support, press coverage, etc. Verner is the better playmaker but McCourty is the better overall CB.
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ttitansfan4life


Joined: 30 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't wait to here the Verner fanboys next year when McCourty or Verners replacement gives up a catch, misses a tackle, etc. Verner wouldn't of let that happen...... SMH
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ragevsuall17


Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ATV is good. He started out on fire and was making impact plays left and right. A lot of us who thought he'd be beated out by Campbell were pleasantly surprised.

But as the year went along, teams kept throwing at him, and his hot streak eventually came to an end. Not only did the impact plays come to a hault, but the mistakes kept adding up. The games with him giving up TDs and getting called for penalties started increasing.

ATV can be a number 1, but I don't have the confidence that I would with some of the better CBs, McCourty included. Eventhough McCourty didn't put up the "stats", teams hardly threw his way... a sure sign of respect. The two aren't that close... but its not like they're night and day either. I'd consider McCourty a high end #1... and ATV on the lower end of #1's...

If we resign him, great... he's an awesome #2... but we better not be giving him #1 money...
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deeluxx3


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ragevsuall17 wrote:
ATV is good. He started out on fire and was making impact plays left and right. A lot of us who thought he'd be beated out by Campbell were pleasantly surprised.

But as the year went along, teams kept throwing at him, and his hot streak eventually came to an end. Not only did the impact plays come to a hault, but the mistakes kept adding up. The games with him giving up TDs and getting called for penalties started increasing.

ATV can be a number 1, but I don't have the confidence that I would with some of the better CBs, McCourty included. Eventhough McCourty didn't put up the "stats", teams hardly threw his way... a sure sign of respect. The two aren't that close... but its not like they're night and day either. I'd consider McCourty a high end #1... and ATV on the lower end of #1's...

If we resign him, great... he's an awesome #2... but we better not be giving him #1 money...


My thoughts exactly.

Verner had a very, very good year. But his play certainly started to decline as the year went along. I do not trust him to line up against teams #1s the way I do McCourty and I would be content seeing Verner walk if it meant we could keep guys like Casey or Wright for the long term.

And I don't think there's anyone on this board who would disagree with my last statement.
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TitanSS


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Most of us have no problem letting him go because of the amount of money he will be looking for.

You're talking about him being one of the best CBs in the league... he didn't even have a starting job until preseason. He is a good CB but he is far from worth what he will be paid.

He won't be a #1 CB because he is never going to be able to defend the deep route 1v1. McCourty is left on an island a lot more than Verner is.

Would I like to retain Verner? Absolutely.

Would I give him over 6.5 mil/year? Nope.
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Iceman88


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanSS wrote:
Most of us have no problem letting him go because of the amount of money he will be looking for.

You're talking about him being one of the best CBs in the league... he didn't even have a starting job until preseason. He is a good CB but he is far from worth what he will be paid.

He won't be a #1 CB because he is never going to be able to defend the deep route 1v1. McCourty is left on an island a lot more than Verner is.

Would I like to retain Verner? Absolutely.

Would I give him over 6.5 mil/year? Nope.


This....Verner is a very valuable corner but he is not worth a ton. That is why I think we will let him go because we have internal options to replace him and he is likely going to get 6yrs/50M+ on the open market.
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KingTitan


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Verner has two flaws, he can be beat deep. He also can't physically out man a WR.

Now those are signficant but at the same time not killers. The way he plays, he makes up for it. He uses his skills to the best of his ability and gets pretty good results.

Can he replicate his early success of this year and maintain it for a year?
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VYoung10


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll ask the inevitable question for those curious, did he play well because it was a contract year?
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Justin615$


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2014 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanSS wrote:
Most of us have no problem letting him go because of the amount of money he will be looking for.

You're talking about him being one of the best CBs in the league... he didn't even have a starting job until preseason. He is a good CB but he is far from worth what he will be paid.

He won't be a #1 CB because he is never going to be able to defend the deep route 1v1. McCourty is left on an island a lot more than Verner is.

Would I like to retain Verner? Absolutely.

Would I give him over 6.5 mil/year? Nope.


That was just more of Munchak having no clue. Our only pro bowl player this year and Munchak did not even want him in the beginning of the year. That said, I agree. I don't think we should overpay for Verner.
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