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So is Crennel going to run a 2-gap?
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kethnaab


Joined: 05 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 6:03 pm    Post subject: So is Crennel going to run a 2-gap? Reply with quote

and totally screw the best DL in the NFL in the process?
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amazingandre


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDK but Im still not happy about this. His ONLY success comes off the back of one of the greatest minds in football and then totally bombed on his own. It will be tough with a green head coach, now you add in an over rated DC.....ugh
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buckwild


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

amazingandre wrote:
IDK but Im still not happy about this. His ONLY success comes off the back of one of the greatest minds in football and then totally bombed on his own. It will be tough with a green head coach, now you add in an over rated DC.....ugh


He had a decent defense in KC, but just sucked as a HC. At least they are hiring someone with some experience rather than a total unknown. Or did you want to try the Frank Bush experiment all over again?
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I agree that there is not much "sexy" about hiring a 66 year old failed Head Coach as a DC, that is exactly what you would have said about the Wade Phillips hire. When we hired Wade, I warned that he is a guy who provides vastly diminishing returns as his teams usually experience dramatic turnarounds, then for whatever reason they backslide into mediocrity. My theory is that Wade is brilliant in his initial development of his defense around the strengths of the personnel and in simplifying things which empowers players to use instinct and likely have some fun again. However, eventually the tendencies of players become predictable and when things start going wrong, the lack of discipline makes it difficult for the coaching staff to step in and correct mistakes since the players by that point think they know better. Worse still, while players like Cushing or Manning actually have the instincts and talent to operate in a "loose" system, when they go down and vastly inferior talent replaces them, Wade is poor at adjusting. Of course, Rick did Wade no favors by forcing Wade to change his system to accomodate Ed Reed even if he wasn't damaged goods, but it seems like Wade never is respected by the people who shop for the groceries but he also has culpability with his own inferior favorites like Ball and Keo.

So what we get with Crennel is a guy that I think presents a perfect option to continue the progress Wade made rather than scrapping what is clearly the strength of this team as a playoff caliber defense in need of tweaking, not a complete reboot. Romeo's style is much more disciplined than Wade's, but also is built with a focus on the d-line (the best of the Pats / Giants 3-4 era's). He's definitely more 2-gap and likely much less hybrid 4-3 looks, but frankly the past 2 seasons that hybrid is what has been killing us as it has made substandard #3 safeties play critical roles and left us comfortable ignoring ILB as an important player on the team.

Where Romeo really distances himself from Wade is in is knowledge of coverage schemes which has always been Wade's achilles heel. Romeo is definitely more "read and react" than Wade's "aggressive" style, but Wade's calls repeatedly lead to ridiculous mismatches particularly with McCain and Harris and LBs on TEs they had no prayer of covering. Romeo's D allow for much more intelligent assessment of what is coming and minimizing damage particularly deep. Wade could overwhelm a simplistic system like Cinn, but got destroyed by any system where the QBs were empowered to pick apart the holes. The great QBs like Brees, Brady, Rodgers, Manning, etc love it when teams think the way to beat them is to mindlessly blitz them, which just doesn't work when they always know where the open man is.

In short, I think Romeo will be a perfect "transition" coach to fix some of the problems with our defense without a complete overhaul while also providing an instant upgrade to respect and discipline. I promise than Kareem's butt will be on the bench after his 2nd PI, not his 10th and McCain would never be in a position to have to cover man to man which was insane. I think, like Wade, Romeo's biggest impact with be in the first few seasons at which point, I'm all for prepping someone to install a few more modern attacking strategies.
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norg


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

first of all we are not the Best D line in the League

and whats a 2 gap ..?????


DT NT DE ..?????

anyways just like the pats I think we will change each week or each play depending on what team we are playing

3-4 4-3 5-2

what im wondering if we pick Clowney will he play DE in a 3-4 and can he play some OLB ..????
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

norg wrote:
first of all we are not the Best D line in the League

and whats a 2 gap ..?????


DT NT DE ..?????

anyways just like the pats I think we will change each week or each play depending on what team we are playing

3-4 4-3 5-2

what im wondering if we pick Clowney will he play DE in a 3-4 and can he play some OLB ..????


Don't confuse Crennel's Pats D with the mish-mash they've run since Wilfork, Warren, and Seymour dominated the front and McGinest, Vrabel, Bruschi, Phifer, and Ted Johnson were the LBs. For goodness sakes, the Pats were 5-11 in Belichicks first season before Crenell was brought in, then won 3 Super Bowls in Crennel's 4 seasons there and haven't won one since he left. That was back when that team was balanced before they fell in love with the passing game above all else and ignored their d-line. While the front 3 were exceptional, the LBs were smart savvy players vs. athletic freaks, which is why I'm excited to have a guy like Vrabel on board, who I suspect is the DC in waiting.

As for 2 gap vs. 1 gap, it merely refers to responsibilities of the lineman having to read a play and "cover" the gaps to the left and right of an offensive lineman vs. 1 gap where lineman just handle one of these spaces and LBs handle the others. The "C" is outside of the tackle; the "B" is inside the tackle, outside the guard; the "A" is outside the center's shoulders, inside the guards. In 2 gap the NT covers BOTH A gaps and the DE's cover the B & C gaps around the tackles. Obviously with 3 players taking on 5 lineman, the idea is to have big, strong lineman who can keep these guys occupied while the LBs are "freed" to make the plays. However, Wilfork, Warren, and Seymour were all playmakers as well in Crennel's system, so I think Watt and Smith can excel (yes, I think Antonio should be retained).

What I never understood about Wade's 1 gap version of the 3-4 is that we got no push rush out of the DTs unless we stuck Antonio or JJ in there and he rarely ever blitzed with the ILBs to create an inside rush. If they were inside QBs knew to roll out, when they were outside Qbs stepped up into a clean pocket. While I think Earl Mitchell could operate in the system, I do think that his free agency provides an opportunity to find a player more ideally suited as a gap filler.
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dsorc


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another thing to keep in mind with 2-gap versus 1-gap is the goal/mentality of each style. My understanding is that in the 2-gap system, the most important factor is that the DL needs to force double teams so that the LBs can flow freely. A guy like Watt can force that double team no matter what technique he plays. We will need a strong NT that can dominate centers like fans have been clamoring for for years.
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jch1911


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 3:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dsorc wrote:
Another thing to keep in mind with 2-gap versus 1-gap is the goal/mentality of each style. My understanding is that in the 2-gap system, the most important factor is that the DL needs to force double teams so that the LBs can flow freely. A guy like Watt can force that double team no matter what technique he plays. We will need a strong NT that can dominate centers like fans have been clamoring for for years.

So true and RC coached TWO in the Shrine / East-West Bowl (Justin Ellis & Beau Allen). While I think Ellis may have vaulted himself into 3rd round consideration, Allen (Watt's former teammate at Wisconsin) may be available later.
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Blaze


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Glad we got Crennel to bring toughness, from a coaching standpoint, to the defensive side of the ball. Anxious to see what Watt doesnt essentially probably playing a new position with a new technique. He wont be playing OLB or anything of that nature but 2 gap DE is different from 1 gap DE. Although, as a playmaker, I see Watt having no problems adjusting. Clowney would have to switch to OLB tho. Smith needs to be retained as well.

More pressing is I hope Munchak signs on to coach the OL. Imagine what Brandon Brooks and Duane Brown could become under him.
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Conquest8089


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bill O'Brien tailors schemes to personnel & weekly matchups. Hiring Romeo Crennel concerned me on this 2-Gap v. 1-Gap context. Turning J.J. Watt into a Read & Reaction hold the point 5-Technique wouldn't just be devastating for his production, but it would be misusing a Generational Player. We're talking about a player that will be 25 entering 2014 & has the potential to be one of the best Defensive players to Ever play the game.

This is the critical question that must be asked by the Houston Media. O'Brien will emphasize the scheme will be 'Multiple', but it must be tailored to letting Watt play his game & finding talent around him to make plays.
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kethnaab


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conquest8089 wrote:
Turning J.J. Watt into a Read & Reaction hold the point 5-Technique wouldn't just be devastating for his production, but it would be misusing a Generational Player.


bingo.

you don't take Adrian Peterson and make him a blocking FB. The 2-gap tends to de-emphasize the playmaking of the defensive linemen while relying on the playmaking of the LBs. Definitely not what Houston has right now
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dsorc


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm honestly not worried at all about Watt in Crennel's scheme. Just look at Richard Seymour for an example of what Watt will likely be expected to do. Also, Watt has a tendency to play run first anyways.

The one thing that is in my head about the system is what will be using in passing downs. Everybody talks about 4-3 or 3-4 and 1-gap or 2-gap but all of that are run stopping concepts. Nobody plays 4-3 or 3-4 in passing downs and gap containment means little when you're rushing the passer. In the new NFL what matters is what type of nickel/dime packages you use and how do you mix up man and zone concepts.
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dsorc wrote:
I'm honestly not worried at all about Watt in Crennel's scheme. Just look at Richard Seymour for an example of what Watt will likely be expected to do. Also, Watt has a tendency to play run first anyways.

The one thing that is in my head about the system is what will be using in passing downs. Everybody talks about 4-3 or 3-4 and 1-gap or 2-gap but all of that are run stopping concepts. Nobody plays 4-3 or 3-4 in passing downs and gap containment means little when you're rushing the passer. In the new NFL what matters is what type of nickel/dime packages you use and how do you mix up man and zone concepts.


Agreed. Hopefully a guy who spent so much time in practice defending the NE system and its usage of slot receivers and double tight ends all those years understands a bit better than Kubiak's minions and Phillips, that in today's NFL having 1 cover corner (Joseph) and 1 cover safety (Manning) isn't enough. My defensive wish list continues to include a true #2 corner to push Kareem to the nickel where he belongs, a playmaking safety with deep speed to compliment Manning (and insure against his decline), and an ILB with some modicum of coverage skill. It was never a great shock that a team that ignored it's own need for offensive threats beyond the #1 WR, #1 TE, and #1 RB failed to address it's defensive vulnerability to systems targeting 4-5 receiving threats on each play, but hopefully O'Brien not being stuck in what worked in the 90's like his predecessor, finally prioritizes these needs on both sides of the ball.
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ServantofYHWH


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kareem should play S dag nab it
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Apollo Stallion


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ServantofYHWH wrote:
Kareem should play S dag nab it


I still don't understand this thought on him. I assume the logic is that physical corners who have trouble in man to man coverage can become above average coverage safeties. It worked for Glover Quin to an extent, but in reality, he still played CB in nickel situations and on other downs was basically just a CB tasked with covering TE's rather than a traditional dual purpose SS. Quin is also considerably bigger than KJ at 6' 0", 210 while KJ tops out at 5' 10", 188. 2 inches and 30 lbs may not seem like much, but it sure is when you figure he'd be giving up 8 inches and 75 lbs to a guy like Gronk with most other TE's being 6' 4" - 6' 7" 240-270. If you are considering him as a FS, I think you are ignoring his primary weaknesses are deep coverage, deep speed, poor hands, penalty prone, and lack of playmaking skills. I fail to see anything that would indicate that he would be better off playing even deeper which would lead to even LONGER penalties to his league lead this year.

Devin McCourty may be the closest success story for a smallish converted safety, but he's more Bob Sanders-ish as he's got a compact muscular frame and plays 10 lbs heavier than KJ who is quite thin. I think Kareem's speed was VASTLY overrated by the combine as he clearly plays much slower than his clocked time, so the last thing you want him doing is bulking up and getting even slower. I continue to maintain that Kareem would make a decent nickle corner (like Quin) as his coverage skills in the first 10-15 are quite good, he just can't hang deep without grabbing (often times while catching up at the last second and not locating the ball). I maintain the Texans still desperately need a #2 corner with deep speed particularly in a division where we still have no answer for TY Hilton, Kendall Wright, or Cecil Shorts better yet Erik Decker, Torrey Smith, Josh Gordon, Antonio Brown. When Rod Streater and Eddie Royal go off on you, you have serious problems beyond your #1 CB.
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