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My Case Against Capers and the "no talent" Excuse
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Dunderhead


Joined: 13 Nov 2009
Posts: 2547
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?
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incognito_man


Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 30901
Location: Madison
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SE500 wrote:
"That begs the question, is the site wrong or do we actually not run a 3-4?"

We run a base 34. Have you noticed how much nickel we play? Explain the difference between a 43 and our nickel.

We run a great number of schemes and we do not ask any different from our players than most any other teams does as far as positional changes go.


you can click the quote button in the upper right corner of the post ya know Wink
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jrock645


Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 72
Location: Georgia
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dunderhead wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?


Ever occur to you that its not just about the SF game? This is a big picture problem based off of 3 FULL SEASONS of bad defense.
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Tongue-Splitter


Joined: 30 Aug 2013
Posts: 2237
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:
you can click the quote button in the upper right corner of the post ya know Wink

Am I the only one that skips about 9,000 posts a day because the quote feature is abused? It takes up half a page for somebody to reply these days because they can't just remove unnecessary quotes and instead quote three previously quoted quotes so that it's obnoxious and annoying. I applaud the guy for not using it.
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incognito_man


Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Posts: 30901
Location: Madison
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tongue-Splitter wrote:

Am I the only one that skips about 9,000 posts a day because the quote feature is abused? It takes up half a page for somebody to reply these days because they can't just remove unnecessary quotes and instead quote three previously quoted quotes so that it's obnoxious and annoying. I applaud the guy for not using it.


It's easy to delete the irrelevant portions after selecting it.

As demonstrated here.

It's way, way easier to discern this way than just using quotation marks.
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ChaRisMa


Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 7144
Location: @_G_Tom
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always felt if the post you were replying to was the previous post shown no quote was necessary unless to emphasize a point.
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Tongue-Splitter


Joined: 30 Aug 2013
Posts: 2237
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree. Sometimes I like to put a little ^ just to be clear. Also, football is cool. Laughing

Let's see... I doubt Dom has too much power in the draft room. If he does, he shouldn't. Especially not regarding the defensive line.
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CWood21


Moderator
Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Posts: 35190
Location: 'Merica
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tongue-Splitter wrote:
Am I the only one that skips about 9,000 posts a day because the quote feature is abused? It takes up half a page for somebody to reply these days because they can't just remove unnecessary quotes and instead quote three previously quoted quotes so that it's obnoxious and annoying. I applaud the guy for not using it.


So long as people don't abuse the quote button, it's a very useful button. But people are too lazy to delete the previous person's stuff. In very rare instances do I not delete it for that simple reason, and most of the time I leave it is when it's needed to understand my point.
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RashaanSalaami


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Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 29864
Location: Jersey
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

incognito_man wrote:


I a

ma

I d ot.


Like this?
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fan-59


Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 514
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...



NO you have not, what you've given us is opinions based off what you think is the problem, specifically speaking, you and others have went around the problem somehow hoping to find a nitch that will stick pointing to Capers and only Capers as the problem.

some say it's pass pressure and the 2-4 front, some say it's coverage, reality says it's both, but one glaring point stands out, we have struggled ever since we lost Collins, in fact this was a very good defense when we had that player.
my point is defense is different than offense, one glaring hole is all it takes for a defense to fall apart, specially one as important as FS.

all the rest mostly stems from that one hole in our defense.
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fan-59


Joined: 26 Jan 2008
Posts: 514
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrock645 wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?


Ever occur to you that its not just about the SF game? This is a big picture problem based off of 3 FULL SEASONS of bad defense.


Agreed, Collins was hurt 3 years ago, but it's far to simple for people to grasp the catalists for our problems, it has to be more complicated than just not having a good FS. Rolling Eyes
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Dunderhead


Joined: 13 Nov 2009
Posts: 2547
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrock645 wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?


Ever occur to you that its not just about the SF game? This is a big picture problem based off of 3 FULL SEASONS of bad defense.


Ummm... Because hysteria is never based off of anything. The Pack didn't lose to the Giants because of defense. The Pack lost because the offense turned the ball over 3 times. Then SF in the playoffs, Capers didn't see the R/O coming. It happens and the team has 3 days to prep. They spent an offseason sudying it and the R/O isn't really a problem. And this last game is hardly an indictment of the the defense when the offense spends half the game being inept.

As far as the regular season, I could careless. The Packers are a young team and especially so on defense. If all things are equal they should get better as the season progresses and they do.

Now could this defense be better? Yeah. Will it get there through coaching? I don't see it. It needs better players. And that's the exact thing McCarthy said. Like I said, name me this great coach that doesn't need talent.
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Pugger


Joined: 01 May 2010
Posts: 8278
Location: N. Fort Myers, FL
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fan-59 wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...



NO you have not, what you've given us is opinions based off what you think is the problem, specifically speaking, you and others have went around the problem somehow hoping to find a nitch that will stick pointing to Capers and only Capers as the problem.

some say it's pass pressure and the 2-4 front, some say it's coverage, reality says it's both, but one glaring point stands out, we have struggled ever since we lost Collins, in fact this was a very good defense when we had that player.
my point is defense is different than offense, one glaring hole is all it takes for a defense to fall apart, specially one as important as FS.

all the rest mostly stems from that one hole in our defense.


I agree we need to find that guy to replace Collins but we also need to shore up the middle of the D so TEs don't run wide open in there. A better pass rush wouldn't hurt either.
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2Bigby0


Joined: 02 Mar 2008
Posts: 626
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrock645 wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?


Ever occur to you that its not just about the SF game? This is a big picture problem based off of 3 FULL SEASONS of bad defense.


That's just not true. The defense has played well in spots. This year, through the first 7 games they were looking like a really solid defense. Even parts of last year they played well. 2011 was a complete disaster and they were bad.

Injuries are my number 1 reason this defense has struggled and because of that we've had to dip in to our developmental players extremely early. A ripple effect.

For all the naysayers, I also like to point to Dom's history against our 2 main competitors in the North. Cutler and Stafford. We just need more bodies to stop the damn run.
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NCPackFan


Joined: 12 Jan 2013
Posts: 2118
Location: Kinston, NC
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2014 2:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jrock645 wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
NCPackFan wrote:
Dunderhead wrote:
All of these threads and all the debate of the folks that don't care for Capers can be summed up with, "I don't like Dom, he make me angry". The reasoning is lacking for anything else...


We've given plenty of hard, statistical evidence and gameplay. You, and others, just don't want to accept it...


No, you belly ache... There's a difference. One changes things, the other is just goofy and senseless and akin to a toddler stomping his feet and throwing a tantrum.

Repeat after me... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... We did not lose to San Fran because of defense... Dontcha feel better?


Ever occur to you that its not just about the SF game? This is a big picture problem based off of 3 FULL SEASONS of bad defense.


Clearly it doesn't and it not only shows a lack of objectivity, but it makes me wonder if this person was one of the people who couldn't stand to let Favre go a few years ago and deep down inside they still haven't moved on to Rodgers, thus the reason they blame the lack of output by the offense against one of the best defenses in the league.

If they were also paying attention to this thread, they would've noticed that several posters mentioned our base defense of 2 down linemen with OLB's serving essentially as stand-up DE's who blitz. I'm sorry, but you can't stop the run with only 2 down linemen and a coverage ILB behind them. 3 down linemen on the other hand...
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