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Sio Moore named to All-Rookie Team!
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Silver&Black88


Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 34573
Location: Boston, MA
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baggabonez wrote:
raidr4life wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
Yet, we want to upgrade him with Mack or Barr.
No one has said replace Sio with Mack or Barr. Burnett would need to be replaced if not now soon. You know this man stop making stuff up.

Silver&Black88 wrote:
Nice list.

For me, a guy I wouldn't mind seeing us pick is Anthony Barr. Move Sio to WLB and use his versatility. Sio can cover, blitz and set the edges. Put Barr at SLB and let Allen use him like Von Miller. Or even work him slowly and put Burris at WLB subbing out Sio for Barr sometimes. All about the long term.


Why would I need to make stuff up?


Still stand by it. As for the other post:

I gave you that situation because its perfectly viable. Its reasonable to think Clowney will be gone and we can't get a trade down. I'd dislike picking Watkins there but could understand it at least.

Why do I consider upgrading Sio? Because of his skillset. He isn't a top pass rusher like we tried to use him. He has an all around LB kind of skill set so why not put him at a position more likely to utilize that? Similarly, if Dennis Allen is intent on using a LB in a Von Miller kind of role (as he previously stated) then why not pick up a guy with a better skillset for that? Last year we were making do with what we had in the cupboard but I'm a proponent for this because I think it would be more conducive to success. Especially if we can sign a RE worth a damn as a pass rusher.
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MrOaktown_56


Joined: 14 Dec 2013
Posts: 2066
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Somewhat related to the "what would you do at 5?" thing:

Some Scenarios:

QB Trade Up Scenario:
1.Clowney
2.Bridgewater (Highest Bidder not minnesota because that would take too much)
Trade with Minny so they can take bortles/manziel and take their 2nd. Pick anthony barr, as matthews and mack will be selected before him.

In the 2nd:
Aaron Donald: Add interior pass rush next to sims who could become a monster.
David Yankey: Can play guard and offensive tackle so say goodbye to depth issues.

Dream Scenario:
1.Blake Bortles
2.Jake Matthews
3.Teddy Bridgewater
4.Johnny Manziel
5.Jadeveon Clowney
I don't think there is any player I would want to see more than Jadeveon Clowney on our team in this draft including all the qbs.
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Baggabonez


Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 6486
Location: RaiderNation
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LAST thing the Raiders need to do is trade up. This team is badly in need of players. Look at what's happening to Julio & RGIII (even Ricky Williams historically), mega-trades adversely affect the team's ability to win in the long run.

You have to let the draft come to you. If Clowney is gone (or even if he is depending on the offer) I would trade down. I am confident there will be a buyer with Clowney, Watkins or a QB being the likely target. Outside of the box, I would even go so far as to suggest the Raiders front office should trade for future picks. In the future the Raiders could do what the Patriots have done in the past or what is being suggested the Rams may do which is use one and trade one for more future picks. It would be an aggressive move but it would accomplish a number of things: 1) opting out of the first round of a draft lacking star power 2) opting into a deep draft by acquiring more second round picks and 3) leveraging for more assets in lieu of the 2016 Winston/Hackenberg draft.
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Nodisrespect wrote:
(on building inside out) teams without highly draft DT's make the playoffs and win the superbowl regularly.

Bonez wrote:
Teams that win Superbowls and make the playoffs aren't picking in the Top 5, clearly
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big_palooka


Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 22834
Location: ATL
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baggabonez wrote:
The LAST thing the Raiders need to do is trade up. This team is badly in need of players. Look at what's happening to Julio & RGIII (even Ricky Williams historically), mega-trades adversely affect the team's ability to win in the long run.

You have to let the draft come to you. If Clowney is gone (or even if he is depending on the offer) I would trade down. I am confident there will be a buyer with Clowney, Watkins or a QB being the likely target. Outside of the box, I would even go so far as to suggest the Raiders front office should trade for future picks. In the future the Raiders could do what the Patriots have done in the past or what is being suggested the Rams may do which is use one and trade one for more future picks. It would be an aggressive move but it would accomplish a number of things: 1) opting out of the first round of a draft lacking star power 2) opting into a deep draft by acquiring more second round picks and 3) leveraging for more assets in lieu of the 2016 Winston/Hackenberg draft.


+1.

There Raiders are literally 48 pieces away from being a playoff team.

They can't go "all in" on 1 prospect when they need so so so much in the way of starters, depth, etc.
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BNich0622


Joined: 22 Feb 2008
Posts: 1683
Location: Connecticut
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big Rob wrote:
nice. i think the kid will only get better. Definately a building block for our defense..


Repping my Uconn Huskies!! LOve to see it.

Donald Brown is a free agent as well. Bring him over Reggie!
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OakleyCap


Joined: 05 Jul 2013
Posts: 7537
Location: CA
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.

Try to bring Lamarr Houston back at a fair price, sign Greg Hardy, and we have a pretty stout pass rusher.

DE - Lamarr Houston
NT - Pat Sims
UT - Vance Walker
DE - Greg Hardy
WLB - Sio Moore
MLB - Nick Roach
SLB - Anthony Barr
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smokey1212


Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 627
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OakleyCap wrote:
If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.

Try to bring Lamarr Houston back at a fair price, sign Greg Hardy, and we have a pretty stout pass rusher.

DE - Lamarr Houston
NT - Pat Sims
UT - Vance Walker
DE - Greg Hardy
WLB - Sio Moore
MLB - Nick Roach
SLB - Anthony Barr


0% chance Hardy hits the FA market. Best chances at buying a DE are Orakpo, M. Johnson, and J. Allen
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RaiderX


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 20764
Location: Crown Town, CA
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 5:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

smokey1212 wrote:
OakleyCap wrote:
If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.

Try to bring Lamarr Houston back at a fair price, sign Greg Hardy, and we have a pretty stout pass rusher.

DE - Lamarr Houston
NT - Pat Sims
UT - Vance Walker
DE - Greg Hardy
WLB - Sio Moore
MLB - Nick Roach
SLB - Anthony Barr


0% chance Hardy hits the FA market. Best chances at buying a DE are Orakpo, M. Johnson, and J. Allen


Not really. Panthers are kinda tight on the cap right now. I mean they let Peppers walk a few years ago.
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Yea, RaiderX wins. We can all just top acting like this is a matter of opinion. MY GOD.
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Baggabonez


Joined: 29 Apr 2010
Posts: 6486
Location: RaiderNation
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 5:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OakleyCap wrote:
If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.


Yeah raider4life, no one is talking about this . . . . .
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Nodisrespect wrote:
(on building inside out) teams without highly draft DT's make the playoffs and win the superbowl regularly.

Bonez wrote:
Teams that win Superbowls and make the playoffs aren't picking in the Top 5, clearly
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Rolni


Joined: 08 Jun 2008
Posts: 2620
Location: Europe
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaiderX wrote:
smokey1212 wrote:
OakleyCap wrote:
If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.

Try to bring Lamarr Houston back at a fair price, sign Greg Hardy, and we have a pretty stout pass rusher.

DE - Lamarr Houston
NT - Pat Sims
UT - Vance Walker
DE - Greg Hardy
WLB - Sio Moore
MLB - Nick Roach
SLB - Anthony Barr


0% chance Hardy hits the FA market. Best chances at buying a DE are Orakpo, M. Johnson, and J. Allen


Not really. Panthers are kinda tight on the cap right now. I mean they let Peppers walk a few years ago.

their GM just spoke about the possibility to let Hardy go...

They have around 20M cap space and have like 20 FA's and will need to sign the rookie class.
They will have huge deals in the upcoming years (Cam, Luke), so a back loaded deal is also unlikely.
They have CJ at DE and Star+Short at DT, so they could form a strong DL with a not so good DE too...
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 9161
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rolni wrote:
RaiderX wrote:
smokey1212 wrote:
OakleyCap wrote:
If we take Anthony Barr at number five we could move Sio Moore to WLB, keep Roach at MLB, and use Barr at SLB.

Try to bring Lamarr Houston back at a fair price, sign Greg Hardy, and we have a pretty stout pass rusher.

DE - Lamarr Houston
NT - Pat Sims
UT - Vance Walker
DE - Greg Hardy
WLB - Sio Moore
MLB - Nick Roach
SLB - Anthony Barr


0% chance Hardy hits the FA market. Best chances at buying a DE are Orakpo, M. Johnson, and J. Allen


Not really. Panthers are kinda tight on the cap right now. I mean they let Peppers walk a few years ago.

their GM just spoke about the possibility to let Hardy go...

They have around 20M cap space and have like 20 FA's and will need to sign the rookie class.
They will have huge deals in the upcoming years (Cam, Luke), so a back loaded deal is also unlikely.
They have CJ at DE and Star+Short at DT, so they could form a strong DL with a not so good DE too...

Ya I think they have even less money than that like maybe 12mill. I also posted on another thread but they already have almost 10mill in dead money next year and almost all of the high priced guys on their roster have more dead money if they release them than if they kept. They really had some contracts out of whack kind of like we did in years past. And yes Cam is a FA after next season so that is a factor as well.
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TiberiusRising


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 9161
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Best scenario for me is if we are able to get Hardy and Van Noy. Then you got yourself a top notch 4-3 defense without hoping players will do well in new spots. Not only that but it fits our scheme perfectly guys who can cover, blitz, tackle at any moment. Our pass rush issues came from four man rush not blitzing lb's. Also we play in a division with Manning, Rivers, and Smith. All guys who like to get the ball out quick. Burnett was good for us and almost there in coverage a lot. But I fear he is just a step behind in his older age at least in coverage. He knows where he should be but just cant make it there. If Van Noy is there in the 2nd its a no brainer just like Sio last year in the 3rd. Only worry is that Houston takes him. But he is a player worth jumping up 3 spots in the 2nd round for.


DE: Houston/FA or draftee
NT: Sims
UT: Walker
DE: Greg Hardy
WLB: Kyle Van Noy
MLB: Nick Roach
SLB: Sio Moore

-Obviously in this scenario looking for more DL help in FA or draft. Wooten can play DE or DT in 4-3 so might be a nice option. Linval Joseph would be a nice starter for us.
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RaisinBran


Joined: 18 Aug 2008
Posts: 10195
Location: 925/805
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baggabonez wrote:
The LAST thing the Raiders need to do is trade up. This team is badly in need of players. Look at what's happening to Julio & RGIII (even Ricky Williams historically), mega-trades adversely affect the team's ability to win in the long run.

You have to let the draft come to you. If Clowney is gone (or even if he is depending on the offer) I would trade down. I am confident there will be a buyer with Clowney, Watkins or a QB being the likely target. Outside of the box, I would even go so far as to suggest the Raiders front office should trade for future picks. In the future the Raiders could do what the Patriots have done in the past or what is being suggested the Rams may do which is use one and trade one for more future picks. It would be an aggressive move but it would accomplish a number of things: 1) opting out of the first round of a draft lacking star power 2) opting into a deep draft by acquiring more second round picks and 3) leveraging for more assets in lieu of the 2016 Winston/Hackenberg draft.

RG3 is a bad example. If he was healthy the Redskins would definitely be competitive. Same goes for Julio, both players have a huge impact on whether their teams can win games.

It's worth it to trade up if you truly believe the guy your trading up for will have a huge positive impact on your teams future.

You are right though, MOST of the time, trading up is a bad idea. Especially when a future 1st is involved. We would probably only be giving up our 2nd rounder to trade up.
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Chali21


Joined: 07 Feb 2007
Posts: 3397
Location: Cali
PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaisinBran wrote:
Baggabonez wrote:
The LAST thing the Raiders need to do is trade up. This team is badly in need of players. Look at what's happening to Julio & RGIII (even Ricky Williams historically), mega-trades adversely affect the team's ability to win in the long run.

You have to let the draft come to you. If Clowney is gone (or even if he is depending on the offer) I would trade down. I am confident there will be a buyer with Clowney, Watkins or a QB being the likely target. Outside of the box, I would even go so far as to suggest the Raiders front office should trade for future picks. In the future the Raiders could do what the Patriots have done in the past or what is being suggested the Rams may do which is use one and trade one for more future picks. It would be an aggressive move but it would accomplish a number of things: 1) opting out of the first round of a draft lacking star power 2) opting into a deep draft by acquiring more second round picks and 3) leveraging for more assets in lieu of the 2016 Winston/Hackenberg draft.

RG3 is a bad example. If he was healthy the Redskins would definitely be competitive. Same goes for Julio, both players have a huge impact on whether their teams can win games.

It's worth it to trade up if you truly believe the guy your trading up for will have a huge positive impact on your teams future.

You are right though, MOST of the time, trading up is a bad idea. Especially when a future 1st is involved. We would probably only be giving up our 2nd rounder to trade up.


Yeah but unless you have a Super Bowl Team thats young and one player away from taking it all, yo never mortgage the future. I mean the lack of depth hurt both the Redskins and Falcons, at least the Falcons can recover this year I bet the Redskins really wished they'd have that first to upgrade the team. They could use Watkins, or Matthews.
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Silver&Black88


Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 34573
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RaisinBran wrote:
RG3 is a bad example. If he was healthy the Redskins would definitely be competitive.


RG3 sucked this year. Can't scramble? Fine. Make plays in the pocket. He didn't.
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