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The 3-4 Defense
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UTMoc10


Joined: 18 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin615$ wrote:
TitanSS wrote:
Casey and Martin are not big enough to play nose. The point of a nose tackle isn't to get past your blockers and generate a pass rush, but to command as many blockers as possible and collapse the inside of the pocket so the QB cannot step up.

Casey and Martin would be much better off as DEs in a 3-4.


Mike Martin was the NT in a 3-4 in college. He is small but also one of the strongest people on our team.


Martin can definitely hold is own. He is a strong strong dude. Benched 225lbs 36 times at the combine. He played a lot of NT at Michigan something like 37 games. Plus he has a wrestling background, I think that helps him because he plays with really good leverage. He do well at NT in passing situations.

Also Earl Mitchell the Texans NT is about the same size give like 2 pounds. That seems to work for them just fine...
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VY


Joined: 26 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Justin615$ wrote:
TitanSS wrote:
Casey and Martin are not big enough to play nose. The point of a nose tackle isn't to get past your blockers and generate a pass rush, but to command as many blockers as possible and collapse the inside of the pocket so the QB cannot step up.

Casey and Martin would be much better off as DEs in a 3-4.


Mike Martin was the NT in a 3-4 in college. He is small but also one of the strongest people on our team.


Martin is going to have to prove a helluva lot to even be back here next year. I know the guys who kept him on the bench are all gone (Munch, Gray, Williams and Rocker) but still, he hardly played last year. Played only 22% of snaps the entire season. Out of all the d-lineman, he was only ahead of Lavar Edwards (14%) who only dressed for nearly half as many games as Martin. We need some help in stopping the run, and getting bigger across the d-line is a priority to protect the ILB's.

http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/player-defensive-snap-count-stats/2013/
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Chocolateman78


Joined: 31 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UTMoc10 wrote:
Dionysus wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
BurheadTitans wrote:
Dionysus wrote:
Are we really converting to the 3-4 or are we just speculating?


Speculation but I believe it was ESPN who reported that Whiz didn't want to go to Detroit because they said no to a switch to the 34.


They regurgitated it from Cardinals insider Mike Jurecki, who said it was one of the reasons why Whiz chose TEN over DET but not necessarily the main reason (According to Jurecki, money and location were the two biggest sells for Whiz).

I know he's not a part of your media, which you guys rightfully look to for your Titans news but Mike Jurecki is as slam dunk as it gets. He's kind of a jerk personally and most Arizona natives don't like the way he comes off on print or on his radio show but he's arguably the most plugged in insider in all of sports, let alone Arizona sports. He flat out doesn't get anything wrong when it comes to Arizona Cardinals reportings. Jurecki has stated that Whiz will be returning to the 3-4 zone blitz scheme and that his preferred coordinators are John McNulty on offense and one of Butler/Horton/Moss for the defense, assuming he can get permission to interview any or all of them.


Do we have the personnel or at least enough of it to run a decent 3-4? The main issues will be in the front 7. I know Casey, Ayers and Wimbley can all play in the 3-4 because that's the system they came from. But what about the rest? Or how most likely can convert?



If you go back to the first couple pages there is a lot of discussion about that. I think we are very close. A good NT, OLB and ILB away. Easily could be converted after the draft and FA.


So basically we lack 3 of the most important positions in a 3-4 defense, but we're real close to being a good one?

Also when did Casey play in a 3-4?
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SerenityNow


Joined: 08 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the switch to the 3-4 I could see Daniel McCullers becoming a target in the mid rounds. If we want to talk about a nose tackle that can take up blocks, McCullers definitely fits that bill. He really fits perfectly in a 3-4 defense.
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UTMoc10


Joined: 18 Oct 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chocolateman78 wrote:
UTMoc10 wrote:
Dionysus wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
BurheadTitans wrote:
Dionysus wrote:
Are we really converting to the 3-4 or are we just speculating?


Speculation but I believe it was ESPN who reported that Whiz didn't want to go to Detroit because they said no to a switch to the 34.


They regurgitated it from Cardinals insider Mike Jurecki, who said it was one of the reasons why Whiz chose TEN over DET but not necessarily the main reason (According to Jurecki, money and location were the two biggest sells for Whiz).

I know he's not a part of your media, which you guys rightfully look to for your Titans news but Mike Jurecki is as slam dunk as it gets. He's kind of a jerk personally and most Arizona natives don't like the way he comes off on print or on his radio show but he's arguably the most plugged in insider in all of sports, let alone Arizona sports. He flat out doesn't get anything wrong when it comes to Arizona Cardinals reportings. Jurecki has stated that Whiz will be returning to the 3-4 zone blitz scheme and that his preferred coordinators are John McNulty on offense and one of Butler/Horton/Moss for the defense, assuming he can get permission to interview any or all of them.


Do we have the personnel or at least enough of it to run a decent 3-4? The main issues will be in the front 7. I know Casey, Ayers and Wimbley can all play in the 3-4 because that's the system they came from. But what about the rest? Or how most likely can convert?



If you go back to the first couple pages there is a lot of discussion about that. I think we are very close. A good NT, OLB and ILB away. Easily could be converted after the draft and FA.


So basically we lack 3 of the most important positions in a 3-4 defense, but we're real close to being a good one?

Also when did Casey play in a 3-4?


We have guys who could play NT. I think a true NT would be better obviously. I would like McCullers in the draft. We could easily draft an OLB in the draft and sign a LB in FA. Not a hard transition to make.
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Chocolateman78


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We need a good NT, not just any. It's not like its super easy to find the pass rushing OLB's to fit the scheme either. not every rookie OLB is Clay Matthews or Aldon Smith.

Also without a 3rd round pick it makes this even harder to project.
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TitanSS


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2014 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We do not have an acceptable NT on the team.

If we could find a top notch NT the rest of the pieces are there. Wimbley can start at OLB as well as Ayers. Bring in a veteran to compete with them.

As with anyone you never know how they are going to transition into a 3-4 scheme, but you won't know until you try.

I think Casey and Pitotua would make great 3-4 DEs, but there is a reason I'm a fan and not a scout or a coach.

Brown along with Fokou and whoever else we bring in would compete for the ILB roles.

The only real need on offense once (presumably) CJ and Stewart are gone will be RT and RB. RB can be addressed easily and Stingly or Otto can play RT. There is no need to add anything else to our offense, because the only thing holding our offense back is Jake Locker. You can put anyone else you want on our offense and noone is going to make a bit of difference if Locker doesn't improve.

The fact that the offense is set with playmakers and quality starters makes it an great time to start drafting defense.

There are a lot of pieces to put together and a lot of pieces that are going to have to relearn their position, but I don't think we are in any worse of a situation to switch to a 3-4 than GB, HOU, or IND was when they recently made the switch.
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Chocolateman78


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 2:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Think of every dominant 3-4 defense you've ever watched. They all have excellent NT's
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lamont


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BJ Raji in Green Bay is a free agent this year. He has fell off since their Super Bowl year, but he maybe an option at NT in free agency?
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ttitansfan4life


Joined: 30 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chocolateman78 wrote:
Think of every dominant 3-4 defense you've ever watched. They all have excellent NT's


I agree NTs are very important in a 3-4 but your statements is so not true. There has been plenty of elite 3-4 Ds without great NTs. Houston hasn't had a good NT. Earl Mitchell and Shaun Cody Laughing Nothing special. Also before Ngata switched to NT, they had Terrence Cody who sucks. Before that they had Kelly Gregg who was slightly above average. Nothing great or excellent as you say. Jets this year had a solid NT is Harrison but not excellent. KC has Poe who had a great year but even Chiefs fans say he fell off towards the end of the year. Steelers haven't had a good NT since Hampton left but they're still a good D. Plenty examples where not having a "excellent" NT and you can still be great. You can say those teams had better supporting staffs but no one knows how good our D will be until they start playing. Hell for all we know Casey could be our NT next year and excels at it. Or he moves outside and does damn good or he fails miserably. Now Ray Horton during his tenure as a DC has had some pretty good NTs so maybe it's a need for his defense.
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TitanSlim


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So do you guys think Derrick Morgan will put on some weight to become an 3-4 end or drop some pounds to become a LB?
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VY


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanSlim wrote:
So do you guys think Derrick Morgan will put on some weight to become an 3-4 end or drop some pounds to become a LB?


Even if he did drop weight that probably isn't going to help him... Doubt he has much ability to cover a TE. I'd think DE for sure, an maybe situational OLB on an obvious pass rush
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-Hope-


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure moving Brown to ILB is the best idea. He was at his best rushing the passer this year. I think he's worth a go at OLB.
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ttitansfan4life


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TitanSlim wrote:
So do you guys think Derrick Morgan will put on some weight to become an 3-4 end or drop some pounds to become a LB?


I think he needs to add like 5-10LBs but I think he's perfect for DE. He's not explosive as he used to be before the injury but he's still gets consistent pressure and holds the point of attack.
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UTMoc10


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ttitansfan4life wrote:
TitanSlim wrote:
So do you guys think Derrick Morgan will put on some weight to become an 3-4 end or drop some pounds to become a LB?


I think he needs to add like 5-10LBs but I think he's perfect for DE. He's not explosive as he used to be before the injury but he's still gets consistent pressure and holds the point of attack.


Agreed. Put 10 lbs on him and he'll be a good 3-4 DE. Holds his own and is good against the run.

As for the NT talk, I agree again. Ton's of teams have a good 3-4 defense without an elite NT. Plus with the many different looks Horton's D gives I don't think an elite NT is necessary sure it would help but not necessary. There are options in the draft. Nix, McCullers, Justin Ellis, Daquan Jones.
There are a couple FA options, too in Aubrayo Franklin and Terrance Cody. We have options on the team like i've said before.

There are a lot of good 3-4 OLB in the draft shouldn't be hard to find one if that's the route we want to go. Barr and Mack could be there at #11. Trade back and get Murphy in the 1st. Wait till the 2nd and get KVN. Marcus Smith isn't a big name but he will be there in the 2nd or 3rd. I like Jeffcoat in the 3rd or 4th. Jeremiah Attaochu is another guy who I think is underrated and will be in the 2nd or 3rd.

We don't have a 3rd round pick right now but a trade from #11 to #18 would be enough to give us a 3rd round pick at the top of the round.
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