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Lil' Shorty 2014 Mock Offseason 1.0
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7488
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.
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djw4bucs


Joined: 22 Apr 2013
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.

Carr is Glennon 2.0
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7488
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djw4bucs wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.

Carr is Glennon 2.0


And why is that?
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deuces22wild


Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 8693
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.


What does the round he was drafted have to do with anything?

You never commented when I brought it up earlier, you don't factor his surroundings this season?

You commented from the tape and articles you've read that receivers were open yet you wouldn't pass on Watkins. Seeing as we need help in other areas that almost seems like a wasted pick then no, or at least one that can be better used on a different position.

Given everything that happened this year you would of excepted Carr to put up 23 tds - 7 int and lead us to a top 20 offense under the same circumstances?
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ChaoticBuc3125


Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 1713
Location: From Boston, MA ... Hate Pats and rest of NFCS GO Bucs!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djw4bucs wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.

Carr is Glennon 2.0


How so? One is athletic with quick release one is not..
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Lil' Shorty


Joined: 23 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

deuces22wild wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.


What does the round he was drafted have to do with anything?

You never commented when I brought it up earlier, you don't factor his surroundings this season?

You commented from the tape and articles you've read that receivers were open yet you wouldn't pass on Watkins. Seeing as we need help in other areas that almost seems like a wasted pick then no, or at least one that can be better used on a different position.

Given everything that happened this year you would of excepted Carr to put up 23 tds - 7 int and lead us to a top 20 offense under the same circumstances?

Ill answer that. Carr would of put up similar numbers, maybe a little better or maybe a lot worse. I'd say Glennon made the best of the cards he was delt. Is he the franchise QB, my gut says no, but I would take a chance on Bridgewater or Manziel without a question. Bortles I'm really not sold on and I feel he is just one of those QBs with a big arm that gets his draft status escalated due to potential. Not a fan of that after seeing Freeman here for so long. Also, Detroit will never win a SB or be a threat with Stafford cuz he is a big arm QB that still to this day has not lived up to the hype of his potential. Carr on the other had would be a 3rd round pick in next years draft when there is some really good QB talent that will most likely enter the draft, and you want to pick him top 10 or top 20 in this years draft. Whoever is foolish enough to do that will regret it for at least 3 or 4 years.
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djw4bucs


Joined: 22 Apr 2013
Posts: 3608
Location: Pawnee, Indiana
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChaoticBuc3125 wrote:
djw4bucs wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.

Carr is Glennon 2.0


How so? One is athletic with quick release one is not..

Yes Glennon is not a Mobile but that is the only defrence would you spend #7 on him
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canadabuccaneer


Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Posts: 889
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

djw4bucs wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.

Carr is Glennon 2.0


Laughing
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 7488
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lil' Shorty wrote:
deuces22wild wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
Dueces glennon was a 3rd round pick in one of the weakest qb classes. Glennon engineered the 32nd ranked offense who had tons of help from the defense.

Glennon is replaceable. I think there are late first /early 2nd round prospect qbs in this draft that can come in and beat glennon out.

I'm saying 7th overall, if teddy , bortles and JF are there I'm taking either one.

If Watkins and Carr are there I'm going to have a hard time passing up Watkins bc I like Carr but not as much as the other 3.

And yes I'd take Carr over Glennon. I think we can trade down for Carr bc quite frankly I don't see him going top 10.


What does the round he was drafted have to do with anything?

You never commented when I brought it up earlier, you don't factor his surroundings this season?

You commented from the tape and articles you've read that receivers were open yet you wouldn't pass on Watkins. Seeing as we need help in other areas that almost seems like a wasted pick then no, or at least one that can be better used on a different position.

Given everything that happened this year you would of excepted Carr to put up 23 tds - 7 int and lead us to a top 20 offense under the same circumstances?

Ill answer that. Carr would of put up similar numbers, maybe a little better or maybe a lot worse. I'd say Glennon made the best of the cards he was delt. Is he the franchise QB, my gut says no, but I would take a chance on Bridgewater or Manziel without a question. Bortles I'm really not sold on and I feel he is just one of those QBs with a big arm that gets his draft status escalated due to potential. Not a fan of that after seeing Freeman here for so long. Also, Detroit will never win a SB or be a threat with Stafford cuz he is a big arm QB that still to this day has not lived up to the hype of his potential. Carr on the other had would be a 3rd round pick in next years draft when there is some really good QB talent that will most likely enter the draft, and you want to pick him top 10 or top 20 in this years draft. Whoever is foolish enough to do that will regret it for at least 3 or 4 years.


Hm I understand your concerns with bortles but I actually like his accuracy and ball placement. His footwork needs refinement. He's shown the clutch factor. Like that in him. Mobile in the pocket.
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tscott20


Joined: 03 Jan 2014
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carr's not a guy who should go top ten and I don't think he's a top three QB prospect in his draft. He's got a laser arm with solid size and athleticism. But I think people fall in love with his physical traits and see his box score, and they think he's a sure thing. He has potential, but he plays in a system that doesn't ask their WRs to run many pro style routes and throws a ton of quick passes behind the LOS. His prescence and ability in the pocket really concern me, and I think he has a little ways to go with his ball placement. I think he's more talented than Glennon and has a higher ceiling, but I'm not sold he'll end up being better and I'm doubtful either will ever be a franchise guy.

Glennon did as good of a job in his situation last season as you could have wished. He's a smart guy and he was pro ready. He is a good decision maker, has solid accuracy, mature guy, operates solidly in the pocketů but I don't know how much more he can improve. He's quick to check down, I don't like his deep ball accuracy, not the best under pressure. I think he's a good spot starter and great backup. But I don't think he'll ever be close to being more than the 4th best QB in our division, and I don't see that making us a playoff contender regularly.

I am fine with Glennon getting a chance next season if we cannot find a guy who we are confident is better. Even if we draft a QB early, I'm totally fine with him getting a chance to compete for the job and play. But I just don't think it is smart to count on Glennon to be much more than he already is.
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mfw096


Joined: 11 Feb 2007
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Location: UNLV
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

With all this Glennon versus Manziel versus Carr talk...


Where would you rate Glennon this year if he was coming into the nfl?

Teddy
Manziel
Bortles
Carr
McCarron
Smith
Glennon
Mettenberger
Boyd
Murray
Morris

Don't get me wrong I like Glennon, but for just thinking outside the box about this and if he was to enter the nfl draft with these prospects he would be at high the number 5 QB or even number 8 taking in this years draft.

I just see so much more potential in these other QB's then what we got in Glennon.

Therefore if we can get Manziel I would be in love with that pick because he to me isn't that far behind Teddy anyways and could end up being the best QB in this draft as is.

Just my opinion and thoughts...
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DaRealdeal


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
DaRealdeal wrote:
REDandPEWTER wrote:
DaRealdeal wrote:
I don't think missing on a first round QB sets a team back that far anymore these days. With the rookie wage scale in place it actually makes it easier for teams to take chances on QBs in the first round. All you really spend now are the draft pick (possibly picks if you trade up) and the time developing/letting them start. If you don't have your unquestioned franchise QB I think that's a worthwhile investment.

I like this offseason. I don't necessarily agree with the trade up for Manziel, mostly because I like Carr more, but I appreciate the aggressiveness.


In Freeman's 5 years, 3-13, 10-6, 4-12 , 7-9 and 0-3 before our back up finished 4-9.

Currently we are out of position to get a qb. We either ride with a qb that led 32nd ranked offense or get a polished one.

I'm watching the playoffs and wow does glennon have a ways to go to even get us close.

I'm not sure what you are arguing here...

Do you think we are worse off now then when we drafted Freeman? I don't think so. In the 60 games that Freeman started we were 24-36. What did we do in the 60 games prior to Freeman starting? 26-34. Drafting Freeman didn't really set this franchise back. We just sort of treaded water.

Since when is the 7th overall pick out of position to get a QB?


So you're saying Houston , Jacksonville Cleveland and Oakland all picking top 5 don't need one?

And yes it did set us back. Bc when bridgewater , bortles and Manziel go 1 , 3 and 4 , do you take Carr at 7? I'm not sure. I like him a lot and think he's good fit with Tedford but I'd prefer the other 3.

Um, no, I'm not saying that at all. However, each of those teams would need to actually draft a QB with their pick for us to be out of luck. Not only that, but at the 7th overall pick if we wanted to move up it would be much less expensive to do so then it will be in the future as our record improves. Lovie won't be in a better position to draft a QB with a top draft pick than he is this year.

Freeman went 0-3 as a starter this year. How did that set us back? It made our draft position better.

And yes, if Bridgewater, Bortles and Manziel went 1, 3, and 4, I would take Carr at 7 and run.
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96BucsBallin


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To elaborate on my post I would rather pick a starter with the #7 pick this year and give Glennon a year under Tedford to see if he can develop. Worst case scenario, we have Winston/Mariota throwing to Watkins/Ebron/Lee next year or we have a stronger defense with Mack/Barr/Murphy. If there is one year the fans and owners will give Lovie a pass on winning it would be year one.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 7:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

96BucsBallin wrote:
To elaborate on my post I would rather pick a starter with the #7 pick this year and give Glennon a year under Tedford to see if he can develop. Worst case scenario, we have Winston/Mariota throwing to Watkins/Ebron/Lee next year or we have a stronger defense with Mack/Barr/Murphy. If there is one year the fans and owners will give Lovie a pass on winning it would be year one.


I can't argue with your assessment. One would think if we build around glennon and he stinks we HOPE to just land a Winston or Mariotta. Maybe Hundley after another year under his belt.

However the glazers look at all of the money sunk into this franchise the past 2 offseasons. They want ROI. They brought in a vet. Head coach to win now. They failed rebuild 101 and 102 with Dom/Raheem and Dom/schiano.

They may make the move to go all in on a franchise qb this year. I wouldn't be surprised.
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96BucsBallin


Joined: 03 Jan 2012
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2014 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

REDandPEWTER wrote:
96BucsBallin wrote:
To elaborate on my post I would rather pick a starter with the #7 pick this year and give Glennon a year under Tedford to see if he can develop. Worst case scenario, we have Winston/Mariota throwing to Watkins/Ebron/Lee next year or we have a stronger defense with Mack/Barr/Murphy. If there is one year the fans and owners will give Lovie a pass on winning it would be year one.


I can't argue with your assessment. One would think if we build around glennon and he stinks we HOPE to just land a Winston or Mariotta. Maybe Hundley after another year under his belt.

However the glazers look at all of the money sunk into this franchise the past 2 offseasons. They want ROI. They brought in a vet. Head coach to win now. They failed rebuild 101 and 102 with Dom/Raheem and Dom/schiano.

They may make the move to go all in on a franchise qb this year. I wouldn't be surprised.


I can definitely see that outcome as well. I just hope we don't give up a lot of potential players for a QB who I believe will be injury prone. If he falls to us at 7 and that's the way they want to go I would fully support it.
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