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Brandon Pettigrew's overlooked ability
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CutParisLenon


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 636
Location: Mid-Michigan
PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 2:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


There's a lot of good in this post. Applause
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detfan782004


Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference
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CutParisLenon


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.
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detfan782004


Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering
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CutParisLenon


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
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Location: Mid-Michigan
PostPosted: Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)
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SuhPLEX


Joined: 03 Jan 2012
Posts: 1160
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

I agree with you too, for the most part. I think Grew is serviceable, and as long as he doesn't keep having critical drops/fumbles he is a positive in our offense. I would love to resign him as a high-end TE2, and hopefully bring someone in to be a dynamic pass-catching TE1.
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diehardlionfan wrote:


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TL-TwoWinsAway


Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SuhPLEX wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

He ignored YPC, which showed that Pettigrew's is significantly lower. That supported the argument that he isn't utilized as a downfield weapon, but more of a short-yardage option.

Pettigrew plays nearly every snap this week (somewhere around 70 per game), and may see 5 targets. He spends a considerable portion of the rest of those snaps blocking. He's clearly a blocking TE who is utilized as a short-yardage receiving option.
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CutParisLenon


Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 636
Location: Mid-Michigan
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
SuhPLEX wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

He ignored YPC, which showed that Pettigrew's is significantly lower. That supported the argument that he isn't utilized as a downfield weapon, but more of a short-yardage option.

Pettigrew plays nearly every snap this week (somewhere around 70 per game), and may see 5 targets. He spends a considerable portion of the rest of those snaps blocking. He's clearly a blocking TE who is utilized as a short-yardage receiving option.


It's really easy to undervalue a guy like that. TEs only get credit when they catch the ball and many people do not realize that TEs can play a blue collar role in an offense and make a significant difference.
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TL-TwoWinsAway


Joined: 19 Feb 2008
Posts: 27387
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CutParisLenon wrote:
TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
SuhPLEX wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

He ignored YPC, which showed that Pettigrew's is significantly lower. That supported the argument that he isn't utilized as a downfield weapon, but more of a short-yardage option.

Pettigrew plays nearly every snap this week (somewhere around 70 per game), and may see 5 targets. He spends a considerable portion of the rest of those snaps blocking. He's clearly a blocking TE who is utilized as a short-yardage receiving option.


It's really easy to undervalue a guy like that. TEs only get credit when they catch the ball and many people do not realize that TEs can play a blue collar role in an offense and make a significant difference.

I don't disagree at all: I think it's a very valuable role, which is why I understood the pick. If he leaves, his impact will be missed (by those willing to admit it).
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TL-TwoWinsAway


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pettigrew practicing today with a brace on his knee.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
Pettigrew practicing today with a brace on his knee.


Hopefully it's not a big issue. He may not be Gronk in the passing game, but he does add quite a bit as a blocker. If he can't be as effective it could hurt more than most realize.
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detfan782004


Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 57792
Location: Omaha
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
SuhPLEX wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

He ignored YPC, which showed that Pettigrew's is significantly lower. That supported the argument that he isn't utilized as a downfield weapon, but more of a short-yardage option.

Pettigrew plays nearly every snap this week (somewhere around 70 per game), and may see 5 targets. He spends a considerable portion of the rest of those snaps blocking. He's clearly a blocking TE who is utilized as a short-yardage receiving option.


Listed YPC and they are on par last three years
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SuhPLEX


Joined: 03 Jan 2012
Posts: 1160
PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TL-TwoWinsAway wrote:
SuhPLEX wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
detfan782004 wrote:
CutParisLenon wrote:
I think people have been waiting to write off Grew since he got here. People were upset with players like Vontae Davis, Michael Oher, and Percy Harvin still on the board and they have been waiting to be vindicated. I think that's why there is so much criticism.

I thought he was atrocious last year. You could tell by the end of the year he was too banged up to play, but his games against the Titans and Chicago were inexcusably bad.

However, outside of last year, he has been a really good TE. He does a lot of things really well, whether it's receiving down field, on screens, or blocking. DetFan, the great Grew hater, is the same guy who compared him to Tony Gonzales and Jason Witten in a previous thread.While I won't go that far, he is a solid all around player who does enough well to make everyone's job a lot easier. We should really appreciate Grew for what he is, not what he isn't. He isn't Jimmy Graham, but he is a more than serviceable receiver who understands the offense, can catch the ball on screens, is a big target in the redzone, and has above average blocking ability. I really hope we resign him, because I think we'd see a big void in the offense with him gone.


My comparison was how he is utilized in terms of receiving TE. I fit not compare talent level. HUGE difference


I still think some of the comparisons were pretty flattering. Perhaps unwittingly so, but flattering none the less.



I guess if comparing similar numbers equals flattering


It does when those numbers belong to future hall of famers! (at least Gonzales, maybe Witten)

To be fair, the context of the argument was that Grew is a receiving TE. Detfan was on the side saying that he is a receiving TE, and compared numbers to other TE's who everyone would agree are receiving TE's. The numbers were eerily similar.

I don't like his style of debate, but the argument he posed was a strong one.

He ignored YPC, which showed that Pettigrew's is significantly lower. That supported the argument that he isn't utilized as a downfield weapon, but more of a short-yardage option.

Pettigrew plays nearly every snap this week (somewhere around 70 per game), and may see 5 targets. He spends a considerable portion of the rest of those snaps blocking. He's clearly a blocking TE who is utilized as a short-yardage receiving option.

He isn't a "receiving TE" because he lacks the skills to be one, I don't understand your argument

It's more kudos to the Lions for not putting Grew in a position to fail
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detfan782004 wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:


When I die I want the Lions to be pallbearers so they can let me down one more time.


No thanks

They would fumble my casket
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TL-TwoWinsAway


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 20, 2013 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SuhPLEX wrote:
He isn't a "receiving TE" because he lacks the skills to be one, I don't understand your argument

It's more kudos to the Lions for not putting Grew in a position to fail

My argument is that Pettigrew is utilized more as a blocker than a receiver, and is a better blocker than receiver, therefore calling him a "receiving TE" isn't accurate.

For clarity: this is the comment detfan made that I had a problem with, and that started this entire conversation.
detfan782004 wrote:
He is a receiving TE who simply did not do anything in entire second half.

He "didn't do anything" because he didn't have any receptions, despite the fact that he excelled at blocking during that half. detfan's reasoning: he's a receiving TE, and he didn't make any catches, therefore he didn't contribute. I disagreed with that: he blocked, which is one of his main responsibilities. Calling him a "receiving TE" really discounts his impact as a blocker.
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