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Jonathan Martin AWOL!!!
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dolphinologist


Joined: 07 Mar 2007
Posts: 5553
Location: New York
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ViolentMonk71 wrote:
Good lord....

Some of you make me laugh....

First....we don't know what the "bullying" is The dline spent the last few weeks referring to Cam Wake as Derrick because he wasn't playing as good as they thought....can we say Wake was bullied? Guys got up from the lunch table and he throw a fit and goes home to mommy....please. Dude is a 6'5" 300 pound professional athlete. This guy is just a weak individual that had no place in the NFL...sorry I ever defending the punk.


If he was playing well, you would leave room for the possibility that this has been going on for nearly 2 years. Everybody's opinion about off field issues are based upon on the field play. You have seen for years how sensitive posters are when you disagree with them. And there is zero pressure here. So imagine the pressure in that environment. Why are they joking around and acting like they are in elementary school in the midst of a 4 game losing streak ? You wouldn't call him a weak individual if he was playing well and responded that same way.
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MDolphins2399


Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 394
Location: Austin, TX
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to Jeff darlington on twitter. Martin isn't expected to return to the team any time soon and he is dealing with personal issues with his family that have nothing to do with "bullying"....


That either sounds like a cover up or I have no idea what's going on here at all. hahaha
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
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Location: Gainesville, FL
PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tony7188 wrote:
Martin could have reacted in two ways. Either he walks away from this bullying, or he starts fist fighting his teammates. I think he made the more adult decision.


Or:

3. He talks to the ones doing the bullying
4. He talks to the coaches

Walking away from a football team mid-season is by far the dumbest of the 4 options. ESPECIALLY when the team is having major OL issues as it is.

One source has said team talked to Martin about a move to OG. None of these things bode well for his future.

Martin is gone by next season. Soft on the field and can't handle the ups and downs mentally. Another blown 2nd round pick. Good luck in med school, champ.

I also doubt we even attempt to resign Richie despite him having a decent season. Too much national attention on him now and the team has been trying to replace both him and Jerry (unsuccessfully) for the past couple seasons.

Pouncey and McKinnie (wow) may be the only returning starters.
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Mercury22


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
Tony7188 wrote:
Martin could have reacted in two ways. Either he walks away from this bullying, or he starts fist fighting his teammates. I think he made the more adult decision.


Or:

3. He talks to the ones doing the bullying
4. He talks to the coaches


Or he talks to the teams Human Resource department and file a complaint.

Then again, he may have done all of these things. We don't know. What I do know is that the incident reported is hardly a reason to leave the team for an extended period of time. There either has to be much more to the story (which is what i would guess) or Martin is softer than anyone suspected. I somehow doubt its Martin, but its hard to say with limited info.

Bottom line, I believe this team lacks leadership. Leadership shuts this kind of crap down.
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green4gulf


Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2103
Location: TN, by way of Palm Beach FL
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dolphinologist wrote:
ViolentMonk71 wrote:
Good lord....

Some of you make me laugh....

First....we don't know what the "bullying" is The dline spent the last few weeks referring to Cam Wake as Derrick because he wasn't playing as good as they thought....can we say Wake was bullied? Guys got up from the lunch table and he throw a fit and goes home to mommy....please. Dude is a 6'5" 300 pound professional athlete. This guy is just a weak individual that had no place in the NFL...sorry I ever defending the punk.


If he was playing well, you would leave room for the possibility that this has been going on for nearly 2 years. Everybody's opinion about off field issues are based upon on the field play. You have seen for years how sensitive posters are when you disagree with them. And there is zero pressure here. So imagine the pressure in that environment. Why are they joking around and acting like they are in elementary school in the midst of a 4 game losing streak ? You wouldn't call him a weak individual if he was playing well and responded that same way.


I know you're a big Martin supporter, and while I am not I would have loved for him to prove me wrong and throughout the preseason I was getting excited that he would. While he hasn't been perfect this season, I thought that he showed some solid improvement and at times looked very solid.

All that being said, people with great character and intestinal fortitude always find something to laugh at in the face of danger and immense stress, and it's usually their team mates or friends. I don't know the details of what is going on in our locker room, but From what I know right now I have a hard time accepting Martins reaction.

I will add that I'm viewing Philbin in a different light since this incident. His response and reaction towards the team will say a lot about him throughout the rest of this season.
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SUG


Joined: 15 May 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, clearly I have not been a big Martin supporter on the field but ...

I support Martins reaction, it's perfectly normal for the love of Jobe!
I'd be pissed too .

We all know these guys get abused, battered, beaten & here every slight about the Moms & sisters. Smack is simply part of the game.
But to get that from your own teammates after struggling in his second yr & getting
demoted to RT !!!

That is some BS right there, sorry but you just don't do that, WRONG !
Hey "teamate how bad you gonna suck next Sunday" ...

sug
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Tony7188


Joined: 02 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
Tony7188 wrote:
Martin could have reacted in two ways. Either he walks away from this bullying, or he starts fist fighting his teammates. I think he made the more adult decision.


Or:

3. He talks to the ones doing the bullying
4. He talks to the coaches

Walking away from a football team mid-season is by far the dumbest of the 4 options. ESPECIALLY when the team is having major OL issues as it is.


When you are fed up and are mad as hell you don't think straight. While I agree that he could have handled things better, after the constant personal insults he probably said eff it and just walked out. I would think fist fighting your teammates (just because they decided to sit at another table) would be the dumbest out of the options because it shows you are easily rattled. It takes strength to be able to take the high road.

As for 3, I seriously doubt if Martin just stood there and took the "bullying" without saying anything to the players, but (as anyone knows who played a organized sport) it probably just made things worse.

As for #4, If what has been reported is true, the coaches had to have known this stuff was going on. It's on the coaches to make sure stuff like this doesn't happen, not Martin. Martin shouldn't have to run to a coach and tell them that he's getting picked on... Laughing
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Maddogg


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Dolphins have released a statement , IMO typical corporate talking points that actually say nothing.


http://www.miamidolphins.com/news/press-releases/article-1/Miami-Dolphins-Statement-On-Jonathan-Martin/4d417b72-ad82-4ec9-8ce2-1ce6d2a560b2
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coach4fu


Joined: 19 Sep 2012
Posts: 101
PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What makes you think he didn't talk to the ones doing the bullying and/or the coaches? Perhaps his leaving the team had more to do with his mental well being than if the team was having major OL issues. If this story is true, perhaps his OL teammates should have done more to help him if the team was in such dire OL shape.

cddolphin wrote:
Tony7188 wrote:
Martin could have reacted in two ways. Either he walks away from this bullying, or he starts fist fighting his teammates. I think he made the more adult decision.


Or:

3. He talks to the ones doing the bullying
4. He talks to the coaches

Walking away from a football team mid-season is by far the dumbest of the 4 options. ESPECIALLY when the team is having major OL issues as it is.

One source has said team talked to Martin about a move to OG. None of these things bode well for his future.

Martin is gone by next season. Soft on the field and can't handle the ups and downs mentally. Another blown 2nd round pick. Good luck in med school, champ.

I also doubt we even attempt to resign Richie despite him having a decent season. Too much national attention on him now and the team has been trying to replace both him and Jerry (unsuccessfully) for the past couple seasons.

Pouncey and McKinnie (wow) may be the only returning starters.
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Dropkick_pride


Joined: 18 Jan 2009
Posts: 10805
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bpastermack wrote:
I am ashamed to call myself a Miami Dolphins fan. I also now have some of my first legitimate questions about Joe Philbin as a head coach of the Miami Dolphins. I played football in college. This wasn't even professional football. This was college when players are still immature and unprofessional. This sort of thing would NEVER have happened where I played. If it would have the players involved would be dealt with from day one. We were a football team. We had each others backs. If someone else picked on them, then we had his back. Even if we thought he was a strange guy. He sweat and bled with us!

I'm disgusted, and this explains everything. Now I know why we can't finish football games. Now I know why we are so susceptible to huge momentum swings. Now I know why our O-line is not in sync. It all makes perfect sense now. If I am on that O-line, then I'm not giving 110 percent on every play for a bunch of guys I could give a rats butt about. Guys I had actually grown to despise. Guys I don't even respect. This honestly explains everything, and I'm questioning whether I even care about the rest of the season.

How could I root for a team I don't even respect? This team is a LONG way from being competitive enough to make it to the super bowl, because they obviously have a systemic problem that goes way beyond talent and they obviously have gotten rid of most of their leaders who were grown men and professionals and it shows.

Incognito made have learned to control his emotions a little more, but obviously he never stood up in this situation and it sounds like probably joined in so, he is not fit to be a leader on this team. How could you go out and tell the media that you are doing everything you can to get better and the O-line should be fired if they don't, when you are completely alienating the guy next to you? How does that make the O-line better?

Pouncy? He is supremely talented, but let's face it. This is the same knucklehead who wore the "FREE HERNANDEZ" hat. He has even been questioned as a possible witness and may even have connections to the double homicide. I'm sorry, but anyone who chooses to even associate with a guy like Arron Hernandez outside of the football world has huge red flags in my mind. The guy was a total thug, who had no regard for other people or even the sanctity of human life. Say what you want about his guilt or innocence. Just read about some of the ways he treated his own teammates.

If this is what the NFL is about on most teams, then thank god I was never big enough to make it to that level. I'd rather sit at my desk and work with real people who have brains and hearts and are more mature than a 10 year old at recess. I would have been grossly disappointed if this is par for the course on teams.

I also now question Tannehill. He had to have seen this stuff going on and obviously did little to nothing to put an end to it as the leader of the football team. His job should have been to make sure all the players respected each other and were unified with a single cause. That doesn't appear to have been taking place.



A lot of good stuff in this post... I applaud you for being one of the few to stand up strongly and say it. As a former college player, former college asst. coach, and current HS head coach, I find this type of behavior abhorrent. Any case of bullying on one of my teams would be handled immediately and with severe consequences to those offending players (and coaches!). There is no place for this type of behavior.

Dealing with something like this mid season is a complete mess.... Hopefully the Dolphins and Martin and able to resolve these issues quickly and move on in a positive direction.
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patdt13


Joined: 10 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bpastermack wrote:
I am ashamed to call myself a Miami Dolphins fan. I also now have some of my first legitimate questions about Joe Philbin as a head coach of the Miami Dolphins. I played football in college. This wasn't even professional football. This was college when players are still immature and unprofessional. This sort of thing would NEVER have happened where I played. If it would have the players involved would be dealt with from day one. We were a football team. We had each others backs. If someone else picked on them, then we had his back. Even if we thought he was a strange guy. He sweat and bled with us!

I'm disgusted, and this explains everything. Now I know why we can't finish football games. Now I know why we are so susceptible to huge momentum swings. Now I know why our O-line is not in sync. It all makes perfect sense now. If I am on that O-line, then I'm not giving 110 percent on every play for a bunch of guys I could give a rats butt about. Guys I had actually grown to despise. Guys I don't even respect. This honestly explains everything, and I'm questioning whether I even care about the rest of the season.

How could I root for a team I don't even respect? This team is a LONG way from being competitive enough to make it to the super bowl, because they obviously have a systemic problem that goes way beyond talent and they obviously have gotten rid of most of their leaders who were grown men and professionals and it shows.

Incognito made have learned to control his emotions a little more, but obviously he never stood up in this situation and it sounds like probably joined in so, he is not fit to be a leader on this team. How could you go out and tell the media that you are doing everything you can to get better and the O-line should be fired if they don't, when you are completely alienating the guy next to you? How does that make the O-line better?

Pouncy? He is supremely talented, but let's face it. This is the same knucklehead who wore the "FREE HERNANDEZ" hat. He has even been questioned as a possible witness and may even have connections to the double homicide. I'm sorry, but anyone who chooses to even associate with a guy like Arron Hernandez outside of the football world has huge red flags in my mind. The guy was a total thug, who had no regard for other people or even the sanctity of human life. Say what you want about his guilt or innocence. Just read about some of the ways he treated his own teammates.

If this is what the NFL is about on most teams, then thank god I was never big enough to make it to that level. I'd rather sit at my desk and work with real people who have brains and hearts and are more mature than a 10 year old at recess. I would have been grossly disappointed if this is par for the course on teams.

I also now question Tannehill. He had to have seen this stuff going on and obviously did little to nothing to put an end to it as the leader of the football team. His job should have been to make sure all the players respected each other and were unified with a single cause. That doesn't appear to have been taking place.



Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause
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Atari-XXX


Joined: 16 Jul 2008
Posts: 1890
PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adam Beasley tweeted some interesting stuff.

https://twitter.com/AdamHBeasley
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WaterBear56


Joined: 26 Jul 2010
Posts: 3107
PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atari-XXX wrote:
Adam Beasley tweeted some interesting stuff.

https://twitter.com/AdamHBeasley


No wonder our players are having career years elsewhere. They had no passion for this team and I don't blame them. This is becoming a joke and I'm completely for making a statement and firing the entire oline at the end of the season if this is true. At the same time, I can only imagine the things being made up by "sources" just to get coverage. Regardless, the culture of this team needs to change big time.

Tradition or not, this behavior is unacceptable.
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ovaw8lover


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bpastermack wrote:
I am ashamed to call myself a Miami Dolphins fan. I also now have some of my first legitimate questions about Joe Philbin as a head coach of the Miami Dolphins. I played football in college. This wasn't even professional football. This was college when players are still immature and unprofessional. This sort of thing would NEVER have happened where I played. If it would have the players involved would be dealt with from day one. We were a football team. We had each others backs. If someone else picked on them, then we had his back. Even if we thought he was a strange guy. He sweat and bled with us!

I'm disgusted, and this explains everything. Now I know why we can't finish football games. Now I know why we are so susceptible to huge momentum swings. Now I know why our O-line is not in sync. It all makes perfect sense now. If I am on that O-line, then I'm not giving 110 percent on every play for a bunch of guys I could give a rats butt about. Guys I had actually grown to despise. Guys I don't even respect. This honestly explains everything, and I'm questioning whether I even care about the rest of the season.

How could I root for a team I don't even respect? This team is a LONG way from being competitive enough to make it to the super bowl, because they obviously have a systemic problem that goes way beyond talent and they obviously have gotten rid of most of their leaders who were grown men and professionals and it shows.

Incognito made have learned to control his emotions a little more, but obviously he never stood up in this situation and it sounds like probably joined in so, he is not fit to be a leader on this team. How could you go out and tell the media that you are doing everything you can to get better and the O-line should be fired if they don't, when you are completely alienating the guy next to you? How does that make the O-line better?

Pouncy? He is supremely talented, but let's face it. This is the same knucklehead who wore the "FREE HERNANDEZ" hat. He has even been questioned as a possible witness and may even have connections to the double homicide. I'm sorry, but anyone who chooses to even associate with a guy like Arron Hernandez outside of the football world has huge red flags in my mind. The guy was a total thug, who had no regard for other people or even the sanctity of human life. Say what you want about his guilt or innocence. Just read about some of the ways he treated his own teammates.

If this is what the NFL is about on most teams, then thank god I was never big enough to make it to that level. I'd rather sit at my desk and work with real people who have brains and hearts and are more mature than a 10 year old at recess. I would have been grossly disappointed if this is par for the course on teams.

I also now question Tannehill. He had to have seen this stuff going on and obviously did little to nothing to put an end to it as the leader of the football team. His job should have been to make sure all the players respected each other and were unified with a single cause. That doesn't appear to have been taking place.


I am only ashamed to call my self a Dolfan because they lose. This does give us some insight into why the line is out of sorts; however, unlike you I am not placing this at the feet of Philbin. I like some of you have also played college football and name calling, "bullying", cliquish behavior are all a fundamental part of playing football. If you were different you got teased. Sorry if that is tough for some of you to hear but that is the reality of the matter. This is exactly why a openly gay player will never be on a NFL roster. He would be tormented and treated differently.

For a team that have offensive line issues this distraction serves as a reason why Martin and Incognito has struggled in tandem. This also brings to light why Incognito wanted Jake Long back. My guess is they were kindred spirits. This is what I know, Martin will find it difficult to continue playing in the NFL in light of these allegations. Players, including the ones on the Fins, will respect him moving forward. As of this point Martin has not filled a grievance for fear of the backlash. He is right. His best move is to retire from the NFL. I know that sounds harsh but he will always be the elephant in the room whatever team he is on. First of all his play is mediocre at best plus you add in the label of being emotionally sensitive. I often say football is 90% mental and 10% physical. Mental encompasses self-image or how you feel people perceive you.

Incognito will not be harmed by this. He is a bully, tough guy and dirty player. Those types of guys are welcomed on teams. Sure, you hate going up against them but if they can perform they are welcomed into the team.

More than likely this is what will happen:
1. Incognito will be cut (during the season but most likely in the offseason)
2. Martin will be placed on non-football injury list

Philbin will get the blame for this but he is not the problem. He can preach team, team, team all he wants but if players do not respect or like the other for whatever reason he cannot bridge that gap. Here is another fact. Strugis was shunned by Carpenter, Denney and the punter at the beginning of the season as well. Philbin could not do anything about that. This is not a knock on Philbin or shows a lack of leadership on his part. If that is the case the Harbaugh (Ravens) is also not a leader because the strip bus incident occurred on his watch as well.

Does a tree make a sound if no one is around? My point in bringing this up is this behavior happens all the time but you seldom hear of it because the player usually is man enough to handle it. Name calling and groups form based on mutual likes. This is falls on Ireland as he is the one responsible for bringing in all these players. When you are hired for a job often times the interviewee is measured by their ability to work well within the team. Ireland did not do this and that is why the drafting of Sturgis without the release of Carpenter and the signing of this defunct line is his fault.
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Russ57


Joined: 25 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think ovaw8lover is correct. If you don't fit in, for whatever reason, you are going to be pushed off the team unless you can change that mindset through your performance.

I didn't play football, I was a wrestler. It was clear early on that I would never be welcome on the team. I was a long haired hippie with a lanky build. It didn't matter that I consistently beat everyone in my weight class. The coach didn't like me and neither did the other guys on the team. If I was a better man I would have fought harder for a spot, but I didn't because I didn't want to be part of a group that didn't want me.

Martin has to understand what the score is. Very few get to play in the NFL. Every player on the team needs to feel you can contribute. If the entire DL and OL thinks the guy is mentally soft can you blame them for pushing him to grow a pair?

I'll ask all of you this: Is being teased worse than getting physically abused on the field by Wake during practice? I'd sure hate the shame of being humiliated on every practice play and having my DE whisper in my ear that "I suck and will cost the team wins and should quit".

Funny how the OL had its best game after he was gone.
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