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turtle28


Joined: 21 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

32houchen32 wrote:
Is it me or no one really stands out on defensive prospects this year?

Or am I getting smart and not buying into the hype? I havnt been able to catch a college game all year. But I'm not hearing about standout player on espn, beside that QB from Lou.
I'd agree with that. They've been good prospects, not great
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32houchen32


Joined: 04 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the steelers on the downfall of things and seeing their bust picks in the last couple of years, add there is no standout players coming out for who knows how long.
I'm preparing for some depressing years. Also add the FO needs a kick to the head..

Sorry turtles I forgot to quote you.. Just don't turn the cap locks on please.
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treat88


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.
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chrisororke


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kethnaab wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
Barr is not an OLB in a 3-4, sorry.


yes, that's exactly what he is, and that's exactly what he plays

chrisororke wrote:
He was a RB two years ago. RBs don't look like Aldon Smith, they get tackled by him


that makes no sense. Barr was a RB 2 years ago and stopped being a RB because he's almost 6'5.

chrisororke wrote:
I'm not even going to touch Mosley as we have all seen how good Dont'a has been. I liked Dont'a a lot more than Mosley


well, Hightower is 6'3, 265 lbs, Moseley is nowhere near that size. Hightower played as a buck and a pass rushing DE. Mosley plays more like a WLB. Not sure why you would bring Hightower up since they are copmletely different types of players.


Hightower and Mosley play in the middle. Here's a few videos since you seem to have forgot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS7gJ1re93E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYqUyVPenvA

The point on Barr is you don't change a body type from a RB to a DE in college (3-4 OLB pro) in a two year span. He's not a 3-4 OLB. He would be an outstanding replacement for Lance Briggs in Chicago. He's just a more athletic Jarvis, and Jarvis hasn't lit it up. I like Jarvis in the middle, and I like Barr in the middle in the 3-4. That about does it for a rebuttal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMC8xJa2Cj0 -- Barr vs Nebraska
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chrisororke


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

treat88 wrote:
I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.


Saying Clowney is not an impact player is laughable. When is the next time you will see one like him? 10 years? 20 years? Great list btw, I was just nodding the whole time. I really like Andrew Jackson and some of the other LB prospects. Like Christian Jones is a stud.
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32houchen32


Joined: 04 May 2008
Posts: 400
Location: Montana
PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
treat88 wrote:
I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.


Saying Clowney is not an impact player is laughable. When is the next time you will see one like him? 10 years? 20 years? Great list btw, I was just nodding the whole time. I really like Andrew Jackson and some of the other LB prospects. Like Christian Jones is a stud.


I'm not sold on clowney, he could be a Mario Williams or a peppers type player. May I add, steelers won't be able to get him, if they are able to does he have the tools to be a OLB?
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treat88


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

32houchen32 wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
treat88 wrote:
I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.


Saying Clowney is not an impact player is laughable. When is the next time you will see one like him? 10 years? 20 years? Great list btw, I was just nodding the whole time. I really like Andrew Jackson and some of the other LB prospects. Like Christian Jones is a stud.


I'm not sold on clowney, he could be a Mario Williams or a peppers type player. May I add, steelers won't be able to get him, if they are able to does he have the tools to be a OLB?


I think Clowney's the best defensive prospect to come into the league since Suh. He may not work out to be that type of player but coming in he's a no doubt about it excellent prospect.

I know some think he'd make the transition to OLB, and he's likely talented enough to do it, but I think doing that takes away a lot of what makes him special.

That said, I'd be hard pressed to take any defensive prospect over Watkins or Ebron. I'd probably go with Clowney just because he's a rarer talent, but I think either of Watkins or Ebron would turn into more W's for this team while Ben's window is open.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
kethnaab wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
Barr is not an OLB in a 3-4, sorry.


yes, that's exactly what he is, and that's exactly what he plays

chrisororke wrote:
He was a RB two years ago. RBs don't look like Aldon Smith, they get tackled by him


that makes no sense. Barr was a RB 2 years ago and stopped being a RB because he's almost 6'5.

chrisororke wrote:
I'm not even going to touch Mosley as we have all seen how good Dont'a has been. I liked Dont'a a lot more than Mosley


well, Hightower is 6'3, 265 lbs, Moseley is nowhere near that size. Hightower played as a buck and a pass rushing DE. Mosley plays more like a WLB. Not sure why you would bring Hightower up since they are copmletely different types of players.


Hightower and Mosley play in the middle. Here's a few videos since you seem to have forgot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS7gJ1re93E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYqUyVPenvA

The point on Barr is you don't change a body type from a RB to a DE in college (3-4 OLB pro) in a two year span. He's not a 3-4 OLB. He would be an outstanding replacement for Lance Briggs in Chicago. He's just a more athletic Jarvis, and Jarvis hasn't lit it up. I like Jarvis in the middle, and I like Barr in the middle in the 3-4. That about does it for a rebuttal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMC8xJa2Cj0 -- Barr vs Nebraska
They're two totally different types of players.

Dont'a Hightower is a thumper, a MLB in a 4-3 scheme or a 4-3 Strong side LB.

In the 3-4 scheme Dont'a Hightower is your "Buck" "Ted" or "Sam". Or Strongside inside linebacker.

Mosley is your "Will" or "weak side" inside linebacker.

Mosely is the guy you want in coverage. Hightower is the guy you want attacking guards and taking on fullbacks in the hole in the run game.

Hightower and Mosely are two totally different types of players.
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jebrick


Joined: 10 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone watching the ND/Navy game would cross Nix off the list. He was too easily taken out of plays and many times they ran right at him.

Not sure what happened to him but he seems very slow moving side to side this year and much, much less dominate.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
treat88 wrote:
I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.


Saying Clowney is not an impact player is laughable. When is the next time you will see one like him? 10 years? 20 years? Great list btw, I was just nodding the whole time. I really like Andrew Jackson and some of the other LB prospects. Like Christian Jones is a stud.


Yeah there are some great ILB prospects:

Cj Mosely
AJ Johnson
Ryan Shazier
Christian Jones
Yarwin Smallwood
Shayne Skov
Andrew Jackson

I think Andrew Jackson might be available in the fourth round. Coverage liabilities could keep him from going in the first three rounds.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Defensive Prospects Reply with quote

Given the fact that Ryan Clark won't be back.

I'm actually changing my thought process a little but because Clinton-Dix is on the rise because of his playmaking ability.

If both the top 10 LT's are gone, I wouldn't be shocked if the steelers take Clinton Dix.

If the team losses Clark, they had better address the FS position. If they don't, the secondary is going to be even worse next year.
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Last edited by turtle28 on Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Defensive Prospects Reply with quote

wwhickok wrote:
The ONLY safety I'd even want us to touch on that list is HaSean Clinton-Dix and I'll be honest if that's who we get in the first round I'd be ecstatic. That dude does nothing but create turnovers and make plays. He also is great in run support. He definitely fits the type of Safety that the Steelers need.


I agree. The more I think about it, I think the Steelers will win 6 or 7 games and Clinton-Dix or Mosley may be their pick in the 10 to 14 range.
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chrisororke


Joined: 14 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
kethnaab wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
Barr is not an OLB in a 3-4, sorry.


yes, that's exactly what he is, and that's exactly what he plays

chrisororke wrote:
He was a RB two years ago. RBs don't look like Aldon Smith, they get tackled by him


that makes no sense. Barr was a RB 2 years ago and stopped being a RB because he's almost 6'5.

chrisororke wrote:
I'm not even going to touch Mosley as we have all seen how good Dont'a has been. I liked Dont'a a lot more than Mosley


well, Hightower is 6'3, 265 lbs, Moseley is nowhere near that size. Hightower played as a buck and a pass rushing DE. Mosley plays more like a WLB. Not sure why you would bring Hightower up since they are copmletely different types of players.


Hightower and Mosley play in the middle. Here's a few videos since you seem to have forgot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS7gJ1re93E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYqUyVPenvA

The point on Barr is you don't change a body type from a RB to a DE in college (3-4 OLB pro) in a two year span. He's not a 3-4 OLB. He would be an outstanding replacement for Lance Briggs in Chicago. He's just a more athletic Jarvis, and Jarvis hasn't lit it up. I like Jarvis in the middle, and I like Barr in the middle in the 3-4. That about does it for a rebuttal

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMC8xJa2Cj0 -- Barr vs Nebraska
They're two totally different types of players.

Dont'a Hightower is a thumper, a MLB in a 4-3 scheme or a 4-3 Strong side LB.

In the 3-4 scheme Dont'a Hightower is your "Buck" "Ted" or "Sam". Or Strongside inside linebacker.

Mosley is your "Will" or "weak side" inside linebacker.

Mosely is the guy you want in coverage. Hightower is the guy you want attacking guards and taking on fullbacks in the hole in the run game.

Hightower and Mosely are two totally different types of players.


Totally agree Hightower -- Buck, Mosley -- Mac

The reason I brought up Hightower is think about the Bama backers in the last say ten years and I'd say Hightower has had the most impact for their team out of all of those guys. He was the most feared and most dominant. What has he done? Not a lot in the pros. Why the heck would I spend a top 15 pick on a guy who's had less impact in his games and is not as good as Hightower when Hightower hasn't done diddly squat for NE. Bama backers don't translate.

I'd take a shot on any of the million other LBs this class that aren't overhyped because they are on the #1 team in the nation
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chrisororke


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 02, 2013 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
treat88 wrote:
I don't know, I think there are some outstanding defensive players in this class.

Clowney, Barr, Dix, Beasley, Mack, Nix, Hageman, Tuitt...I think they all have a very good chance to very good if not impact players in the league.

Some interesting names that could climb the charts as April approaches like Shawn Oakman.

Outside of Dix, the secondary prospects lack top end talent but there's reasonable depth at the CB position.


Saying Clowney is not an impact player is laughable. When is the next time you will see one like him? 10 years? 20 years? Great list btw, I was just nodding the whole time. I really like Andrew Jackson and some of the other LB prospects. Like Christian Jones is a stud.


Yeah there are some great ILB prospects:

Cj Mosely
AJ Johnson
Ryan Shazier
Christian Jones
Yarwin Smallwood
Shayne Skov
Andrew Jackson

I think Andrew Jackson might be available in the fourth round. Coverage liabilities could keep him from going in the first three rounds.


I think the President (which is he named after, truth) has Buck written all over him. He is very athletic and blows up plays. I can't say Ray Lewis type, but he's a bigger, slightly less explosive Kendrell Bell, that kinda guy. Leader of the defense as well. I'm take him as high as mid-2nd rd but I'd cross my fingers for the 3rd rd compensation pick
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kethnaab


Joined: 05 Jan 2009
Posts: 9738
PostPosted: Sun Nov 03, 2013 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

chrisororke wrote:
kethnaab wrote:
chrisororke wrote:
I'm not even going to touch Mosley as we have all seen how good Dont'a has been. I liked Dont'a a lot more than Mosley


well, Hightower is 6'3, 265 lbs, Moseley is nowhere near that size. Hightower played as a buck and a pass rushing DE. Mosley plays more like a WLB. Not sure why you would bring Hightower up since they are copmletely different types of players.


Hightower and Mosley play in the middle. Here's a few videos since you seem to have forgot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vS7gJ1re93E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYqUyVPenvA

oh yes, well Lawrence Timmons and Levon Kirkland both play(ed) in the middle, so apparently we should compare them and their playstyles as well?

I don't know if you're being your usual - self, if you're trolling, or if you're simply ignorant and illiterate.

What I wrote about Hightower and Mosley is 100% accurate. EVEN THOUGH they both played (primarily) in the middle

Here's a video of Hightower getting a sack from the LDE position:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NsR3WOpteg

Here's another one of Hightower pancaking DJ Fluker from the LDE position:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMhepp_GMUs

and here's one of Hightower getting the BCS championship-clinching sack and forced fumble vs. LSU...from the LDE position (since you forgot):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8DxSFCworg




chrisororke wrote:
The point on Barr is you don't change a body type from a RB to a DE in college (3-4 OLB pro) in a two year span.


well, that is a reasonable statement. The obvious counter is that Barr didn't "change" body type, he changed positions because he didn't have the body type of a RB once he got out of high school. You realize he was 6'4 as a high school senior RB, right?

Here is Anthony Barr's rivals.com profile (6'4, 230 as a high school senior):
http://rivals.yahoo.com/Alabama/football/recruiting/player-Anthony-Barr-86423

Here's DeMarcus Ware's rivals.com profile (6'4, 224 lbs as a high school senior):
http://rivals100.rivals.com/cviewplayer.asp?Player=10793

DeMarcus Ware listed as 6'4, 251 at his combine. Anthony Barr is presently listed as 6'4, 248 on ESPN's website (which is probably wrong)

That's why he switched from RB. He didn't have the body type of a RB, not by a long shot.

chrisororke wrote:
He's not a 3-4 OLB.


yes, he is.

chrisororke wrote:
He's just a more athletic Jarvis, and Jarvis hasn't lit it up.


not sure how you see any comparison between them at all, but whatever. You compared Hightower and Mosley, so I guess I should expect ridiculousness from you by now

chrisororke wrote:
That about does it for a rebuttal


what rebuttal?
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