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Potential Draft Dilemma
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What do you do?
Clowney it is!!
26%
 26%  [ 5 ]
Draft pick compensation for Clowney!!
26%
 26%  [ 5 ]
Mariota!! (if he declares)
47%
 47%  [ 9 ]
Hundley!! (if he declares)
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 19

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Vino


Joined: 27 Oct 2013
Posts: 1838
Location: Jacksonville, FL
PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tugboat wrote:
Vino wrote:
I didn't mean Clowney wasn't worth a top 2 pick there. I meant we shouldn't go out and draft these guys just because everyone says that we should. I consider Mariota a reach for a top 2 pick, but not Clowney. I just think it would be more worth it to us to shore up more picks than draft Clowney who wouldn't be near the solution to all our problems. We could draft other pass rushers in this draft who have a lot of potential and would be steals and have plenty more picks to us than draft one DE. I don't care what anyone says about Clowney being to defense what Luck was to offense last year. This isn't the NBA where one or two guys can entirely turn your team around.


I kind of understand where you're coming from with this bit. But it's a tricky thing.

A guy like Clowney is the sort of player who can potentially completely alter the composition and impact of your defensive front in one fell swoop. But at the same time, like you're kinf of suggesting, i don't think Jadeveon Clowney alone is transforming our team's record drastically.

Grabbing a whole bunch of guys at all sorts of positions by trading down in the 1st round and patching lots of holes...that's the kind of thing that might just improve our record the following year enough to miss out on the 'top QB prospect' once again. That's a depressing notion.

What Clowney could potentially afford this team, if the situation ends up as awful as the proposed 'No Teddy' scenario, is a 'mulligan' on tanking for that 'can't miss QB prospect'...while still getting ourselves an absolute monster franchise cornerstone on the defensive side of the ball. A do-over on getting our QB in 2015.

Basically, if you go deep into building a 'complete defense' this year; one that can really turn the tide for the Jaguars next year, and you actually succeed...you're basically shooting yourself in the foot as far as getting that elusive 'franchise QB'. Clowney is one player, and while he has the potential to be a gamebreaker with the right personnel around him...picking him as a 'stand alone' on the defensive side, isn't likely to snag us a huge amount of wins all by his lonesome in his rookie year.

It almost seems counter-intuitive, but i really do think that drafting the BEST defensive player, as opposed to a few 'lesser players in the 1st+2nd round' would be more likely to put us in a position to 'suck more' next year. If that's what it comes down to. And down the line, Clowney represents the sort of player who can be a total gamebreaker, alongside a proper 'team' on both sides of the ball. That proverbial piece to get a team 'over the hump'. The difference-maker between two good teams (as one might find in the playoffs one day).

But you're playing a dangerous game thinking that way. What if we, once again, end up out of the first pick because of SOS and miss out on Winston, which is what I think you're implying? Or what if Winston just doesn't declare? We once again wasted a season just to try and get a QB that we need the top pick for. Then what?

And Mariota proved everything I said about him the last two games. The kid isn't ready for the NFL and as much as people want to hype how he's "transformed" the Oregon offense he's every bit a product of it as well.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Playing poorly while injured isn't indicative of anything.
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Vino


Joined: 27 Oct 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
Playing poorly while injured isn't indicative of anything.

Not buying his tweaked knee as an excuse for doing as poorly as he did. As I said, when you take away these guys running ability they're lack of tru passing ability is exposed. His knee was good enough for him to be out there playing. Johnny Manziel came back into the Ole Miss game on the road with a tweaked knee and led his team to a comeback victory and went 7/8 in that stretch. He also came back with a bum shoulder against Auburn and nearly led his team back from the fire they had gotten themselves into when he was out. Teddy Bridgewater played through a broken wrist and bum ankle last season against a good Rutgers defense and Florida. Mariota having a bad knee is no excuse. You expect your QB to play through injuries that aren't bad enough for them to sit out with and perform well in the NFL.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So he has a sprained ligament in his knee in two games, those happen to be the two games that he has played poorly in, and you think that it's a legitimate reason? Lots of good players play poorly when they're not 100%, regardless of what level they're at. Peyton Manning struggled when he was coming off an injury, Brett Favre played poorly when he played through an injury, Tom Brady struggled coming off an injury, Carson Palmer struggled coming off an injury, Ben Roethlisberger struggled while playing injured and we could go on and on. Judging a player while they're injured is just silly.
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Vino


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The MCL sprain also didn't just occur apparently he's had it since last month. It's just coming out now for people to make excuses for his poor play. It's not an excuse, it didn't hamper him against lesser teams. He's been a non-factor in the past two games, the two games that were supposed to be his biggest tests of the season. He's not NFL ready and is just a project.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Vino wrote:
The MCL sprain also didn't just occur apparently he's had it since last month. It's just coming out now for people to make excuses for his poor play. It's not an excuse, it didn't hamper him against lesser teams. He's been a non-factor in the past two games, the two games that were supposed to be his biggest tests of the season. He's not NFL ready and is just a project.
If he's had it for so long and it hasn't gotten worse, why did he start wearing a brace for it after last week's game? Why is his play style drastically different especially this past week? Are you suggesting there's a conspiracy so that he could alter the way he plays, play poorly and have an excuse, while screwing his team out of a shot at the National Title?
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Adrenaline_Flux


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 08, 2013 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
Vino wrote:
The MCL sprain also didn't just occur apparently he's had it since last month. It's just coming out now for people to make excuses for his poor play. It's not an excuse, it didn't hamper him against lesser teams. He's been a non-factor in the past two games, the two games that were supposed to be his biggest tests of the season. He's not NFL ready and is just a project.
If he's had it for so long and it hasn't gotten worse, why did he start wearing a brace for it after last week's game? Why is his play style drastically different especially this past week? Are you suggesting there's a conspiracy so that he could alter the way he plays, play poorly and have an excuse, while screwing his team out of a shot at the National Title?


It's a bold strategy, Cotton
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JagsFanInNY


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

....and this dilemma just got all the more probable
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.Buzz


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We are 9 games into a 16 game schedule and the Bucs still has 8 games left. Too much to be played to get worried, we just got a win to quiet the 0-16 talk, we should all be ecstatic right now. Plus, look at who we just beat...

Not much beats it. Going to have a great week now.
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2013 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No team in the modern era with 1 win has ever not gotten the #1 pick (barring situations with expansion). I'm not worried at all.
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AngryPirate


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

right now id take clowney and draft McCaarron in the second.
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Adrenaline_Flux


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngryPirate wrote:
right now id take clowney and draft McCaarron in the second.


Okay, I think I'm okay with Bryce Petty in the top 3 now
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AngryPirate


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adrenaline_Flux wrote:
AngryPirate wrote:
right now id take clowney and draft McCaarron in the second.


Okay, I think I'm okay with Bryce Petty in the top 3 now


You dont like mccaarron? Why do you think he will fail in the NFL?
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JagsFanInNY


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngryPirate wrote:
right now id take clowney and draft McCaarron in the second.
Why waste a 2nd rounder on a QB? The guy is just not that good. Best case scenario, he is Alex Smith in terms of needing a great running game and great defense to win, just like he has in Alabama.
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Adrenaline_Flux


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2013 4:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AngryPirate wrote:
Adrenaline_Flux wrote:
AngryPirate wrote:
right now id take clowney and draft McCaarron in the second.


Okay, I think I'm okay with Bryce Petty in the top 3 now


You dont like mccaarron? Why do you think he will fail in the NFL?


He's a backup and spot-starting QB in the NFL.
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