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Dimitroff and the neglecting the lines myth.
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scar988


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.
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JonnyQuest


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
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scar988


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.
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JonnyQuest


Joined: 23 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.


Injuries can be an excuse to a degree. The talent in our trenches is sub par and the depth, if you can call it that, is paper thin. However, our skill positions are filled with talent. It all boils down to what the whole forum has been frustrated with from the start, TD's inability to build the foundation of the team.
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tech2186


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.


Quick question Scar. Do you believe this team is more talented than lasyt year's team? Injuries excluded.
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Deadeye


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Dimitroff and the neglecting the lines myth. Reply with quote

scar988 wrote:
Ray Edwards big contract.
Osi Umenyiora contract
John Abraham contract.

Edwards not panning out as a signing stung the worst for pass rush.
Agree on Edwards, that one hurt.

But the Abraham and Osi contracts don't offset the lack of drafted talent. Teams don't let top-flight, stud pass rushers walk out in free agency. The guys we got were all leftovers.
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DirtyBird4L


Joined: 29 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So far, Steven Jackson has looked like a crap signing. I think the Quizz/Snelling combo would have been a much more serviceable RB tandem and we could have saved some cash. Those two compliment each other well and have played well together. Jackson has clearly shown he doesn't pass the penny test for the tread on his tires.

I can't stand when the camera pans to our sidelines during our games. They always show like 3-5 starters of ours in street clothes. That pretty much sums up our season though. I'm hoping some of these 0-6 teams win a game or two more so we can stay in contention for a top 10 pick. I never wish defeat on this team but at this point, I want a top 10 pick. I want TD to shop some players around for some draft picks too. I'm not talking 5th+ rounders either. We need to be aiming high next year and ace the draft or we will fall flat on our faces for years to come.

P.S. I'm so sorry Tony G. I wish you the best in life and I'm sorry you had to come back and endure this horrific season.
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terrell123


Joined: 08 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
Preach man preach.
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SpoonFed56


Joined: 11 Jan 2013
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyBird4L wrote:
So far, Steven Jackson has looked like a crap signing. I think the Quizz/Snelling combo would have been a much more serviceable RB tandem and we could have saved some cash. Those two compliment each other well and have played well together. Jackson has clearly shown he doesn't pass the penny test for the tread on his tires.

I can't stand when the camera pans to our sidelines during our games. They always show like 3-5 starters of ours in street clothes. That pretty much sums up our season though. I'm hoping some of these 0-6 teams win a game or two more so we can stay in contention for a top 10 pick. I never wish defeat on this team but at this point, I want a top 10 pick. I want TD to shop some players around for some draft picks too. I'm not talking 5th+ rounders either. We need to be aiming high next year and ace the draft or we will fall flat on our faces for years to come.

P.S. I'm so sorry Tony G. I wish you the best in life and I'm sorry you had to come back and endure this horrific season.


Yeah, I was all for signing Jackson so I will eat crow on that one.
11 carries for 6 yds. Sheesh. Snelling/Quizz RB-by-committee seems like the better approach for this team.

Basically, it doesn't matter who is running the ball if you have an OL that can't run block for s***.
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terrell123


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.
This is the softest team Ive seen around here in years. Please....You cant count on everyone staying healthy every year. That's what got us in this mess we're in now.(no depth) Last year we were healthy and were still barely beating bad teams.(ALOT of luck) And if a guy gets in trouble as a college freshman or so, that doesn't mean he has bad character for life. Sometimes you have to give players a chance. Ie Mathieu(balling out) 3rd rdr making more plays than our 1st rdr..Not to mention we woulda left Lamar Holmes in Mississippi where he belongs) Dez Bryant(balling out. getting better and better) Red Bryant(beasting) etc.......... We coulda had all 3 players. I only bring up those 3 because I had all three in my mocks when they were coming out, knowing good and damn well we'd pass on em, and they would make us pay. Draft Dez and theres no need to trade away multiple picks for Julio. Draft Red Bryant(coulda had him in the 4th) and our DT position would be a lot better. Draft Tyronne in the 3rd, could've used that 1st and 2nd rdr in the trenches. Just sayin. Btw, all 3 guys are staying out of trouble for the most part.
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tech2186


Joined: 01 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

terrell123 wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.
This is the softest team Ive seen around here in years. Please....You cant count on everyone staying healthy every year. That's what got us in this mess we're in now.(no depth) Last year we were healthy and were still barely beating bad teams.(ALOT of luck) And if a guy gets in trouble as a college freshman or so, that doesn't mean he has bad character for life. Sometimes you have to give players a chance. Ie Mathieu(balling out) 3rd rdr making more plays than our 1st rdr..Not to mention we woulda left Lamar Holmes in Mississippi where he belongs) Dez Bryant(balling out. getting better and better) Red Bryant(beasting) etc.......... We coulda had all 3 players. I only bring up those 3 because I had all three in my mocks when they were coming out, knowing good and damn well we'd pass on em, and they would make us pay. Draft Dez and theres no need to trade away multiple picks for Julio. Draft Red Bryant(coulda had him in the 4th) and our DT position would be a lot better. Draft Tyronne in the 3rd, could've used that 1st and 2nd rdr in the trenches. Just sayin. Btw, all 3 guys are staying out of trouble for the most part.


I agree for the most part except for Mathieu. The guy is a chronic offender of weed use. No matter what you opinion on the subject of weed is, it is a violation of the NFL policy to use it. So to take a flyer on him in the 3rd is just too risky IMO. He hasn't been in trouble yet but the odds are against him.

That being said, TD and this orgaization have this Mike Vick curse on them. They are so afraid to get burned by a guy who has talent out of the A%% but has red flags. At some point you have to trust guys like Matt Ryan, Julio Jones, Asante Samuels, Willy Mo, Mike Smith..etc to be able to establish a culture where taking a risk on a supreme talent red flag guy won't mess up your locker room chemistry. It's clear that the "team captain" rule doesn't breed superior talent. And make no mistake, this game is about brute strength and aggression. Intelligence and leadership is great but it means nothing when a guy you are facing can run a 4.3 and you run a 4.6 but can ace the wonderlic. The smart leadership guy is going to lose almost every matchup in that example.

Change has got to come and the birght side is that we at least have an owner who won't accept this crap we have been seeing on the field.
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terrell123


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tech2186 wrote:
terrell123 wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.
This is the softest team Ive seen around here in years. Please....You cant count on everyone staying healthy every year. That's what got us in this mess we're in now.(no depth) Last year we were healthy and were still barely beating bad teams.(ALOT of luck) And if a guy gets in trouble as a college freshman or so, that doesn't mean he has bad character for life. Sometimes you have to give players a chance. Ie Mathieu(balling out) 3rd rdr making more plays than our 1st rdr..Not to mention we woulda left Lamar Holmes in Mississippi where he belongs) Dez Bryant(balling out. getting better and better) Red Bryant(beasting) etc.......... We coulda had all 3 players. I only bring up those 3 because I had all three in my mocks when they were coming out, knowing good and damn well we'd pass on em, and they would make us pay. Draft Dez and theres no need to trade away multiple picks for Julio. Draft Red Bryant(coulda had him in the 4th) and our DT position would be a lot better. Draft Tyronne in the 3rd, could've used that 1st and 2nd rdr in the trenches. Just sayin. Btw, all 3 guys are staying out of trouble for the most part.


I agree for the most part except for Mathieu. The guy is a chronic offender of weed use. No matter what you opinion on the subject of weed is, it is a violation of the NFL policy to use it. So to take a flyer on him in the 3rd is just too risky IMO. He hasn't been in trouble yet but the odds are against him.

That being said, TD and this orgaization have this Mike Vick curse on them. They are so afraid to get burned by a guy who has talent out of the A%% but has red flags. At some point you have to trust guys like Matt Ryan, Julio Jones, Asante Samuels, Willy Mo, Mike Smith..etc to be able to establish a culture where taking a risk on a supreme talent red flag guy won't mess up your locker room chemistry. It's clear that the "team captain" rule doesn't breed superior talent. And make no mistake, this game is about brute strength and aggression. Intelligence and leadership is great but it means nothing when a guy you are facing can run a 4.3 and you run a 4.6 but can ace the wonderlic. The smart leadership guy is going to lose almost every matchup in that example.

Change has got to come and the birght side is that we at least have an owner who won't accept this crap we have been seeing on the field.
Matheiu is not going to risk losing his high paying job for a lil weed. Not with Peterson hanging around. I could be wrong.. College is different. And we're talking about the 3rd rd. Not like hes making a ton of $. Id take him over Lamar Holmes all day.Taking a project LT from Southern Miss in the 3rd is a bigger risk imo. Especially when we were an injury away from him being a starter. At least you already knew Tyronne was a gamer from the get go.
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scar988


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tech2186 wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
scar988 wrote:
JonnyQuest wrote:
You don't look for impact players in the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds. These are depth building picks, and TD has failed even in that aspect. I'm not a TD hater. I think he deserves one more year. However, he has been terrible at evaluating trench talent, and has been horrible picking them as well. He needs to take off his team captain only goggles and actually draft based on talent. That doesn't mean take a guy with multiple charges on his record, but don't completely erase someone off the board because of a small mistake.
I'd rather have guys who don't get arrested and can play football than guys who get arrested and play football. Both guys can play football. one repeatedly gets arrested.


So would I...The problem is...the players we have CANNOT play football lol.
I disagree with you there. I think that the Falcons have a ton of talent right now. It's just not clicking. Which happens. This is a much better team than what Atlanta had years ago, the biggest issue is the vast injury bug.


Quick question Scar. Do you believe this team is more talented than lasyt year's team? Injuries excluded.
in terms of raw talent? yes.

QB - same as 2012 + 1 year EXP
RB - Jackson > Turner + same as 2012 + 1 year EXP
FB - equal
WR - same as 2012 + 1 year EXP + Darius Johnson
TE - Gonzalez, Toilolo, Coffman > Gonzalez, Palmer, Gallard
OL - 2012 was better. Baker and Clabo were playing well and McClure was McClure.

DE - Osi and Biermann was going to be a good pass rushing duo. Massaquoi, Goodman and Maponga rotating in would have been better than one of them starting
DT - Same as 2012 + 1 year EXP
LB - Same starters as 2012 + surprises in Worrilow and Bartu for depth. Bartu had earned a starting spot and Worrilow is better than Peterson or James were.
CB - Alford and Trufant > Robinson and one game of Grimes
S - Same as 2012 starters + 1 yr EXP there, BUT Backups > in 2013 with the sure tackling pairing of Motta and Ishmael over old vet Hope who was abysmal on ST

ST - much better overall depth on the team made this much better.

Injuries have screwed this team from a great season. IF fully healthy, the OL would have been better than it's showing.
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terrell123


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wonder if we can get a 2nd for TG? And another 2nd or 3rd for Roddy? We need PICKS..Hell, we might as well throw Blalock, Babs and Samuels names out there too if anyone is interested. The more picks the better.
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GSUeagles14


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

terrell123 wrote:
I wonder if we can get a 2nd for TG? And another 2nd or 3rd for Roddy? We need PICKS..Hell, we might as well throw Blalock, Babs and Samuels names out there too if anyone is interested. The more picks the better.


The silliness contin ues. In what world does this logic sound good "Hey, lets trade a bunch of established, good players for a bunch of unknowns"
Just no.... no.
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