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Week 8 GDT: Giants @ Eagles Didn't we just have this thread?
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Rase


Joined: 23 Jan 2009
Posts: 7091
Location: Warsaw,Poland
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jerseyboy257 wrote:

OK, I apologize instead of saying "so we can win games" I should have said "so our players can possess certain skills to dictate the result of a match". I thought that would be implied, but I guess not.


Firstly, I accept your apology. Secondly, saying "we CAN win games" implies that for the first 6 weeks we couldn't win which is still incorrect.

jerseyboy257 wrote:

You can't say our DL is playing extremely bad when they play a game and total 4 sacks and completely shut down any possible run game. You can say JPP is not playing nearly at the level that he should be playing, which is most likely a result of him just coming off a back surgery a couple months ago. But to say our DL is playing extremely bad is just incorrect. They are actually improving as they showed signs of life last game and then put up the numbers this game. And I think it's safe to say JPP can only get better.


Do you think the Eagles shut down our running game?
I also mentioned that they're improving but their current level is just bad, and it's not something we're used to as Giants fans. I'm waiting on stats that show how much the QB was hurried to determine if our DL played badly or just ok.

jerseyboy257 wrote:

In what way is losing humiliating and disgracing our organization? Do I even need to answer this? So you don't want us to win another game this season, so we finish 2-14, be one of the worst teams in the NFL, a laughing stock to the rest of the teams in the NFL. Any team playing the Giants it's an automatic win. Do you seriously have any pride in your team? So all for the reason we can draft one player, who's certainly not guaranteed NFL success, while ignoring the other 90% of the problems that coexists with being a 2 win team. No thanks, I'd rather have our players and team play better, which they have recently, so we can once again be a threatening team and superbowl contenders. Not the worst, or second worst, team in the NFL. But to each his own.


I can promise you that if we go 2-14 we won't be a discrace. Why? Because sports are unpredictable, because wins and losses do not determine such things. What is more humiliating and disgracing? Winning only 2 games or having your entire team caught in a sex and drug-abuse scandal? From what I read being a laughing stock of the league = humiliation and disgrace. And that's not the case. Every week a different team is made fun of. You can play a perfect game, and if you throw and INT on the last drive people will make fun of your. Fan opinion means nothing. I'll give you one example that involves humiliation and disgracing a team. It's not a team going 0-16. Its what's in Penn State.

Oh, and I saved my favorite quote :

" No thanks, I'd rather have our players and team play better, which they have recently, so we can once again be a threatening team and superbowl contenders."

If you truly believe that a win against Vikings, and tonights win will make us "superbowl contenders" in the long haul then good luck with that.


Smile
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minutemancl


Joined: 06 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So our defense: actually getting better or just performing well against crappy teams? Particularly QBs, freeman, Vick, Barkley.
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aceinthehouse wrote:
But why not maintain that dominance? You guys were there...

Let me give you my personal opinion, on what I think has happened.
It all started with the release of the coke machine in Brandon Jacobs.
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Acgott


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

minutemancl wrote:
So our defense: actually getting better or just performing well against crappy teams? Particularly QBs, freeman, Vick, Barkley.

I believe our defense has been decent for most of the year. The problem has been with them getting tired out in the 2nd half due to being on the field for so much because of turnovers
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jerseyboy257


Joined: 21 Apr 2012
Posts: 603
Location: Northern Jersey
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
jerseyboy257 wrote:

OK, I apologize instead of saying "so we can win games" I should have said "so our players can possess certain skills to dictate the result of a match". I thought that would be implied, but I guess not.


Firstly, I accept your apology. Secondly, saying "we CAN win games" implies that for the first 6 weeks we couldn't win which is still incorrect.


In that case, I apologize again. I was not aware you were part of the grammar nazis. When someone asks you "can you pass me something", do you follow with CAN I? In context, it's something that's accepted here. Not sure about Poland. Anyway, this part of the argument is just ridiculous.

Quote:

I can promise you that if we go 2-14 we won't be a discrace. Why? Because sports are unpredictable, because wins and losses do not determine such things. What is more humiliating and disgracing? Winning only 2 games or having your entire team caught in a sex and drug-abuse scandal? From what I read being a laughing stock of the league = humiliation and disgrace. And that's not the case. Every week a different team is made fun of. You can play a perfect game, and if you throw and INT on the last drive people will make fun of your. Fan opinion means nothing. I'll give you one example that involves humiliation and disgracing a team. It's not a team going 0-16. Its what's in Penn State.


You're absolutely wrong here. No one expected the Giants to be where they're at record-wise at the start of the season. As being a Giant fan, a team that has won 2 out of the past 6 Superbowls, making the playoffs is a disappointment. Sure, every team's goal is to make the playoffs and if not it's disappointing, but the Giants are one of the more respected and successful organizations in the league, especially in the Eli Manning/Tom Coughlin era, and you can not try to tell me being a 2-14 team is not a disgrace for this team. You're only kidding yourself. Coughlin would be the first to admit that. You're disgracing the value and reputation of the GM, the head coach, and the players. Being the worst team in the NFL is an EMBARRASSMENT and a DISGRACE all the way around, especially to the caliber of this team. The fact that this is what you want is sickening, but then again you previously claim that you hate this team so...
Quote:

Oh, and I saved my favorite quote :

" No thanks, I'd rather have our players and team play better, which they have recently, so we can once again be a threatening team and superbowl contenders."

If you truly believe that a win against Vikings, and tonights win will make us "superbowl contenders" in the long haul then good luck with that.


Hey, that's my favorite quote too! Why? Because it's true. What you're basically saying is that you want our team to suck. You want the level of play from our team to be so bad that we never win another game for the rest of the season. That's what you're unintentionally saying, but truthfully. All for the fact of having a higher draft pick, so we can get that one player you want, who like I mentioned earlier is promised zero NFL success. I NEVER said we're superbowl contenders right now because we beat the Vikings and Eagles. What I did say is that I'd rather have our players and team better, which they have recently, so we can once again be a threatening team and superbowl contenders. And that was in comparison to your wish of finishing the season 2-14, so clearly I'm referring to season long. What I want is for this team to turn it around and continue to win games, so we can get back to being the playoff-threating team we CAN be and should be.
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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 13072
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Acgott wrote:
minutemancl wrote:
So our defense: actually getting better or just performing well against crappy teams? Particularly QBs, freeman, Vick, Barkley.

I believe our defense has been decent for most of the year. The problem has been with them getting tired out in the 2nd half due to being on the field for so much because of turnovers


This and ive been this for a while.
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Rase


Joined: 23 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I get what you're trying to say but:
1. Well your example is entirely different as you're the only one directly involved with the action of passing something.
2. You're also comparing a volunatry action to a part of someone's job.
3. You probably meant "not making the playoffs is disappointing".
4. I'm assuming that you believe that players care about the team, how it's viewed etc?
5. Well:
a) either you misread what I was saying
b) I chose wrong words to describe it
What I was trying to say is that I don't want the Giants to fool themselves and the fans of what they're are. We're a bad team... You, and Giants' employees try to downgrade what happened during the first 6 weeks, and all the negative aspects of the last two weeks.
6. If someone approached you with a question "Why the US is #1 in the World?" would you answer with something like "Because it's a land of the free"?
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jerseyboy257


Joined: 21 Apr 2012
Posts: 603
Location: Northern Jersey
PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rase wrote:
I get what you're trying to say but:
1. Well your example is entirely different as you're the only one directly involved with the action of passing something.
2. You're also comparing a volunatry action to a part of someone's job.
3. You probably meant "not making the playoffs is disappointing".
4. I'm assuming that you believe that players care about the team, how it's viewed etc?
5. Well:
a) either you misread what I was saying
b) I chose wrong words to describe it
What I was trying to say is that I don't want the Giants to fool themselves and the fans of what they're are. We're a bad team... You, and Giants' employees try to downgrade what happened during the first 6 weeks, and all the negative aspects of the last two weeks.
6. If someone approached you with a question "Why the US is #1 in the World?" would you answer with something like "Because it's a land of the free"?


First of all, I don't proof read my messages. Why? Because I really don't care; I'm not writing a college essay.

Furthermore, when I was reading your posts, I came across multiple errors yourself. Am I here posting trying to correct your grammar rather than talking sense? No. If that's really what you have to result to in making points or a response, then just don't bother replying.

And in response to your fourth point, I am not just talking about the perception within the locker room, but rather as a fan as well. But regardless, no, I'm sure no one in the Giants' locker room wants to be playing for an embarrassment. Because then as a player, you become associated with your team's image and you, your team, your family within the locker room are all perceived as a joke and a failure. No one wants that.

What you want is for the Giants and its' players to suck for the rest of the season, not win another game (disgraceful) so we can pick one player that you want--who's not promised any NFL success--and build from there.

What I want is for the Giants to continue to turn it around, play at a higher level, win games, and potentially become a playoff threatening team. Because this team has the potential when they get in a gel. They are a very confidence-pursued team.

I know it sounds a bit farfetched now, obviously the statistics are not in favor, but you need to look at it from a different stand point. 1. We are capable of playing much better than what was seen and played the first 6 weeks of the season. 2. With a win over Dallas, we are only ONE game behind with 7 more games still to play. THAT is what is most important. If this team builds off these wins as a confidence booster, they can absolutely turn it around and start winning.
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GiantAl


Joined: 15 Mar 2012
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our defense played well, but lets face it, its been against 2 really crappy teams/QBs. I hope it continues of course, but cant see it. I cant see the offense sorting it itself out over the bye week, so the D will be on field alot.

Our red zo....sorry Green Zone convertion is embarassing. It has been for a long time. Whats going on here?

As for special teams, another shocking week.

Glad its the bye week, we need to dump some guys off roster and give other people chances.
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reckless123


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our redzone offense is so bad because we're conservative in there. We're predictable. We always run on 1st down, then we get 1 or 2 yards. Sometimes negative yards. 2nd down, incomplete pass or penalty whether it be holding, false start or delay of game. We saw yesterday how many times got the play off with 3 seconds left on the play clock and we saw Eli barking at o-line or FB or WR. Those are the reasons why we suck so much in the redzone.
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ESKY008


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apparently Jon Beason has been making the defense turn up half hour earlier to go over film and player meetings.
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GmenSeattle


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESKY008 wrote:
Apparently Jon Beason has been making the defense turn up half hour earlier to go over film and player meetings.


Love this guy and the impact he's had on our defense.
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Gmen


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some of the midseason additions have given the Giants a boost. Conner, and especially Hillis have given the Giants running game a major boost. I'm sure Eli appreciates not facing 10+ yards every 3rd down. And Hillis is a good receiver out of the backfield as well. This is a move that should have been made in the offseason.

Jon Beason has been a great pickup. Sounds like a natural leader, which we lacked. Hopefully he can stay healthy. Will Hill has looked great. He has top notch physical tools and is only going to get better as he gets more snaps. Hopefully he can keep his head on straight.

It has also been refreshing to see the Giants implement some sort of short passing game. I've been calling for it since week 3. Better late than never I suppose. The lack of production in the redzone was disappointing.

All that said, it's probably too little too late.
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Gmen4ev


Joined: 07 Sep 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESKY008 wrote:
Apparently Jon Beason has been making the defense turn up half hour earlier to go over film and player meetings.


awesome news if your source is right. Guy better be a captain next year.
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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2013 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ESKY008 wrote:
Apparently Jon Beason has been making the defense turn up half hour earlier to go over film and player meetings.


Thats speaks to his character, if this is true. Awesome addition.

BTW, what up with Corey Webster? And Hosley?
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