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My take on Schiano
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 8650
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was over reacting on josh. When looking at the height of things our situation is exactly like the chiefs. Questionable coaching staff?
, personnel (yes Dom is responsible bc he is the architect of the past 2 coaching regimes) and no qb.

In the end Dom and schiano and staff will be gone and well have to find the right staff that suits the strength of this team and the talent evaluation to find a qb.


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BucBall_76


Joined: 06 Dec 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
BucBall_76 wrote:
Calibucsfan wrote:
Bucs00 wrote:
^Well said. Schiano was needed here. He didn't give us many wins, but he cleaned up the mess. If he could have softened his apporoach this year, he might have done better.


I'm sorry but I fully disagree. Shiano was needed here?? Cleaned up the mess??? How exactly????????

In case I'm the only one that noticed, we are 0-4 and we are the most pathetic/laughed at Franchise in the NFL.

Before I said that Browns,Raiders, and Jags are more pathetic than we are, but in reality their not. We are the most pathetic franchise today. Browns are first in the AFC North and have 2 first round picks. Raiders at least have 1 win. Jags are terrible but outside of 3-4 players, they have no talent on that roster so its understandable. But us? We are 0-4 with a roster that is beyond loaded with talent, and are also all over the media in the most negative ways.

So what did Shiano clean up exactly...the discipline? So he came in and treated our players like they are first year 18 year old college kids. And guess what....now we are the most pathetic franchise there is, and what makes it more embarrassing is we have more talent than 50% of the teams in the league.

I mean, this is the same gap tooth looser that blitzes on victory formation....Shiano needed here? Thats like saying Raheem and Youngry movement was needed here..


I actually love seeing that. if its a one possession game, and there is still a chance to win the game(however miniscule it may be), then do what u have to. and by now, people know to expect it.

And when has that actually worked for us? If you see victory formation at the end of the 4th, clearly you lost...accept it. Blitzing against it is like a 10 year old that cant accept a loss at a game of checkers, and instead of taking the loss he instead picks up the table and flips it over


Just because it hasnt worked, doesnt mean it cant. u could look at it like that(10 yr. old flipping the board) or u could look at it like a boxer knowing hes lost on points, so he has to sell out for the knockout. as long is it a 1 possession game, i have no problem w/ it.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
Posts: 8650
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BucBall_76 wrote:
Calibucsfan wrote:
BucBall_76 wrote:
Calibucsfan wrote:
Bucs00 wrote:
^Well said. Schiano was needed here. He didn't give us many wins, but he cleaned up the mess. If he could have softened his apporoach this year, he might have done better.


I'm sorry but I fully disagree. Shiano was needed here?? Cleaned up the mess??? How exactly????????

In case I'm the only one that noticed, we are 0-4 and we are the most pathetic/laughed at Franchise in the NFL.

Before I said that Browns,Raiders, and Jags are more pathetic than we are, but in reality their not. We are the most pathetic franchise today. Browns are first in the AFC North and have 2 first round picks. Raiders at least have 1 win. Jags are terrible but outside of 3-4 players, they have no talent on that roster so its understandable. But us? We are 0-4 with a roster that is beyond loaded with talent, and are also all over the media in the most negative ways.

So what did Shiano clean up exactly...the discipline? So he came in and treated our players like they are first year 18 year old college kids. And guess what....now we are the most pathetic franchise there is, and what makes it more embarrassing is we have more talent than 50% of the teams in the league.

I mean, this is the same gap tooth looser that blitzes on victory formation....Shiano needed here? Thats like saying Raheem and Youngry movement was needed here..


I actually love seeing that. if its a one possession game, and there is still a chance to win the game(however miniscule it may be), then do what u have to. and by now, people know to expect it.

And when has that actually worked for us? If you see victory formation at the end of the 4th, clearly you lost...accept it. Blitzing against it is like a 10 year old that cant accept a loss at a game of checkers, and instead of taking the loss he instead picks up the table and flips it over


Just because it hasnt worked, doesnt mean it cant. u could look at it like that(10 yr. old flipping the board) or u could look at it like a boxer knowing hes lost on points, so he has to sell out for the knockout. as long is it a 1 possession game, i have no problem w/ it.


Again I have no problem with it as long as we're within one possession.

It's worked in the past. If you want to avoid if. Have the qb drop back into shot gun and kneel it. Teams know its coming. Man up.
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REDandPEWTER


Joined: 31 Aug 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looks like freeman might be re-uniting with Olsen.
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Bucs00


Joined: 14 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
Bucs00 wrote:
^Well said. Schiano was needed here. He didn't give us many wins, but he cleaned up the mess. If he could have softened his apporoach this year, he might have done better.


I'm sorry but I fully disagree. Shiano was needed here?? Cleaned up the mess??? How exactly????????

In case I'm the only one that noticed, we are 0-4 and we are the most pathetic/laughed at Franchise in the NFL.

Before I said that Browns,Raiders, and Jags are more pathetic than we are, but in reality their not. We are the most pathetic franchise today. Browns are first in the AFC North and have 2 first round picks. Raiders at least have 1 win. Jags are terrible but outside of 3-4 players, they have no talent on that roster so its understandable. But us? We are 0-4 with a roster that is beyond loaded with talent, and are also all over the media in the most negative ways.

So what did Shiano clean up exactly...the discipline? So he came in and treated our players like they are first year 18 year old college kids. And guess what....now we are the most pathetic franchise there is, and what makes it more embarrassing is we have more talent than 50% of the teams in the league.

I mean, this is the same gap tooth looser that blitzes on victory formation....Shiano needed here? Thats like saying Raheem and Youngry movement was needed here..


Disclaimer: Its very late so i don't guarantee any of this text makes any sense.

I have heard so much hate for Schiano everywhere that i try to come up with different perspective. He is not nearly as bad as people make him out to be. I am not saying he has been amazing. He has some clear weaknesses.

This is how i see it. Schiano was perfect coach to finish the rebuilding process. He did all the dirty work for who ever will be next coach. He got rid of some pretty good players to achieve better locker rooms. His disciplinary approach was very much needed here.

I have to disagree with the most pathetic franchise part. I look at the way Bucs are playing and not what media is saying. This season might be first time since the infamous Pathers game that Buccaneers resemble an NFL team. Obliviously still some big problems, but Bucs are few plays away from being 3-1.

Again, i am not huge Schiano fan, but i think he is better than people give him credit for.
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tml_gogo


Joined: 01 Feb 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 5:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Schiano is awful. Mediocre college coach.
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Calibucsfan


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
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Location: Los Angeles CA
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EDIT:Sorry Double Post
_________________
wrote:
Get on the yearly Buc carousel. Start off trash. Look better by mid season. Win 2-3 games at the end of the season. Get the 7th pick. Have what most fans consider a great draft and free agency. Start off trash again. Rinse and repeat


Last edited by Calibucsfan on Sat Oct 05, 2013 8:24 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Calibucsfan


Joined: 05 Sep 2011
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Location: Los Angeles CA
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BucBall_76 wrote:
Just because it hasnt worked, doesnt mean it cant. u could look at it like that(10 yr. old flipping the board) or u could look at it like a boxer knowing hes lost on points, so he has to sell out for the knockout. as long is it a 1 possession game, i have no problem w/ it.


You have no problem with it, that's great. It still makes our team look like a bunch of angry 10 year old kids who cant take a loss.

Answer me this, out of all the teams that went on to win the superbowl, how many of them blitzed against victory formation? And this goes for pre-season, regular season, post season, and Super Bowl
Bucs00 wrote:
Disclaimer: Its very late so i don't guarantee any of this text makes any sense.

I have heard so much hate for Schiano everywhere that i try to come up with different perspective. He is not nearly as bad as people make him out to be. I am not saying he has been amazing. He has some clear weaknesses.

This is how i see it. Schiano was perfect coach to finish the rebuilding process. He did all the dirty work for who ever will be next coach. He got rid of some pretty good players to achieve better locker rooms. His disciplinary approach was very much needed here.

I have to disagree with the most pathetic franchise part. I look at the way Bucs are playing and not what media is saying. This season might be first time since the infamous Pathers game that Buccaneers resemble an NFL team. Obliviously still some big problems, but Bucs are few plays away from being 3-1.

Again, i am not huge Schiano fan, but i think he is better than people give him credit for.


You make 0 sense.

We are a few plays away from being 3-1? This is the NFL dude, it don't matter if you lost on 4th and inches by 1 point or you got blown out by 50...a loss is still a loss and at the end of the day you get judged based on your record.

I mean if we look at it your way, the 2009 Minnisota Vikings should of went on to the Superbowl if Bret Favre would of just took a slide forward instead of throwing a stupid and unnecessary pick. But is that how people remember the 09 season...as the Vikings that SHOULD have went to the Superbowl? No, everyone remembers the Saints getting their first title over the Colts.

And we are not the most pathetic franchise there is??? Really??? So tell me who is more pathetic than us right now?

And Shiano may have been a perfect guy for us on paper, but when he got here he was not a good fit at all. He did not "fix" anything. Discipline? We are 0-4...at least under Raheem's "undisciplined" team we managed to go 10-6 and we were somewhat respectable that year.

tml_gogo wrote:
I think Schiano is awful. Mediocre college coach.

DING DING DING!! Finally, someone who makes some sense
_________________
wrote:
Get on the yearly Buc carousel. Start off trash. Look better by mid season. Win 2-3 games at the end of the season. Get the 7th pick. Have what most fans consider a great draft and free agency. Start off trash again. Rinse and repeat
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BucBall_76


Joined: 06 Dec 2008
Posts: 1048
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
BucBall_76 wrote:
Just because it hasnt worked, doesnt mean it cant. u could look at it like that(10 yr. old flipping the board) or u could look at it like a boxer knowing hes lost on points, so he has to sell out for the knockout. as long is it a 1 possession game, i have no problem w/ it.


You have no problem with it, that's great. It still makes our team look like a bunch of angry 10 year old kids who cant take a loss.

Answer me this, out of all the teams that went on to win the superbowl, how many of them blitzed against victory formation? And this goes for pre-season, regular season, post season, and Super Bowl

Bucs00 wrote:
Disclaimer: Its very late so i don't guarantee any of this text makes any sense.

I have heard so much hate for Schiano everywhere that i try to come up with different perspective. He is not nearly as bad as people make him out to be. I am not saying he has been amazing. He has some clear weaknesses.

This is how i see it. Schiano was perfect coach to finish the rebuilding process. He did all the dirty work for who ever will be next coach. He got rid of some pretty good players to achieve better locker rooms. His disciplinary approach was very much needed here.

I have to disagree with the most pathetic franchise part. I look at the way Bucs are playing and not what media is saying. This season might be first time since the infamous Pathers game that Buccaneers resemble an NFL team. Obliviously still some big problems, but Bucs are few plays away from being 3-1.

Again, i am not huge Schiano fan, but i think he is better than people give him credit for.


You make 0 sense.

We are a few plays away from being 3-1? This is the NFL dude, it don't matter if you lost on 4th and inches by 1 point or you got blown out by 50...a loss is still a loss and at the end of the day you get judged based on your record.

I mean if we look at it your way, the 2009 Minnisota Vikings should of went on to the Superbowl if Bret Favre would of just took a slide forward instead of throwing a stupid and unnecessary pick. But is that how people remember the 09 season...as the Vikings that SHOULD have went to the Superbowl? No, everyone remembers the Saints getting their first title over the Colts.

And we are not the most pathetic franchise there is??? Really??? So tell me who is more pathetic than us right now?

And Shiano may have been a perfect guy for us on paper, but when he got here he was not a good fit at all. He did not "fix" anything. Discipline? We are 0-4...at least under Raheem's "undisciplined" team we managed to go 10-6 and we were somewhat respectable that year.

tml_gogo wrote:
I think Schiano is awful. Mediocre college coach.

DING DING DING!! Finally, someone who makes some sense


Schiano said after the cards game, that that play is up to the players(could be lying, could be telling the truth). so if they wanna run it, whats the problem? ur making a mountain out of a mole hill IMHO. that play isnt the root of our problem. Had that play worked, Schiano would be looked at like the 2nd coming of einstein, and i would venture to guess a couple teams would follow suit.

When the pats got busted for spygate, and then completely obliterated teams the next year and people were up in arms and crying that the pats were running up the score, u think fans and the organization cared what the league and people thought? hell no. Why? because winning is the ultimate deodorant, it cures all. just as losing can be the ultimate cancer.

again, just because something hasnt been done before(a super bowl winning team blitzing on the victory formation) doesnt mean it cant or never will happen. i mean, at one point in time, the vast majority of people thought the world was flat.
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Calibucsfan


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 9:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BucBall_76 wrote:
Schiano said after the cards game, that that play is up to the players(could be lying, could be telling the truth). so if they wanna run it, whats the problem? ur making a mountain out of a mole hill IMHO. that play isnt the root of our problem. Had that play worked, Schiano would be looked at like the 2nd coming of einstein, and i would venture to guess a couple teams would follow suit.

When the pats got busted for spygate, and then completely obliterated teams the next year and people were up in arms and crying that the pats were running up the score, u think fans and the organization cared what the league and people thought? hell no. Why? because winning is the ultimate deodorant, it cures all. just as losing can be the ultimate cancer.

again, just because something hasnt been done before(a super bowl winning team blitzing on the victory formation) doesnt mean it cant or never will happen. i mean, at one point in time, the vast majority of people thought the world was flat.


Except what Pats did actually worked. You have a better chance to win the lottery rather than causing a fumble against victory formation at the NFL level.

Its pathetic and cheap, like how do you not get that?

And I highly doubt ANY Super Bowl winning team has tried blitzing the victory formation. As a matter of fact, I don't believe that coaches like John Madden, - Vermiel, Don Shula, Bill Cowher....etc, none of those great coaches have ever blitzed against vicotry formation....I'm pretty sure that the only coaches who attacked victory formation is a bunch of losers like Shiano
_________________
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Get on the yearly Buc carousel. Start off trash. Look better by mid season. Win 2-3 games at the end of the season. Get the 7th pick. Have what most fans consider a great draft and free agency. Start off trash again. Rinse and repeat
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BucBall_76


Joined: 06 Dec 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
BucBall_76 wrote:
Schiano said after the cards game, that that play is up to the players(could be lying, could be telling the truth). so if they wanna run it, whats the problem? ur making a mountain out of a mole hill IMHO. that play isnt the root of our problem. Had that play worked, Schiano would be looked at like the 2nd coming of einstein, and i would venture to guess a couple teams would follow suit.

When the pats got busted for spygate, and then completely obliterated teams the next year and people were up in arms and crying that the pats were running up the score, u think fans and the organization cared what the league and people thought? hell no. Why? because winning is the ultimate deodorant, it cures all. just as losing can be the ultimate cancer.

again, just because something hasnt been done before(a super bowl winning team blitzing on the victory formation) doesnt mean it cant or never will happen. i mean, at one point in time, the vast majority of people thought the world was flat.


Except what Pats did actually worked. You have a better chance to win the lottery rather than causing a fumble against victory formation at the NFL level.

Its pathetic and cheap, like how do you not get that?

And I highly doubt ANY Super Bowl winning team has tried blitzing the victory formation. As a matter of fact, I don't believe that coaches like John Madden, - Vermiel, Don Shula, Bill Cowher....etc, none of those great coaches have ever blitzed against vicotry formation....I'm pretty sure that the only coaches who attacked victory formation is a bunch of losers like Shiano


Any #s to prove i have a better shot at winning the lottery vs blitzing the V formation?

what the pats did worked? last time i checked they lost the super bowl. isnt that the only goal?

Down more than one possession, i agree, its cheap. But if its a one possession game, its fair game. i would want my coach to do anything in his power and w/ in the rules to try and win the game if its in the balance.

Ur hate for Schiano is very apparent. but as i said earlier, schiano has bigger problems than blitzing on the V formation.
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Calibucsfan


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

BucBall_76 wrote:

Any #s to prove i have a better shot at winning the lottery vs blitzing the V formation?

what the pats did worked? last time i checked they lost the super bowl. isnt that the only goal?

Down more than one possession, i agree, its cheap. But if its a one possession game, its fair game. i would want my coach to do anything in his power and w/ in the rules to try and win the game if its in the balance.

Ur hate for Schiano is very apparent. but as i said earlier, schiano has bigger problems than blitzing on the V formation.


Well, I will say this...someone actually does win the lottery every so often. Show me a game from the NFL where blitzing the victory formation worked, please do.

And like I said, no Super Bowl or respectable coach has ever blitzed victory formation, only the official league of looser coaches have done that(such as Shiano)
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wrote:
Get on the yearly Buc carousel. Start off trash. Look better by mid season. Win 2-3 games at the end of the season. Get the 7th pick. Have what most fans consider a great draft and free agency. Start off trash again. Rinse and repeat
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BucBall_76


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 10:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/512472-the-top-10-dirtiest-teams-in-sports-history/page/9

"The Raiders had a league-wide reputation for taking cheap shots at will, before and after the play. Steelers head coach Chuck Noll once referred to the Raiders as the "criminal element of pro football." Perhaps Noll was right.

Oakland's dirty play stretched beyond the actual game. Head coach John Madden and the organization were often criticized for letting the grass at Oakland-Alameda County Coliseum grow untamed for days before games. There is even a tale that Madden once let the field flood the night before a game."

u mean that john madden?
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BucBall_76


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Calibucsfan wrote:
BucBall_76 wrote:

Any #s to prove i have a better shot at winning the lottery vs blitzing the V formation?

what the pats did worked? last time i checked they lost the super bowl. isnt that the only goal?

Down more than one possession, i agree, its cheap. But if its a one possession game, its fair game. i would want my coach to do anything in his power and w/ in the rules to try and win the game if its in the balance.

Ur hate for Schiano is very apparent. but as i said earlier, schiano has bigger problems than blitzing on the V formation.


Well, I will say this...someone actually does win the lottery every so often. Show me a game from the NFL where blitzing the victory formation worked, please do.

And like I said, no Super Bowl or respectable coach has ever blitzed victory formation, only the official league of looser coaches have done that(such as Shiano)


Doesnt change the odds of it happening. ive heard ur more likely to get struck by lightning twice than winning the lotto.
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BucBall_76


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2013 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lysQ8xt_Css

Oh look, - Vermiel.

Granted the fumble didnt occur when blitzing on a kneeldown, the fact that the eagles were doing it, made the giants alter their strategy. had they just let the giants fall on the ball, game over. but they didnt, and won the game.
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