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Saints RB Mark Ingram expected to seek trade from Saints
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whodatworm23


Joined: 23 Dec 2006
Posts: 3295
Location: Nawlins
PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jcvoodoo wrote:
whodatworm23 wrote:
Canadian Saint wrote:
People may not agree with Sec104, but he's right on some level. None of our RBs have consistently produced. Yeah Ingram has sucked this season, but neither PT nor Sproles nor Khiry have consistently given us 4 YPC.

I'm not saying Ingram hasn't sucked, and his attitude hasn't helped, but people completely disregard the fact that the other RBs on this roster haven't produced. It's simple as that. Not to mention, it's been seen that when Ingram is on the field, he sees something like 8 people in the box consistently (he was top-10 last year). That combined with our crappy run blocking, forgive me for understanding where some of his struggles have come from.

And no, I don't have a man crush on Ingram or anything, so save me that nonsense.


I think the problem with Ingram will and always be tied to the expectations with him. Ingram is a 1st & 2nd round selection and with that comes high expectations and while none of the other runners have done tremendously better... there production is still MUCH better than Ingram's.

We can talk all we want about how it doesn't matter how a player got here but the fact is that it does especially in the eyes of fans. Now as far as Ingram facing 8 in the box... blame that on Sean Payton for putting Ingram in a situation to fail because defense's understand, they watch tape. When Ingram is in the game 75% of the time the defense already knows whats coming. No that is not Ingram's fault, that is Payton's but what is Payton's reasoning behind the lack of diversity in his play calling when Ingram is in the game? Could it be that Ingram has still not proven to be anything more than a runner after 3 seasons in the NFL? If so then it's on both of them!

My point is that regardless of what and where you want to cast the blame on Mark Ingram's failures with the Saints, to me it all boils down to two things...

1. Sean Payton isn't going anywhere and isn't changing his style for no one.
2. Mark Ingram will never be successful in Sean Payton's offense.

So, what to do? I think the answer is clear...


I think it is obvious what we need to do in the draft. Get young, explosive OW/RB and revamp the OL. This does not mean go purely offense this draft. If defensive BPA outweighs an offensive BPA, then you need to make 2 + 2 = 4 not 14. Just my two pennies... take it or leave it

Oh, and for the record I have been and will continue to show support/have faith in Mark Ingram. I will also be realistic too.


I think another issue with the Saints running game, (and I find it funny this has not been mentioned yet) is the fact that the Saints have gone to more of a zone concept this season. They always ran some sort of interior zone at times but Payton has made an emphasis this season to install more of it as well as the outside zone game which they never ran in the past. This scheme requires more athletic offensive lineman making Strief a horrid fit in the blocking concepts the Saints are trying to employ now on the edge. Brown, Grubbs, Puente & Armstead are tailor made for this scheme but the zone BS requires timing and repetition as well as trust and this offensive line has not had enough time either in the system nor along side each other. Grubbs and Brown are in their first year together as starters on the left side and Strief isn't a fit on the right. Armstead is an ideal fit with his athletic ability but just wasn't ready to start as a rookie. Sean Payton even requested Evans to drop weight in the offseason in order to fit this new scheme better.

It's clearly new to everyone and the line isn't cohesive yet but it seems they are slowly getting a lil better. I feel Armstead will supplant Strief on the right side next season and that will give us the O-line to grow with but this scheme takes time to master.

I was also very surprised with how much zone I found out Alabama ran when Ingram was there... I think this has been a couple years in the making but progress was delayed with the suprising year long suspension of Payton last season. I'm never one to make excuses for players but the problems with the Saints running game as a whole is more than any one player and or coach... its a collective effort and looking deeper into it, will likely be a problem for a while.
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Sec104row6


Joined: 22 Sep 2013
Posts: 41
PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
Come on guys, Ingram sucks because he sucks. Who's fault is it that he's not a threat to catch the ball? His. He doesn't suck because teams know he's going to run. He sucks because he can't break tackles, he has poor vision and he has no agility to speak of. The guy was a huge bust, its as simple as that.


He broke 7 tackles against Dallas, rushed for the highest total yards in several years and has the highest per carry average on the team.

LMFAO...
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SWATcha


Joined: 10 Sep 2008
Posts: 1772
Location: Sacto, CA.
PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sec104row6 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Come on guys, Ingram sucks because he sucks. Who's fault is it that he's not a threat to catch the ball? His. He doesn't suck because teams know he's going to run. He sucks because he can't break tackles, he has poor vision and he has no agility to speak of. The guy was a huge bust, its as simple as that.


He broke 7 tackles against Dallas, rushed for the highest total yards in several years and has the highest per carry average on the team.

LMFAO...


Body of work. One great game doesn't suddenly erase all the bad ones...

Hopefully Ingram has turned a corner and has a fire under his rear. I'm not going to hold my breath though. The Dallas D wasn't exactly trying to stop anyone. Let's see how Ingram does running the gauntlet of SF, Seattle, Carolinax2, Rams, and Tampa.
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domepatrol91


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Joined: 26 Mar 2013
Posts: 4912
PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2013 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sec104row6 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Come on guys, Ingram sucks because he sucks. Who's fault is it that he's not a threat to catch the ball? His. He doesn't suck because teams know he's going to run. He sucks because he can't break tackles, he has poor vision and he has no agility to speak of. The guy was a huge bust, its as simple as that.


He broke 7 tackles against Dallas, rushed for the highest total yards in several years and has the highest per carry average on the team.

LMFAO...


On December 20th, 2009, Jerome Harrison rushed for 286 yards and 3 TDs. One of the best rushing performances of all time.

He ended his career with a whopping 1681 yards and 7 TDs.

I'm gonna need more than 1 big game from Ingram before I change my mind about him.
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Brandin Cooks - 53 receptions, 550 yards, 25 first downs, 3 TD - 7 rushes, 73 yards, 4 first downs, 1 TD
Corey White - 44 tackles, 2 INT, 1 sack, 6 passes defended, 1 forced fumble, 1 fumble recovery
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whodatworm23


Joined: 23 Dec 2006
Posts: 3295
Location: Nawlins
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

domepatrol91 wrote:
Sec104row6 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Come on guys, Ingram sucks because he sucks. Who's fault is it that he's not a threat to catch the ball? His. He doesn't suck because teams know he's going to run. He sucks because he can't break tackles, he has poor vision and he has no agility to speak of. The guy was a huge bust, its as simple as that.


He broke 7 tackles against Dallas, rushed for the highest total yards in several years and has the highest per carry average on the team.

LMFAO...


On December 20th, 2009, Jerome Harrison rushed for 286 yards and 3 TDs. One of the best rushing performances of all time.

He ended his career with a whopping 1681 yards and 7 TDs.

I'm gonna need more than 1 big game from Ingram before I change my mind about him.


Agreed!

The only thing the Cowboy game told me about Ingram was, maybe... MAYBE, the guy isn't a BUST!

THat don't mean I think he's the answer, only that ill hold judgment until the end of this season.
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Harper41


Joined: 29 Aug 2009
Posts: 23089
Location: Roll Tide Country
PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sec104row6 wrote:
Harper41 wrote:
Come on guys, Ingram sucks because he sucks. Who's fault is it that he's not a threat to catch the ball? His. He doesn't suck because teams know he's going to run. He sucks because he can't break tackles, he has poor vision and he has no agility to speak of. The guy was a huge bust, its as simple as that.


He broke 7 tackles against Dallas, rushed for the highest total yards in several years and has the highest per carry average on the team.

LMFAO...

He had his first career game over 100 yards against a miserable defense that had no Sean Lee, no Anthony Spencer and Demarcus Ware on one good leg? Oh. Color me unimpressed. Mark Ingram is absolutely still a bust until he proves he can do this for longer than ONE game.

LMFAO...
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Thought someone broke into my house.
Jumped out of bed (left my brother)
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domepatrol91


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Joined: 26 Mar 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 14, 2013 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Harper41 wrote:
He had his first career game over 100 yards


That was his first game of over 100 yards from scrimmage, let alone rushing yards Laughing

Bush's first game of 100 yards from scrimmage was his first game. That really puts things into perspective.
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Brandin Cooks - 53 receptions, 550 yards, 25 first downs, 3 TD - 7 rushes, 73 yards, 4 first downs, 1 TD
Corey White - 44 tackles, 2 INT, 1 sack, 6 passes defended, 1 forced fumble, 1 fumble recovery
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