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H2ThaIzzo


Joined: 15 Jan 2009
Posts: 4137
Location: Ohio
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:11 am    Post subject: Montee Ball Reply with quote

This past weeks game will likely be one of the only ones I get to see being in Ohio without the ticket, but when I watched the game, I was wondering what the rookies role is and if you guys think that his role will expand as the season progresses. Moreno has never shown the potential he had coming out of Georgia, and against Baltimore, I think Hillman looked pretty good as a pass catching option, but I didn't really see other than that why either of them would be taking reps away from Ball. What are your opinions? His YPC ended up being bad, but those first few runs of his were pretty impressive, he fought for yards and looked impossible to bring down one on one. Opinions? Thanks fellas
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JerseysFinest27


Joined: 07 Jan 2010
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Location: New Jersey... Props to inDENguise on the sig
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In the end, I think the plan is for Ball to be the 1st and 2nd down back with Hillman spelling him. However, until either Ball/Hillman learn to pass protect, they wont spell Moreno. This offense is predicated on keeping Manning upright and Moreno is the best back at doing that.

Right now it looks like:
Moreno = Pass protector
Hillman = Scat back
Ball = short yardage back

I think we will continue to see a Running Back by Committee until someone proves they can do more than what theyre doing right now.
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iLikeDefense


Joined: 03 Jan 2010
Posts: 2567
Location: San Diego
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JerseysFinest27 wrote:
In the end, I think the plan is for Ball to be the 1st and 2nd down back with Hillman spelling him. However, until either Ball/Hillman learn to pass protect, they wont spell Moreno. This offense is predicated on keeping Manning upright and Moreno is the best back at doing that.

Right now it looks like:
Moreno = Pass protector
Hillman = Scat back
Ball = short yardage back

I think we will continue to see a Running Back by Committee until someone proves they can do more than what theyre doing right now.


I agree with this, although in my opinion I think Hillman will be on the field more if he doesn't fumble, I thought he looked better at pass blocking this pre-season and in game 1.
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champ+jay+al=SB


Joined: 10 Mar 2007
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Location: Boulder
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone taking Broncos backs somewhat early in fantasy was definitely making a mistake lol.

I could see CJ Anderson scoring some short touchdowns later this year.
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TheChosen186


Joined: 07 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

-Montee Ball is the best overall runner
-Knowshon Moreno is the best blocker and most experienced RB
-Ronnie Hillman is the biggest playmaker/game changer.

They all bring different things to the table.

Knowshon gets the edge over both because this team has Peyton Manning and pass protecting is the most important thing in this system. I do think that if Mike Shanahan was still the coach, Ball would probably start or Hillman. It certainly wouldn't be Moreno because Shanahan emphasizes pretty strongly on the run game.
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AnAngryAmerican


Joined: 23 Apr 2006
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Location: Loveland, CO
PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheChosen186 wrote:
-Montee Ball is the best overall runner.

No.

The only superlative you can give to Montee Ball is that he's the RB that sucks the most. He really doesn't do anything well - he can't run, he can't catch and he can't block. He's a rookie who is still learning. If Elway thought he was getting a back who could step in and excel from day 1 he was wrong because Montee, as much as I like his skillset, has clearly proven he is not in any way ready to play in this offense at anything resembling a #1 RB level. I certainly hope he improves, improves markedly and improves quickly and I'm not going to call him a bust or anything approaching as such now but he's got a long, long way to go.

This coaching staff and, for that matter, this organization as a whole, wants desperately for Ball and Hillman to be the #1A and 1B RBs and they had to go and start Knowshon in week 1. What does that say?
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TheChosen186


Joined: 07 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:

This coaching staff and, for that matter, this organization as a whole, wants desperately for Ball and Hillman to be the #1A and 1B RBs and they had to go and start Knowshon in week 1. What does that say?

They made a lot of mistakes in the preseason. Ball with bad pass protection similar to Hillman last season and Hillman with fumbling issues. If Hillman didn't have ball-security issue, he would pretty easily be the starting RB right now.

Ball is a good runner. He has the skillset and the intangibles to be a good RB in the league. I think he can be an Alfred Morris/Arian Foster type RB. I would give him some time.
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AnAngryAmerican


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheChosen186 wrote:
If Hillman didn't have ball-security issue, he would pretty easily be the starting RB right now.

And if I was 6'7" 270lbs and could run a 4.6 I could pretty easily be Gronk. "If..." means nothing when you can't do the other things.

TheChosen186 wrote:
Ball is a good runner. He has the skillset and the intangibles to be a good RB in the league. I think he can be an Alfred Morris/Arian Foster type RB. I would give him some time.

Yeah on paper (his mesasureables) and on another sheet of paper (his college resume} he looks great. So did Knowhon at this point in 2009.

Look, I like Montee Ball, I think he has the skillset to play in this league and play for a long time but from what I've seen at camp, in the preseason and last week against the Ravens I see a player who has an awfully long way to go. Let's not compare him to anyone who has actually done something in this league until he actually does something in this league.
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TheChosen186


Joined: 07 Sep 2013
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

AnAngryAmerican wrote:
Yeah on paper (his mesasureables) and on another sheet of paper (his college resume} he looks great. So did Knowhon at this point in 2009.

I never agreed with drafting Knowshon in 2009. I actually thought McCoy was going to be better and he was. I remember a lot of people thinking Moreno was going to be better and even Eagles fans wanting Moreno though.

Moreno has had all sorts of issues since being in Denver. I recall him having ball security issues himself in his rookie season. He has been having nagging injuries throughout his career too. It didn't surprise me one bit when he lost the starting job to McGahee when McGahee arrived.

Quote:
Look, I like Montee Ball, I think he has the skillset to play in this league and play for a long time but from what I've seen at camp, in the preseason and last week against the Ravens I see a player who has an awfully long way to go. Let's not compare him to anyone who has actually done something in this league until he actually does something in this league.
I said he can and has the potential be like those two guys based on his skillset and the way he plays. I didn't say he was already on their level and he will be there. We will have to wait and see if he can produce though. I have the patience for him.
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broncos67


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ronnie Hillman is the best pure runner on this team. I really do believe in him, despite his size. He has the most explosiveness, and he has the POTENTIAL to be the biggest weapon on the team. He's also, I believe, still the youngest guy on the team. I think Hillman is the guy who will eventually see the most touches.

Knowshon is the safest player on the team. He's not glamorous, he's slow as molasses, he'll definitely get injured, BUT, he will be able to (mostly) pass block effectively, he's definitely the best receiving option at RB, an area that I think he has value in, and he's good for some yardage when he makes his mind up. That said, way too slow to be starting for this team.

Montee Ball is a decent receiving option, but his pass blocking is woefully inadequate. Ball, when he doesn't dance like a fool gets upfield for decent yardage quickly. I think he's going to be better than people give him credit for, but I don't think he'll ever be a bellcow.

CJ Anderson, to me, is the true wildcard here. They gave him the biggest signing bonus behind Lerentee McCray as a UDFA, a sign that they really liked him coming out. I liked what I've seen from Anderson as well, and frankly, there's something brewing here. The staff wouldn't have kept him on the 53 if they didn't like him. And that's WITH an injury. My guess- if he gets healthy soon and performs well (given the chance) Knowshon will be gone in favor of him.
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lomaxgr


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought Ball had a couple of decent runs against Baltimore, most notably on 2nd down when we ran 2 plays out a 3 TE set (tough to run out of when a team loads the box and 2 of those TEs aren't the best blockers).

As AAA eluded to - he's a rookie. On 3rd and 1 we called an inside zone play that Ball didn't wait for the play to develop, and was swallowed up at the LOS. A typical rookie mistake.

Hillman frustrates me, in that he is quick and tends to make good reads for the most part, but he can't break tackles whatsoever and his fumbling means we can't trust him at all. I actually think Hillman is our best threat from RB in the passing game rather than Moreno, and Hillman has blocked pretty well in the preseason and vs the Ravens.

Knowshon is Knowshon. Decent runner, decent blocker, good hands, knows the system. Oh, and celebrates each run like he has busted a Walter Payton run on someone.
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AKRNA


Joined: 28 May 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

broncos67 wrote:


CJ Anderson, to me, is the true wildcard here. They gave him the biggest signing bonus behind Lerentee McCray as a UDFA, a sign that they really liked him coming out. I liked what I've seen from Anderson as well, and frankly, there's something brewing here. The staff wouldn't have kept him on the 53 if they didn't like him. And that's WITH an injury. My guess- if he gets healthy soon and performs well (given the chance) Knowshon will be gone in favor of him.


That's an interesting option. I'm looking forward to seeing it.
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TheChosen186


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

broncos67 wrote:
Ronnie Hillman is the best pure runner on this team. I really do believe in him, despite his size. He has the most explosiveness, and he has the POTENTIAL to be the biggest weapon on the team. He's also, I believe, still the youngest guy on the team. I think Hillman is the guy who will eventually see the most touches.

I don't think Hillman is the best pure runner because he isn't that good on the inside, doesn't secure the ball as well, and doesn't have a nose for the end zone the same way Ball does. It is why I think Ball is the best pure runner because he is a pretty rounded back that can run any type of situation. Ball is not the home run hitter that Hillman is and he certainly isn't the blocker.

I agree that Hillman will probably end up getting the most touches among the Denver RBs unless he messes it all up by fumbling some more.
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elwayfan07


Joined: 13 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheChosen186 wrote:
broncos67 wrote:
Ronnie Hillman is the best pure runner on this team. I really do believe in him, despite his size. He has the most explosiveness, and he has the POTENTIAL to be the biggest weapon on the team. He's also, I believe, still the youngest guy on the team. I think Hillman is the guy who will eventually see the most touches.

I don't think Hillman is the best pure runner because he isn't that good on the inside, doesn't secure the ball as well, and doesn't have a nose for the end zone the same way Ball does. It is why I think Ball is the best pure runner because he is a pretty rounded back that can run any type of situation. Ball is not the home run hitter that Hillman is and he certainly isn't the blocker.

I agree that Hillman will probably end up getting the most touches among the Denver RBs unless he messes it all up by fumbling some more.


I think it is dangerous to assume Ball is just going to pick up where he left off in college. He still looks way to hesitant. The game is moving way too fast for him and he is atrocious in pass protecting. Now, none of this is unusual for a rookie but he has a long way before he resembles anything like an everydown back. Right know Knowshon is the safest bet. He isn't anything special... but he is Denvers best bet until Hillman learns how to hang on to the football.
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rhuston


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2013 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Montee Ball makes KM look like a sprinter and finishes weaker than Hillman. I think it is clear who the number one back on this team is. KM is slow but at least he realized that and said I need to finish with power which he surely does. That "trash" back that many of you keep referring to just keeps chugging along. When healthy he does produce.
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