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What are the Jets going to do about the horrible O line
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green24


Joined: 10 Apr 2010
Posts: 47651
PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandwhich wrote:
Howard didn't miss a single block all game as far as I can remember. He did have an early holding penalty and someone on a blog website (can't remember where) got on him about letting his blocker go too quickly on a screen play. Had a strong push in the running game as well, and they started stunting his DE to the inside at Ducasse to get him some production.

I believe that was Bent on TJB.
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jetsfan4life51


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.
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green24


Joined: 10 Apr 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.
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sandwhich


Joined: 25 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

green24 wrote:
jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.


People overreact, but there's been enough occasions where Howard has been hurt by a lack of footwork and initial step. He seems to be progressing a lot though as he was last season. He's getting a lot less help from the scheme and TEs when last year he got it probably the majority of the time.
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jetsfan4life51


Joined: 12 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandwhich wrote:
green24 wrote:
jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.


People overreact, but there's been enough occasions where Howard has been hurt by a lack of footwork and initial step. He seems to be progressing a lot though as he was last season. He's getting a lot less help from the scheme and TEs when last year he got it probably the majority of the time.


Not saying he's Brick at RT, but people made him out to be Anthony Clement.
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ekill08x


Joined: 05 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

green24 wrote:
jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.


Because Harris is insanely slow for an ILB and has a 13 million dollar cap hit. Hes nowhere near worth that. Hes maybe worth half. Hes excellent against the run, as good as anyone, but hes terrible in coverage because of his lack of speed. He did look really good though against the Bucs as did DeMario.
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sharpy


Joined: 12 Apr 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

They have to be able to run the friggin ball! Plain and simple, other than Geno, they sucked. Our O line was the biggest reason. Please, quit defending these guys! We need a mean streak! Winters is the answer along with new personnel. Our D rocks though and we are going to give a lot of teams a problem. If Ivory doesnt break out against BUFF, ITS TIME TO RE-LOAD. A lot of this relies on our O line play. Goodsen will be a pleasant surprise in week 6!
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werds35


Joined: 01 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did anyone watch Winters in preseason? I thought he was awful. he spent a lot of time on the ground, completely whiffed on a few blocks.

He's gonna need a lot of refinement before he's ready.

I also thought Ferguson played way below his par against Tampa, but that could be because of the Ducasse situation. Hopefully with more snaps, Ducasse settles down.
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sandwhich


Joined: 25 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

werds35 wrote:
Did anyone watch Winters in preseason? I thought he was awful. he spent a lot of time on the ground, completely whiffed on a few blocks.

He's gonna need a lot of refinement before he's ready.

I also thought Ferguson played way below his par against Tampa, but that could be because of the Ducasse situation. Hopefully with more snaps, Ducasse settles down.


Winters suffered from a lack of time in camp because of injuries, but he looked absolutely lost in pre-season. I really don't expect him to be an upgrade at any point during this season but he should be able to get it together for next season. I have faith in him to become something. He showed a lot of strength in the running game and as a pull-blocker.
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Jetsfandan423


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandwhich wrote:
green24 wrote:
jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.


People overreact, but there's been enough occasions where Howard has been hurt by a lack of footwork and initial step. He seems to be progressing a lot though as he was last season. He's getting a lot less help from the scheme and TEs when last year he got it probably the majority of the time.




Yeah, Howard is more solid if anything. Last year was his first full season starting so he is still developing.

Harris is slow. No if ands or buts about it. He isn't worth the contract we gave him. I'm glad he is on the team, but it's a position we can upgrade in the offseason.
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teamorange


Joined: 15 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandwhich wrote:
green24 wrote:
jetsfan4life51 wrote:
Never understood why people ripped Howard. Just like I never understood why people rip Harris.

Amen.


People overreact, but there's been enough occasions where Howard has been hurt by a lack of footwork and initial step. He seems to be progressing a lot though as he was last season. He's getting a lot less help from the scheme and TEs when last year he got it probably the majority of the time.


I have no problem with Howard as our RT. He is average in every sense of the word and there is nothing wrong with that. But when people are talking about giving him a 20 million dollar contract, which is top 5 money for a RT, that where I draw the line. He 2-3 million dollar player MAX. If he wants more than that then I'll just look in the third round of next years draft or go for a vet on a one year deal.

Harris is decent but he has taken some major steps back and shouldn't be making 13 million a year. He crippled us financially (along with Pace, Scott, Sanchez, Pouha, etc etc) which is why I can't wait to see him off the books. It bugs me to no end that we have been offering big contracts to low value positions. You can make due with an average ILB, they aren't game changers.
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quietjetsket wrote:
skrILL wrote:

Care to offer some sort of insight instead of just being obnoxious? Rolling Eyes
I don't.

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Bobikus


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

According to multiple NFL.com writers the line was entirely fine and every sack was all on Geno.
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Jetsfandan423


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bobikus wrote:
According to multiple NFL.com writers the line was entirely fine and every sack was all on Geno.




He does need to get the ball out quicker, especially on blitzes.
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Bobikus


Joined: 07 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 2:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jetsfandan423 wrote:
Bobikus wrote:
According to multiple NFL.com writers the line was entirely fine and every sack was all on Geno.




He does need to get the ball out quicker, especially on blitzes.


Yeah, but the line also had a few plays where someone came unblocked and Geno had nothing he could do but protect the ball and go down. I always find it interesting how people can never seem to realize that the line can look good and give time on a lot of plays in the game, but also completely whiff a block and give up an immediate sack on others.

It's something that became apparent for me as a Steelers fan with Ben's tendency to hold the ball. The last time PFF charted time to throw/time to sack, Ben had a high time to throw because of him holding the ball and trying to extend plays, but a really low time to sack, because the actual sacks happened mostly on plays where a lineman was immediately beat or the RB didn't pick up the blitzer and Ben took a hit a second after the snap.
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sandwhich


Joined: 25 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2013 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bobikus wrote:
Jetsfandan423 wrote:
Bobikus wrote:
According to multiple NFL.com writers the line was entirely fine and every sack was all on Geno.




He does need to get the ball out quicker, especially on blitzes.


Yeah, but the line also had a few plays where someone came unblocked and Geno had nothing he could do but protect the ball and go down. I always find it interesting how people can never seem to realize that the line can look good and give time on a lot of plays in the game, but also completely whiff a block and give up an immediate sack on others.

It's something that became apparent for me as a Steelers fan with Ben's tendency to hold the ball. The last time PFF charted time to throw/time to sack, Ben had a high time to throw because of him holding the ball and trying to extend plays, but a really low time to sack, because the actual sacks happened mostly on plays where a lineman was immediately beat or the RB didn't pick up the blitzer and Ben took a hit a second after the snap.


I kept a "free blitzer" tracker and had 4 all day. 1 was a miss by probably Bohanon. 3 were just blitzers unaccounted for. Of the 5 "missed" blocks or "whiffs" at least 3 of them were entirely not Geno's fault. The other two, he could have gotten the ball out earlier but it doesn't mean they weren't missed blocks.

I'll take my un-professional yet obsessive close eye over NFL.com writers who may or may not have watched the game with even close to as much detail as I did. They might know more about the game than me, but they're also covering a lot more than one team... and they're also getting paid to say things that make headlines.
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